The Science is Settled

[SNiC Jet]

Also, I lived in south Florida during the record breaking 2005 hurricane season and evacuated for Wilma,Dennis,and Katrina.

Well goodie for me!...I travel to and through Huntsville on a regular basis.....so....I guess that qualifies me a "Rocket Scientist"

 

[TripleB]

What part of the country do you live in? The part experiencing more and larger hurricanes than any time in human history? How about the part experiencing decade long drought and devastating wildfires. Maybe up north where the glaciers are gone and coastal villages are falling into the ocean. “What happens” is already happening while you bury your head in the sand and ignore it. Your kids will pay for your mistakes.

Thank you for your reply.
Also, I lived in south Florida during the record breaking 2005 hurricane season and evacuated for Wilma,Dennis,and Katrina. Good night.

Im still waiting on hard data or facts to back the more and larger statement please

 

[wallnutz]

Im still waiting on hard data or facts to back the more and larger statement please

His Propaganda machine is working overtime, Be patient.

 

[Old Texan]

Jesus! mother mary of god, for the love all things sacred and holy.....WHY??????

Because this pompous, condescending ol' troll has talked shit for months now. And saying he has published some kind of paper has put him in the position to either show it, or shut the fuck up and go away.

Papaw to me has painted himself in a corner, and I want to see proof. If he doesn't or won't, it proves he's nothing but a pompous shit stirring troll.

I say he won't because he can't. He has given no real indication of what he does, where he's from, or if he is anything but a troll. I don't need personal specifics, just something that he's a real individual, not the internet troll he comes across to be.

Challenge the old or young fuck. The time has come with that huge paragraph of bullshit....I think he's a coward and won't show. He'll just blather on about his great brain and continue to post C&P horseshit.

C'mon out from behind the curtain ya old fraud. Bet yer ass won't.....

 

[Old Texan]

Im still waiting on hard data or facts to back the more and larger statement please

Your wait will be a long one is my opinion. He's made claims over and over, yet has avoided answering every time.....

 

[SNiC Jet]

His Propaganda machine is working overtime, Be patient.

Another words....he is on "the can" trying to figure it out his next move

 

[RVR SWPR]

Im still waiting on hard data or facts to back the more and larger statement please

You gotta long wait Triple.Every Village has their Idiot,GMac is our Idiot,usually contained in one thread.Never the Lounge.When you have time check out HIS "IMPEACHEMENT THREAD" in this forum.In no way is Gmac a reflection of either side of the aisle in this forum.
You are more familiar with well grounded input.Your "Midwest Post Thread" has been a great read.

 

[was thatguy]

Here’s a little tidbit from the worlds greatest atheist, 9 year old Young Sheldon.
It’s well worth the 4 minutes.
I should preface it with the run down of the situation. Sheldon’s God Fearing mom, Mary, is having a significant crisis of faith after one of her best friends 16 year old daughter was killed in a car wreck. She is struggling to reconcile how God could allow that. It’s a situation that many of us have and are going through.

From the mouths of babes...(and writers!)

 

[Grandpa mac]

W

Maybe Venus is warmer then Mars because it closer to the sun?

Why is Venus also hotter than Mercury?

 

[was thatguy]

They will all be incinerated at some point, as will Earth.

 

[Grandpa mac]

Im still waiting on hard data or facts to back the more and larger statement please

Here’s a link to facts and data about the 2005 hurricane season. Please note the numerous “worst on record” type events described.
https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/2005-hurricane-season-by-the-numbers

 

[Grandpa mac]

They will all be incinerated at some point, as will Earth.

Is that really the point? I don’t give a fuck about what happens two billion years from now. My concern is for about the next two generations and the people I love.

 

[Grandpa mac]

Dear Sir,
The above post, (#191) although written by a man who published his own thesis can't seem to break up a paragraph. The string of drool that emits from this asshole is pure diarrhea. The good news is, this is all entertainment.

Saved for eloquence.

Hey check it out! Jefferson didn’t break the Declaration of Independence up into paragraphs. The string of drool from that asshole is pure diarrhea!

What a thoughtful criticism.

 

[Grandpa mac]

Well goodie for me!...I travel to and through Huntsville on a regular basis.....so....I guess that qualifies me a "Rocket Scientist"

Perhaps you noted I was specifically asked where I lived and about my familiarity with hurricanes?

 

[TripleB]

W

Why is Venus also hotter than Mercury?

Venus has more SUV owners?

 

[Grandpa mac]

Ok, let me take a crack at this, Ive read your posts, had a couple beverages but will take a crack at it. First I dont name call only facts, a littl e back ground Im a mechanical engineer 1982 from Milwaukee School of Engineering, lets pick a year 2007?

Now please follow along and if you disagree with any of my facts please state sources

Lets start

The total "weight" of the earth's atmosphere is 5148.0 teratons.
That's 5148 X 10^12 tons.
=5148000000000000 tons

Got that? its a given

The world produced 27245758000 tons of industrial "greenhouse" (cute catchphrase for water vapor, carbon dioxide, methane, and ozone - but they really only mean Carbon dioxide [goes along with carbon credit]) gases in 2007.

This amounts to a whopping 0.000529% of the atmosphere.

Now, the historic average (over the eons) of CO2 in the atmosphere is 0.0396% (Today it’s 0.0384%). The startling thing about this is that it's higher than the present CO2 concentration - It's lower today than the historic average!!! Wow...who'd have thought?

We're supposedly adding to the existing CO2 concentration at a rate of 0.00143%. (that’s a ratio of one-thousandth per year). That can’t be good, right?. Why? Well, damn it, it just doesn’t seem or feel like it could be good – well, golly it CAN’T be good. So it must be bad!

Funny, thing is that we absolutely need some of those “greenhouse” gases. These gases in the atmosphere both absorb and emit radiation within the thermal infrared range. Greenhouse gases are essential to maintaining the current temperature of the Earth; without them this planet would be so cold as to be uninhabitable.

Hmmm...which brings us to a good point. We've supposed to have created these greenhouse gases, right?...so?...we're making more atmosphere? There’s more of it, so it's getting heavier right? Is barometric pressure continuing to rise due to this?.....not really. The chemical makeup of the planet is essentially self-balancing (so are those of the other planets of the solar system, but let's ignore that, too), and will precipitate the imbalances. The vast seas of plankton and our forests help to eliminate the rest by way of photosynthesis. This process has occurred and recurred thousandths of times over eons.

There's also this pesky little thing called conservation of mass and energy; it essentially states that matter and energy cannot be created, nor destroyed, only transferred and transformed. We don't create any of these things, only change them (and then they change back). This carbon has always been here, and always will. It moves and transforms, and the amount that we change it is completely insignificant with regards to this essentially pseudo isotropic system as a whole.

The biggest shocker of all, is that 6 billion humans, and nearly ¼ of that number of livestock on this planet creates more “greenhouse” gas than the burning of fossil fuel.

Beware the scaremongers and idiots telling you otherwise. Better yet, look who's getting rich of the illegitimate premise of global warming, and you'll quickly find your fraud.

Since CO2 has always been a trace gas in the atmosphere relative to things like nitrogen, let’s talk in terms of change in parts per million.

“Concentrations of CO2 in the atmosphere were as high as 4,000 parts per million (ppm) during the Cambrian period about 500 million years ago to as low as 180 ppm during the Quaternary glaciation of the last two million years.[1] Estimates based on reconstructed temperature records suggests that the amount of CO2 during the last 420 million years ago was with ~2000 ppm highest during the Devonian (∼400 Myrs ago) and Triassic (220–200 Myrs ago), with a few maximum estimates ranging up to ∼3,700±1,600 ppm (215 Myrs ago).[2] Global annual mean CO2 concentration has increased by more than 45% since the start of the Industrial Revolution, from 280 ppm during the 10,000 years up to the mid-18th century[3]to 410 ppm as of mid-2018.[3][4] The present concentration is the highest in the last 800,000[5]and possibly even the last 20 million years.[6]”

1. Eggleton, Tony (2013). A Short Introduction to Climate Change. Cambridge University Press. p. 52. ISBN 9781107618763

2 ^ Foster GL, Royer DL, Lunt DJ (2017). "Future climate forcing potentially without precedent in the last 420 million years". Nature Communications. 8: 14845. Bibcode:2017NatCo...814845F. doi:10.1038/ncomms14845. PMC 5382278. PMID 28375201.

3 a b "Trends in Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide". Earth System Research Laboratory. NOAA.

4 Dlugokencky, E. (5 February 2016). "Annual Mean Carbon Dioxide Data". Earth System Research Laboratory. NOAA. Retrieved 12 February 2016.

5. a b Amos, J. (4 September 2006). "Deep ice tells long climate story". BBC News. Retrieved 28 April 2010.

6 a b c Climate Change 2001: The Scientific Basis

 

[Grandpa mac]

Perhaps you’re also familiar with the maps of Florida’s coastline during the last warm period.

 

[TripleB]

Here’s a link to facts and data about the 2005 hurricane season. Please note the numerous “worst on record” type events described.
https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/2005-hurricane-season-by-the-numbers

Going by your theory, (Im assuming its your belief) that global warming is causing more hurricanes, and global warming is getting worse, then it would stand to reason that the top 10 "worst on record" years would all be in the last 10 years? What happened in 2013? I think that was one of the slowest for hurricanes?

Looking at the "ACE" data for top 10 years, the 21st century only has 2? Yes 2005 being number 1, but then again how do you explain 1893 being number 3?

Maybe, just Maybe man can not predict weather with any real accuracy?

Please not that I dont cut and paste but look up data and explain what I find

 

[TripleB]

Since CO2 has always been a trace gas in the atmosphere relative to things like nitrogen, let’s talk in terms of change in parts per million.

“Concentrations of CO2 in the atmosphere were as high as 4,000(ppm) about 500 million years ago

410 ppm as of mid-2018.

Using YOUR data you just proved that CO2 levels were higher before man by a factor of 10, or am I reading your data incorrectly?

 

[TripleB]

Perhaps you’re also familiar with the maps of Florida’s coastline during the last warm period.

You mean 120,000 years ago, BEFORE we started the industrial revolution?

 

[Grandpa mac]

Venus has more SUV owners?

No, but a very CO2 rich atmosphere which lead to global warming which boiled off all the water on the planet, putting more greenhouse water vapor in the atmosphere and taking Venus down a path of runaway warming.

Venus’s closest approach to the sun is 106 million miles while Mercury’s is less than half at 46 million miles. Yet here are there temperatures. remember Mercury has no atmosphere and is locked in orbit around sun so that one side is always lit and hot while the other side is dark and cold. Venus is uniformly hot all over and its uniform temp equals the temperature ectreme on the sunny side of Mercury.
Mercury - 275 °F (dark hemisphere) to + 840 °F (light hemisphere); average +283 F
Venus 870 °F all over

 

[spectra3279]

Using YOUR data you just proved that CO2 levels were higher before man by a factor of 10, or am I reading your data incorrectly?

Still no paper. But lots of links to garbage science.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[Grandpa mac]

Using YOUR data you just proved that CO2 levels were higher before man by a factor of 10, or am I reading your data incorrectly?

Yes, at times in the Earth’s history that was true. And during those times all polar ice melted submerging your home and about half of America under an ocean. Virtually none of the species alive on Earth today (including all of our agricultural species) could not survive the incredibly hot temps of those times. And sure, that means new species would evolve but we are changing the atmosphere and temp of the planet at a rate far faster than geological or evolutionary processes. Most life would not keep up and we are looking at an extinction rate on par with the other five known mass extinctions when 90% or more of all species disappeared- think in terms of another planet killing asteroid (which also led to abrupt massive climate change).

 

[Grandpa mac]

The CO2 might AGAIN rise through purely natural processes and with it the Earths temperature. But we KNOW that the biggest NEW contributor to atmospheric CO2 today versus 200 years ago is human combustion of fossil fuels. So THIS TIME we are CHOSING to do it to ourselves and we are doing it at a pace far faster than past geological events (excluding aforementioned asteroid impacts).

 

[Grandpa mac]

Incidentally research like this on the complex effects of events like the Dino killing asteroid 65mya are pretty interesting reading.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.space.com/40690-dino-killing-asteroid-impact-warmed-earth.html

 

[Grandpa mac]

Still no paper. But lots of links to garbage science.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

You’re going to define any science which you disagree with on idealogical grounds as “junk science”, without ever reading it or comprehending it- so I think I’m just going to put you on mute until you decide to have an adult conversation like TripleB.

 

[spectra3279]

Oh I've worked with some of their climate models at northrup. Their models aren't very scientific.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[Grandpa mac]

Because this pompous, condescending ol' troll has talked shit for months now. And saying he has published some kind of paper has put him in the position to either show it, or shut the fuck up and go away.

Papaw to me has painted himself in a corner, and I want to see proof. If he doesn't or won't, it proves he's nothing but a pompous shit stirring troll.

I say he won't because he can't. He has given no real indication of what he does, where he's from, or if he is anything but a troll. I don't need personal specifics, just something that he's a real individual, not the internet troll he comes across to be.

Challenge the old or young fuck. The time has come with that huge paragraph of bullshit....I think he's a coward and won't show. He'll just blather on about his great brain and continue to post C&P horseshit.

C'mon out from behind the curtain ya old fraud. Bet yer ass won't.....

My thesis was not about climate change. It was about the ecology and behavior of ravens in coastal Alaska. I did not mention it to establish climate bona fides and I am not a climate expert. I am however scientifically literate. I understand how to read science and I understand both the process of gathering data and analyzing it in a defensible way.

 

[RVR SWPR]

"Plagiarism is the wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work. Plagiarism is considered academic dishonesty and a breach of journalistic ethics."

 

[Grandpa mac]

Oh I've worked with some of their climate models at northrup. Their models aren't very scientific.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

Do tell.

 

[Grandpa mac]

Going by your theory, (Im assuming its your belief) that global warming is causing more hurricanes, and global warming is getting worse, then it would stand to reason that the top 10 "worst on record" years would all be in the last 10 years? What happened in 2013? I think that was one of the slowest for hurricanes?

Looking at the "ACE" data for top 10 years, the 21st century only has 2? Yes 2005 being number 1, but then again how do you explain 1893 being number 3?

Maybe, just Maybe man can not predict weather with any real accuracy?

Please not that I dont cut and paste but look up data and explain what I find

I think you’re smart enough to understand that trend lines still have dips and spikes but that it is the long term trend which really matters.

 

[Grandpa mac]

You mean 120,000 years ago, BEFORE we started the industrial revolution?

Yes, again humans are not responsible for every warm period in the Earths history. We are responsible for this one. I know that is a distinction most here won’t be able to accept, but NASA, NOAA, the Pentagon, and Exxon all accept it and I’m inclined to listen to the experts.

 

[was thatguy]

Is that really the point? I don’t give a fuck about what happens two billion years from now. My concern is for about the next two generations and the people I love.

I get that, but how can you then ignore (and even promote) the more immediate problems that will affect your (and mine) kids and grandkids?
Things like the financial and social burdens saddled on them by illegal hordes for starters?

It seems like an unprioritized agenda that you are pursuing.
Save the planet, yet destroy the Country?

 

[wallnutz]

I get that, but how can you then ignore (and even promote) the more immediate problems that will affect your (and mine) kids and grandkids?
Things like the financial and social burdens saddled on them by illegal hordes for starters?

It seems like an unprioritized agenda that you are pursuing.
Save the planet, yet destroy the Country?

He can't see the forest for the trees.

 

[Grandpa mac]

"Plagiarism is the wrongful appropriation" and "stealing and publication" of another author's "language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions" and the representation of them as one's own original work. Plagiarism is considered academic dishonesty and a breach of journalistic ethics."

You also understand that in the world of science it is routine, no mandatory, to review and cite all the other relevant reasearch? I presume you saw the six primary citations included at the end of my post, correct? No I did not write the summary paragraph- it is Wikipedia which I know you all disdain. However, as I said the original literature is all cited for anybody who cares to go beyond the summary.

Having established this bar for proper intellectual property rights, the onus is now on you to cite the author of any material you quote as well as photographer of all your pics. I’m sure you won’t be at all hypocritical.

 

[Grandpa mac]

I get that, but how can you then ignore (and even promote) the more immediate problems that will affect your (and mine) kids and grandkids?
Things like the financial and social burdens saddled on them by illegal hordes for starters?

It seems like an unprioritized agenda that you are pursuing.
Save the planet, yet destroy the Country?

I am DEEPLY concerned about America’s fiscal future but don’t see undocumented aliens as the problem. In fact industry welcomes them because they provide the cheap labor which our service, agriculture, and other industries rely on. I am far more concerned that nearly one out of every two dollars in Federal taxes collected goes to fund some aspect of our military industrial complex. You familiar with Dwight Eisenhower’s parting words? That was a Republican who spoke the truth. I’m also concerned that the very richest among us, people like Trump, have found ways to game our broken tax system to avoid paying a fair share. Responsibly reduce military spending (not abrupt decisions to rip troops out of ongoing conflicts) and demand that those who have benefitted from our system to the tune of hundreds of millions or billions of dollars pay accordingly, and it will outweigh immigrant dollars 100:1.

 

[SNiC Jet]

He can't see the forest for the trees.

Speaking of forest and trees....as a precaution, make sure you....

 

[Grandpa mac]

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/research/economics-and-policy-illegal-immigration-united-states

 

[Grandpa mac]

View attachment 715480

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

 

[TripleB]

Yes, again humans are not responsible for every warm period in the Earths history. We are responsible for this one. I know that is a distinction most here won’t be able to accept, but NASA, NOAA, the Pentagon, and Exxon all accept it and I’m inclined to listen to the experts.

Official NASA global temperature data showed that from Feb 2016 to Feb 2018 the average global temperture dropped by .56 degrees Celsius, so now we're cooling?

 

[Old Texan]

My thesis was not about climate change. It was about the ecology and behavior of ravens in coastal Alaska. I did not mention it to establish climate bona fides and I am not a climate expert. I am however scientifically literate. I understand how to read science and I understand both the process of gathering data and analyzing it in a defensible way.

Just as I predicted, you won't produce that which you refer to in making your point. Regardless of the topic, you alluded to the thesis being about the topic and used it to support your point. When called out, you recant and won't produce a thing except more bullshit. Without proof, I doubt there ever was a thesis.

You're a fraud and a troll, pure and simple. And by no producing, an outright liar. I can accept your bullshit to a point, but it's pathetic how you place yourself in a self serving position of being more caring and knowledgeable than others based on nothing but arrogance. Your condescending tone is like fingernails on a chalkboard.

You perfesser, are a phony. You've been called out and as is typical of your rhetoric, you've proven unreliable to your claims.

"I am however JUNK scientifically literate....."----PapawMac

 

[SNiC Jet]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.”

― Mark Twain

 

[spectra3279]

Do tell.

We used the exact same models with the same models for the hot and cold chambers for testing the satalite components. They were so fucked up we had to switch back to the really old models. We were testing what a low earth orbit would subject the components to.

When the models are built and designed with a specific outcome instead of giving the parameters to and letting the model run to see where they go. If you were testing to see what it would take to reach the predetermined outcome then fine. Bit they are doing this to back their data. It doesn't work that way.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[SNiC Jet]

We used the exact same models with the same models for the hot and cold chambers for testing the satalite components. They were so fucked up we had to switch back to the really old models. We were testing what a low earth orbit would subject the components to.

When the models are built and designed with a specific outcome instead of giving the parameters to and letting the model run to see where they go. If you were testing to see what it would take to reach the predetermined outcome then fine. Bit they are doing this to back their data. It doesn't work that way.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

See post #242

 

[spectra3279]

See post #242

Good point

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[spectra3279]

Yes, at times in the Earth’s history that was true. And during those times all polar ice melted submerging your home and about half of America under an ocean. Virtually none of the species alive on Earth today (including all of our agricultural species) could not survive the incredibly hot temps of those times. And sure, that means new species would evolve but we are changing the atmosphere and temp of the planet at a rate far faster than geological or evolutionary processes. Most life would not keep up and we are looking at an extinction rate on par with the other five known mass extinctions when 90% or more of all species disappeared- think in terms of another planet killing asteroid (which also led to abrupt massive climate change).

Bullshit one volcano does more than man has done in the last hundred years. How many volcano eruptions have there been in the last hundred years

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[spectra3279]

Official NASA global temperature data showed that from Feb 2016 to Feb 2018 the average global temperture dropped by .56 degrees Celsius, so now we're cooling?

Why was all the actual laser data from nasa tossed out from any of their climate models? That data never is more acurate than any of the heat sink data they are relying on for these models.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

 

[TripleB]

As long as we are cutting and pasting here you go

 

[RVR SWPR]

You also understand that in the world of science it is routine, no mandatory, to review and cite all the other relevant reasearch? I presume you saw the six primary citations included at the end of my post, correct? No I did not write the summary paragraph- it is Wikipedia which I know you all disdain. However, as I said the original literature is all cited for anybody who cares to go beyond the summary.

Having established this bar for proper intellectual property rights, the onus is now on you to cite the author of any material you quote as well as photographer of all your pics. I’m sure you won’t be at all hypocritical.

Again,Stop with the "Telling people what they must post."I consider every post you put up in this thread as nothing more than Junk Mail.Also,earlier informed you i personally every month contribute more to our environment in positive solutions than you will in a lifetime.Quite a performance you have put on here.WTF

 

[SNiC Jet]

My thesis was not about climate change. It was about the ecology and behavior of ravens in coastal Alaska.

Was your Mom proud and did you receive a passing grade?