Parkland, Florida shooting

[Outdrive1]

Shelby High School, Indiana ---- http://fox59.com/2014/09/08/exclusi...utionary-security-system-to-thwart-shootings/

View attachment 621574

I like this. [emoji106]


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[TCHB]

I don't know where you grew up, but I had a shotgun and a 30-30 in my truck at school in my gun rack. Lots of kids did. There has been 300 million guns in the USA for decades. The only difference now is that if anyone in my day picked up a gun in anger, you might not ever see them again, as their Dad might fucking bury them in the back yard for breaking the #1 Cardinal Rule of gun ownership passed down properly.

No guns in parking lot or in cars. If they did we never saw them. People kept them in locked glass gun cases to show.
Yes all of us kids knew how to open and play with them. Not good but we did.
Norwalk Ca.
Today I am sure it is a whole new game.

 

[t&y]

You and I, I trust. I said I wasn’t against it in theory. It’s not going to be as easy as handing out sawed off shotguns with the teachers curriculum every year. It’s going to cost big money to train and vet these teachers. Money that might be better spent on other alternatives.


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That is where you need people in place to allocate the tools needed. Federal Grant Money is out there in the millions. What is one of those arguments about police agency's??? Oh yeah, you look militarized and get military surplus equipment. Well, if you stop and think for a second (not YOU, just people in general) agency's go the surplus route because they don't have the funds for the gentle looking viewer friendly type stuff.... ANNDDDDDD the military stuff is already proven.

Nobody is saying there is an easy solution. But sitting on our hands because people might get hurt at a mass shooting is going to do nothing to fix any part of the problem.

Shotgun, Pistol, or AR... I'll take the AR/M4/FN anyday. Accurate, has the capacity to aggress the threat multiple times if needed, and is the most stable shooting platform out of the three mentioned. My duty AR ammo will travel less through walls then my duty 9mm. It's about knowing the tools to use, not just blindly handing shit out.

Do I think we need a teacher standing there with a AR slung over their shoulder. Nope, but readily accessible from a secure location in the classroom would work. Do I think in my lifetime I will see teachers with AR's issued to the in the classroom... Probably not, but something other than nothing is my goal.

 

[t&y]

No guns in parking lot or in cars. If they did we never saw them. People kept them in locked glass gun cases to show.
Yes all of us kids knew how to open and play with them. Not good but we did.
Norwalk Ca.
Today I am sure it is a whole new game.

I like part of your statement here. I think it's great that you knew how to access them, but when you bring up play... I kinda cringe. I am the guy that cleans all of my guns... well it's only one and it's a muzzle loader with a sealed barrel that can never fire... at random times in front of my kids while we are just hanging out watching TV. Any questions they ask about them I answer, then show them the gun and how it works. Does that sound pretty much like what a parent should do in regards to teaching their kids about anything in life? With the exception of banging the wife in front of them I'd say yeah, it's my responsibility to teach them about guns and how to safely handle and use them.

 

[RodnJen]

Shelby High School, Indiana ---- http://fox59.com/2014/09/08/exclusi...utionary-security-system-to-thwart-shootings/

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Good plan but would only work for a fraction of the schools. Most of the schools in CA were built in the ‘60’s and 70’s with walls of glass and open campus’s.

 

[Constant840]

^^^Another good reason to vote for local and state school bonds.

 

[Taboma]

Good plan but would only work for a fraction of the schools. Most of the schools in CA were built in the ‘60’s and 70’s with walls of glass and open campus’s.

Does this mean you have a solution that works equally well at all schools ?

 

[Outdrive1]

That is where you need people in place to allocate the tools needed. Federal Grant Money is out there in the millions. What is one of those arguments about police agency's??? Oh yeah, you look militarized and get military surplus equipment. Well, if you stop and think for a second (not YOU, just people in general) agency's go the surplus route becasue they don't have the funds for the gentle looking viewer friendly type stuff.... ANNDDDDDD the military stuff is already proven.

Nobody is saying there is an easy solution. But sitting on our hands because people might get hurt at a mass shooting is going to do nothing to fix any part of the problem.

Shotgun, Pistol, or AR... I'll take the AR/M4/FN anyday. Accurate, has the capacity to aggress the threat multiple times if needed, and is the most stable shooting platform out of the three mentioned. My duty AR ammo will travel less through walls then my duty 9mm. It's about knowing the tools to use, not just blindly handing shit out.

Do I think we need a teacher standing there with a AR slung over their shoulder. Nope, but readily accessible from a secure location in the classroom would work. Do I think in my lifetime I will see teachers with AR's issued to the in the classroom... Probably not, but something other than nothing is my goal.

I’m all for it as long as there is some program with real training and some kind of psychological background test. Maybe a physical ability test too. Like you have to pass in the military, I’m not sure what you guys have to pass.


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[Cdog]

I like part of your statement here. I think it's great that you knew how to access them, but when you bring up play... I kinda cringe. I am the guy that cleans all of my guns... well it's only one and it's a muzzle loader with a sealed barrel that can never fire... at random times in front of my kids while we are just hanging out watching TV. Any questions they ask about them I answer, then show them the gun and how it works. Does that sound pretty much like what a parent should do in regards to teaching their kids about anything in life? With the exception of banging the wife in front of them I'd say yeah, it's my responsibility to teach them about guns and how to safely handle and use them.

If sex education makes for safer sex couldn’t the same be said for the 2nd amendment/gun education?

For too long the “I don't like guns” crowd has made the whole thing taboo. That’s created a lot of ignorance and lack of respect for what they can do both good and bad.

 

[RiverDave]

Does this mean you have a solution that works equally well at all schools ?

I have put the solution twice in this thread..

 

[stevesdcb]

Absolutely terrible event for sure. A few comments/opinions based on training & experience.

These active school shooters often fit a certain profile:
Male
Socially don't fit in, outcasts, seeking some kind of respect
Bullied
Lack of love, structure, & consequences in the home
Spend countless hours playing violent video games honing & desensitizing their skills at killing

I agree a lot with the opinions of Flyingbowtie.
A lot of parents are not: responsible, paying attention, providing love, structure, consequences, or
socially sound morals. A breakdown of our social infrastructure

Social Media is a HUGE influence these days. How often have we observed, on some sort of social media, adults rioting, throwing rocks & bottles, grown women in the streets wearing Vagina hats and yelling death to a certain politician. Kids these days LIVE on social media, see it, & are influenced by it.

Not always, but the answer to preventing a lot of criminal behavior is parents teaching sound morals & being 100% responsible for their children at all times. Asking the government to step in & take guns away is NOT the answer.

I kinda like that idea of everybody, women included, doing a minimal 2 years military obligation. It won't take place for poor parenting but I think it would help instill some sort of structure, consequences, & morals into a society that is currently displaying some warning signs of getting out of control.

 

[j21black]

I’m going to use “fuckstick” in a sentance today. Thank you.

I prefer "FuckTard" but to each his own.

 

[Taboma]

I have put the solution twice in this thread..

I believe you've suggested several solutions. Mandatory military service (Although I wasn't clear for whom -- teachers or students and not sure how that addresses an armed 15 year old ?). Armed staff, spread out campuses. In principle I don't disagree.
I was addressing what you'd quoted to Rod & Jen, as I thought I'd read yesterday that he had "A" or "His" plan, but don't recall him sharing it in detail. Perhaps I missed the singular "The Solution" you referenced. But having served my country, I can certainly say, not all I served with would I want protecting my grandchild or even being around him. Since my daughter is a teacher, I'm reading this with great interest.

 

[coolchange]

Absolutely terrible event for sure. A few comments/opinions based on training & experience.

These active school shooters often fit a certain profile:
Male
Socially don't fit in, outcasts, seeking some kind of respect
Bullied
Lack of love, structure, & consequences in the home
Spend countless hours playing violent video games honing & desensitizing their skills at killing
On some type of ssri or other drug


I

Fixed it for ya.

 

[boatdoc55]

Let’s add the facts now. It was not a EO, it was a bill (HJ Res 40) passed by the house and congress then signed by the president. It was finalized in December 2016 and signed in Feb 2017 and added people receiving Social Security checks for mental illnesses and people deemed unfit to handle their own financial affairs to the national background check database (estimate was 75k people in total). It excluded all other mental health risks and Trumps has stated a new bill is needed that address other mental risk factors.

Don't bring the truth into this, it will upset the narrative of the liberal loons on this site!!!

 

[RiverDave]

I believe you've suggested several solutions. Mandatory military service (Although I wasn't clear for whom -- teachers or students and not sure how that addresses an armed 15 year old ?). Armed staff, spread out campuses. In principle I don't disagree.
I was addressing what you'd quoted to Rod & Jen, as I thought I'd read yesterday that he had "A" or "His" plan, but don't recall him sharing it in detail. Perhaps I missed the singular "The Solution" you referenced. But having served my country, I can certainly say, not all I served with would I want protecting my grandchild or even being around him. Since my daughter is a teacher, I'm reading this with great interest.

Only put up one solution to minimize casualties on campus and that is to take Military recruitment centers out of strip malls, and place them into the Schools. It's a "concept" which obviously would require some dial in (specialized training for those manning the post etc..)

If that is done, the tax payers save money on rent from multiple recruitment centers. The military recruitment centers get to be placed right in front of their target audience. By definition with a small armory the school gets free armed security, with people that are familiar with the campus and faces daily. To the point I was making with RodnJen it also provides an equal or greater show of Force then some kid with a gun.

The 2 year mandatory military deal would be good for society as a whole, even if it would put a lot of peoples lives on hold for those two years. It would be good for the country / society / etc.. That isn't a solution to the school shooting problem, but would certainly help it via trickle down effect.

RD

 

[Outdrive1]

Only put up one solution to minimize casualties on campus and that is to take Military recruitment centers out of strip malls, and place them into the Schools. It's a "concept" which obviously would require some dial in (specialized training for those manning the post etc..)

If that is done, the tax payers save money on rent from multiple recruitment centers. The military recruitment centers get to be placed right in front of their target audience. By definition with a small armory the school gets free armed security, with people that are familiar with the campus and faces daily. To the point I was making with RodnJen it also provides an equal or greater show of Force then some kid with a gun.

The 2 year mandatory military deal would be good for society as a whole, even if it would put a lot of peoples lives on hold for those two years. It would be good for the country / society / etc.. That isn't a solution to the school shooting problem, but would certainly help it via trickle down effect.

RD

Lol. I don’t think the military is allowed the police US citizens.

The National Guard is but there are strict rules against using deadly force against US citizens. They would never be authorized to use deadly force.

They would never arm a recruiter. They would never give live rounds to them either. They guard nuclear facilities and they don’t get live rounds.


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[RiverDave]

Lol. I don’t think the military is allowed the police US citizens.

The National Guard is but there are strict rules against using deadly force against US citizens. They would never be authorized to use deadly force.

They would never arm a recruiter. They would never give live rounds to them either. They guard nuclear facilities and they don’t get live rounds.


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They aren’t there to police the campus. That is the staffs job / police departments job. They are there for when an act of domestic terrorism occurs, to immediately respond..

Again it’s a concept and there needs to be some dial in, but overall as a concept it works.

The thing you are referring to is Posse Comitatus, which limits military action on US soil etc, and is certainly one of the things that would need to be addressed in initiating the concept but it isn’t something that isn’t impossible to overcome.


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[Taboma]

Lol. I don’t think the military is allowed the police US citizens.

The National Guard is but there are strict rules against using deadly force against US citizens. They would never be authorized to use deadly force.

They would never arm a recruiter. They would never give live rounds to them either. They guard nuclear facilities and they don’t get live rounds.


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Yes, the military is famous for sending us off to guard something with no actual means of guarding it, other than using an empty rifle as a bat, or fists. I recall getting seriously chastised for fixing a bayonet to an empty rifle to guard a building AFTER the terrorists had used a real bomb to blow the front off of it.

 

[RodnJen]

Does this mean you have a solution that works equally well at all schools ?

No, that’s just it, it will take a number on on-site and behavior monitoring changes to create change.

 

[TCHB]

I like part of your statement here. I think it's great that you knew how to access them, but when you bring up play... I kinda cringe. I am the guy that cleans all of my guns... well it's only one and it's a muzzle loader with a sealed barrel that can never fire... at random times in front of my kids while we are just hanging out watching TV. Any questions they ask about them I answer, then show them the gun and how it works. Does that sound pretty much like what a parent should do in regards to teaching their kids about anything in life? With the exception of banging the wife in front of them I'd say yeah, it's my responsibility to teach them about guns and how to safely handle and use them.

In our group their was the tough guy that pushed his way into anything he wanted. The kids house that had the guns was kind of shy guy that would not stand up to anyone let alone the big tough guy. Yes we played with them while both parents were working. I look back and think about the crazy things we did. We even took the 22 shorts and would put them on the garage floor and hit them with a hammer. After we were done playing with guns we would ride our mini bikes around town. No clutch just straight chain to the engine.

 

[GRADS]

The solution.

 

[RitcheyRch]

 

[RiverDave]

In our group their was the tough guy that pushed his way into anything he wanted. The kids house that had the guns was kind of shy guy that would not stand up to anyone let alone the big tough guy. Yes we played with them while both parents were working. I look back and think about the crazy things we did. We even took the 22 shorts and would put them on the garage floor and hit them with a hammer. After we were done playing with guns we would ride our mini bikes around town. No clutch just straight chain to the engine.

Had a friend put a 45 shell into a pair of vice grips and whack it with a hammer.. he ended up losing part of a finger in that deal.. lol.

 

[wsuwrhr]

Yes, the military is famous for sending us off to guard something with no actual means of guarding it, other than using an empty rifle as a bat, or fists. I recall getting seriously chastised for fixing a bayonet to an empty rifle to guard a building AFTER the terrorists had used a real bomb to blow the front off of it.

Chastised for the bayonet, or the empty rifle?

 

[spectras only]

Interesting read about mass shooters.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/crimeincanada/would-canadian-gun-laws-have-stopped-america’s-worst-mass-shooters/ar-BBJdg8m

It clearly shows, the system in the US is screwed up big time. How the hell is this slipped by the authorities? Orlando night club shooter > The Sig Sauer .223 and Glock 17 used in the shooting are available in Canada, albeit with reduced magazine capacities. Shooter Omar Mateen also held a Florida Statewide Class G Firearms License for his work as a security guard, which requires attending a safety course. However, Mateen had previously been investigated for connections to terrorism, which in Canada should have sunk his PAL application. It’s also worth noting that Mateen only became a gun owner a week before the attack.​

 

[stevesdcb]

The solution.

View attachment 621619

LMAO,

Criminal behavior is criminal behavior no matter what color it is!

Let's take the greater Sacramento area which you reside in.

You live in Lilly white Folsom, California where the % of people (of color) is almost nothing. You live in an area where many people of color do not have the social economic means to afford to live. You live in an area where there is little criminal activity compared to other areas of Sacramento. I'm going to assume one of the reasons you live in Folsom is because you don't want to live in other areas of Sacramento where violent criminal activity is rampant. Hmmmm, I wonder why? Unfortunately, a lot of the neighborhoods, in Sacramento, that are rampant with criminal activity, are populated with people of color, just the way it is. Not my fault, not your fault.

I grew up & worked in these neighborhoods.

You would be best not to take your butt into the gang/criminal infested neighborhoods of Sacramento where a lot of violent crime occurs, you are the wrong color & you ain't got that kind of swagger.

If some of the "boys from the hood" came up to Folsom, to your house, victimized you & your loved ones, you probably wouldn't be to happy because..........that's why you live up there, so you don't have to be exposed to rampant criminal activity.

Easy to live in Folsom, (in the ivory towers) & preach racial equality.

 

[2Driver]

The solution.

View attachment 621619

Did Rachel Madcow or Joy Behar send that to you.

 

[coolchange]

That Canadian article along with all mainstream media articles are flat-out b*******. They ignore the empirical evidence. But it doesn't fit their agenda. And the fact that they're all big pharma's bitches.
If you do any research on this at all and find out the commonalities, you would see the guns are the symptom, and the cause of the insanity is well insanity

 

[CigAjerk]

Some food for thought from Artemis Defense Institute:

"As you can imagine, we have been inundated over the last 24 hours with emails and phone calls regarding the events that have unfolded in Florida.

Many of our clients have been screaming about the fact that CCW holders were not present to stop the shooter. Many have questioned why, with an SRO (School Resource Officer) present on campus, there was no contact made with the shooter. These are reasonable questions being asked out of anger and frustration.

Others have asked the more prescient question: What can we do?

First, we must acknowledge where we have failed…. and yes… we have failed.

We have failed as parents, and as you know, Sandy and I are devoted parents… to a point.

We have a business… actually multiple businesses… and we are often sitting at the dinner table talking about the events and strategies necessary to run a business; this is often at the exclusion of our daughter. What has happened in her life, and at her school, has too often taken second chair to what Sandy and I want to talk about.

Are there monsters at her school?

Perhaps, but we would never know now, would we?

Many of the students in Florida have reported that they knew that the shooter was a loose cannon ready to go off. How many of their parents knew the same thing?

We, as a society, have abdicated our roles as parents to the worst possible surrogates: ”others”; these take the form of schools, nannies, day care… anyone we can drop our kids off with, and get on with our lives. Then, there are the truly insidious “others”: the Internet and video games. These incubators of anti-social behavior serve limited purpose, and potentially can create the atmosphere necessary for the socially awkward to grow into the socially malignant.

Drugs/narcotics (both legal and illegal), gangs, pornography, malicious violent video games, and the “juvenalization” of adults, while at the same time the “adultification” of juveniles, have all contributed to the toxic environment where a monster can rise up before us. We live in a world where young adults expect to be “taken care of”… and where children have been exposed to, and vicariously participate in, simulated acts of sex and violence that would make a sociologist cringe.

So should trained teachers be allowed to carry concealed on campus?

Perhaps we should ask the mourning parents of Sandy Hook, of Marshall High School, of Belmont High School, and now the parents of Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School.

Arron Feis, an assistant coach and security guard at the school, was killed throwing himself over students in an effort to protect them. His bravery is to be honored. The fact that he was neutered by the State is something to be scorned. How many children throughout the years would be alive today if teachers, themselves, were the armed first responders? How many monsters would have been deterred if they knew their assaults would be thwarted instantly?

We learn from after-action investigations.

The shooter in Florida used our defensive measures against us. He pulled the fire alarm knowing how students would respond.

Lessons must be learned from this.

We must allow for an instant armed response. If that is to be relegated exclusively to armed security in the form of law enforcement constantly present on campus in numbers that are meaningful… so be it. If that means armed teachers… so be it, too. If the individual States are squeamish about letting those to whom we entrust our children have the tools necessary to preserve human life, then we should bypass the States entirely, and have a Federal CCW that preempts State law on where guns can be carried.

Our children, too, must be educated from an early age.

Knowledge of skill at arms is not something that should be gained exclusively as an adult. Gun safety, and gun respect, should be something that every child has upon graduating from elementary school. For some, their interest in firearms will never go beyond that point. For others, they may enjoy a lifetime of recreational shooting. For a small few, they may be the individuals who someday save the lives of others.

The cacophony of those calling for the banning of weapons has hit a crescendo. Of course it has… for blaming an object is far easier then blaming ourselves.

Political correctness has officially evolved into a suicide pact. When we are so hesitant to call out the abnormal, so resistant to judge that which is abhorrent, unless the abhorrence exists outside of our political agenda… we sow the seeds of destruction not just of our society, but when the barbarian arrives at our door… to our own very existence.

We hear that the shooter was bullied.

Perhaps… and perhaps not. Bullying is a social act of violence (and at times a physical one) that creates a zero sum game. Bullies are elevated in what they perceive to be social acceptance… and the direct expense of the outlier who sees their own social status diminished. No one wants to be bullied… and no one wants to know his or her child is bullied. (That is a pain that few parents can endure.) If a child is bullied, those who are charged with protecting children should have a fiduciary duty to rain down pain so hard on the instigator that the very idea of being a bully is fraught with so much risk, that it rarely enters the minds of the tormentors.

But to truly inoculate your children from this, there needs to be a sea of change in our society. It cannot come exclusively from the schools. Though to be sure, the schools can hinder it…. and if they do, they need to be held accountable.

Spend time with your children.

Listen to them.

When they tell you something… anything… that is concerning, report it.

Demand your schools train.

FEMA put out its now famous, “Run, Hide, Fight” protocol.

Demand that the schools practice and prepare for the “Run.”

Demand that the schools practice and prepare for the “Hide.”

Then…. ask them about the “Fight.”

Who is training them on this third critical component? To what types of weapons are teachers and SROs given access? What improvised weapons are the children being educated in? If their answer is silence… as too often it is… petition the school board. If that does not work, join the School Board!

When a politician tells you that the problem is firearms, and the easy access people have to get them, give $100 to his or her political opponent.

The stakes are too great for platitudes and sophomoric answers. We must nurture our children at home to ensure that they have the mental toughness and moral righteousness to grow into the citizens of tomorrow. We must demand that those in whom we entrust our children have the ability, mental resolve, and most of all, the tools necessary to protect them when all other options have been exhausted."

I read that email last night. Steve always has a nice way of putting things.

 

[DrunkenSailor]

Shelby High School, Indiana ---- http://fox59.com/2014/09/08/exclusi...utionary-security-system-to-thwart-shootings/

View attachment 621574

This is where we need to be spending the money. I get that open campuses are harder to protect but live information will save lives. This combined with armed personnel on site be it teachers, LEO, or ROTC staff on campus could save lives when this happens again.

The biggest struggle I have with the topic of protecting schools is the innocence of my children. We are the most powerful country in the world. Some would argue we have advanced socially further than any other civilization in history. There are speed bumps and issues that we still need to work on as there will always be but we are doing pretty good in the grand scheme of things. I shouldn't have to talk to my kids about what to do when someone evil comes to their school and wants to kill them, their friends and their teachers. I have not been able to look into my kids eyes and have this talk with them yet and I have tried. When they look at me with their eyes full of curiosity and hope I can't say the words. They are too innocent and I want them to stay that way for as long as possible. Unfortunately the world isn't a safe place regardless of our advancements and I know that this is a conversation that needs to be had and it could mean the difference of my kids coming home if anything liked this ever happened to them. The talk is going to happen and soon I just wish this was something I could keep them sheltered from for a few more years.

 

[Flying_Lavey]

I’ll throw this out one more time. I’m breaking my own rule even reading these threads as some of the posts infuriate me, even though it is, “just the internet” as I frequently remind myself.

All the laws on the books, nor any the "most progressive” among us will could dream up will cure what ails this nation.

What is wrong with us is what we have allowed ourselves to become. I you are a true student of history you know that the founding fathers assembled the Constitution after the Declaration and followed by the Bill of Rights, based on some assumptions. Assumptions that we, the people, as citizens, would do our part. That we as people, would not falter in our attention to the state of our union, and guard against the creeping tentacles of government, and it’s false promise of goodies..in exchange for nothing…nothing except the very control of our lives. They further hoped that we would not only maintain our level of morality and even grow it…with the tools they left us. Grow it, improve it, and refine it, always looking towards our past, and the past of humanity as a guide to right and wrong. They hoped our sense of community, and yes, religious and spiritual compasses would stand true, and we would avoid falling into the morass we now face.

And we did pretty good for a long time.

However, somewhere along the line, (and we can debate the exact point of tipping elsewhere) we let things slip. We never look past the symptoms of the problem, we always try to fix the symptoms. Never…not once…do many of us nor the leading darlings of the popular folks in government of the day want to face the core of the problem. Doing so would be political suicide for many, because the light would then shine on them… and as long as the focus is on the symptoms those who seek more centralized power can continue their march toward corrupting what is left of the core values of the country.

Therein lies the problem. The problem is us. It is what we have allowed ourselves to become. It is what we have tolerated, what we have allowed to become culturally acceptable.

We no longer demand personal accountability. In fact, government is held accountable for our behavior. We demand it. There used to be a concept called shame. There used to be a concept by where parents were accountable for their personal actions, and the actions of their children whom they were responsible for raising, teaching how to be good citizens, with a moral compass and the sense of responsibility the comes with being a citizen of a Republic like ours. Parents were expected to set an example. Children were expected to follow it.

There were repercussions, culturally and sometimes legally for failing at either duty. Another old fashioned word. Duty. Where is our sense of duty?

It is now fashionable to laugh at those who seek an, “old fashioned” way, touting personal responsibility and accountability.

Those concepts are now laughed at. Becoming a victim, or being offended, and the expectations of today are the direct result of the sea change that came about when we allowed these fundamental shifts to take place. It started long ago. Our education system began failing in the sixties, and by the time my boys were in sports the participation trophy had arrived. Revisionist history was coming into play. I saw it. I fought it. I have yelled about it repeatedly here.

Just 25 years ago a rifle in the visible rack of a pickup in the local high school during deer season wouldn’t create a second glance. Think about that. Not a second glance.

Today, it would be grounds for arrest, probably cause all classes to be dismissed, and a full on media circus fearing the worst…or would they secretly be wishing fervently for the worst to happen?

And yet, 25 years ago, that rifle laid in that rack day in and day out and nothing happened. No one was offended. No one was victimized by its mere presence. People walked by it, plainly visible, and others in other racks in other trucks, every day, and nothing happened. They were not touched. They were not stolen. They were not taken into campus and used to commit murder.

The people who owned them wouldn’t think of it. They couldn’t think of it. They had no concept of it. The students were not afraid of it, the parents knew it the rifle was there and had taught the personal responsibility and accountability that came with owning it. The culture demanded it. The community would accept nothing less, because it was our duty as citizens. We demanded accountability from ourselves, and then from the judicial system when we had someone fail.

It is us, the people who have changed.

And that high school is changed, a ton. The people who run it, the people who pay for it, the community in which they live have changed. The standards…almost all of them, have changed. It has changed because we have let it, and some of us, either knowingly or just buying what the changers are selling have gone along.

Since we allowed ourselves to get this far off course theoretically we should be able to get back on course. Frankly, I don’t think that it will happen. Too many generations have been indoctrinated into the new ways, into believing in government as the source of all the answers, into the new world of victimhood, of the concept that we have a right to never be offended, into the collapse of the culture as being a good thing.

Frankly, I think maps on the internet of areas to avoid in major cities due to human waste on the streets, and the subsequent cry for more government to fix the problem is a sign. Those cities, most run by True Believers, claim to be the great source of enlightenment. Indeed.
Where one deposits such items is apparently the last line of responsibility to fall. I wonder if said Believers are ever offended when they step in the pile of human excrement on the way to work?

Of course, they avoid those areas personally.

Done. Lock the thread and close down the site. This post right here NAILS it!!!

Ive been saying it for quiet a while, the complete and total lack of personal responsibility is the ABSOLUTE CORE REASON FOR THE COLAPSE OF OUR SOCIETY.

It used to be taught that blaming someone else or not accepting your failure was far worse tham the actual action. Now its taught to just point the finger. Those that habe been taught to point the finger are typically the ones that cannot do anything for themselves either.

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[Taboma]

Chastised for the bayonet, or the empty rifle?

The pricks handed me a M16 with an empty mag and a bayonet wet with Cosmoline and wrapped in plastic.
Now go guard this building these terrorists just blew folks up in. After my complaints went ignored, I tore the wrapper off the bayonet, fixed it and went off to patrol. Ran into some fresh out of puberty Lieutenant after my shift, in his best squeaky voice he tore me up "Who ordered you to fix bayonet, blah blah blah ?"

 

[TCHB]

Had a friend put a 45 shell into a pair of vice grips and whack it with a hammer.. he ended up losing part of a finger in that deal.. lol.

We were afraid of anything bigger than a 22 short. We did not even wear safety glasses. Stupid kids!!!!

 

[spectras only]

That Canadian article along with all mainstream media articles are flat-out b*******. They ignore the empirical evidence. But it doesn't fit their agenda. And the fact that they're all big pharma's bitches.

Well, you must know Canada better than the average canadian then. I can tell you one thing, 99% of shootings [ pretty much every day in Vancouver ] is done by gangs and criminals, killing each others, possessing illegally bought guns. It is fact, that is harder to get a gun legally, compared to the US. I always had rifles, but getting a handgun it isn't that easy, let alone walk with one concealed or not. With proper background check, you can have as many as 700 guns like my friend did,lol

 

[welldigger00]

Done. Lock the thread and close down the site. This post right here NAILS it!!!

Ive been saying it for quiet a while, the complete and total lack of personal responsibility is the ABSOLUTE CORE REASON FOR THE COLAPSE OF OUR SOCIETY.

It used to be taught that blaming someone else or not accepting your failure was far worse tham the actual action. Now its taught to just point the finger. Those that habe been taught to point the finger are typically the ones that cannot do anything for themselves either.

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This is the exact thing that myself and my wife have been saying and thinking for 20 years. My friends and family ask how we’ve raised such great kids. It is because we have done exactly as flying bow tie said. This is one well written and well said piece of advice that I will be sending to my parents, and friends as to what I believe is the problem of our times. Bravo to you mr bow tie. You got it dead on.


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[MSum661]

I give it 5 or so years and K - 12 Education will be evolving and rotating in a big way to Virtual Online Classroom's.
Justified and supported by the American tax paying public for LOT'S of reasons.
Sounds far fetched right here...right now, but just watch.
Everything a Public school offers....sports, music, etc., etc. will go private to outside service providers.

I know....it sounds crazy, its coming.

This is where we need to be spending the money. I get that open campuses are harder to protect but live information will save lives. This combined with armed personnel on site be it teachers, LEO, or ROTC staff on campus could save lives when this happens again.

The biggest struggle I have with the topic of protecting schools is the innocence of my children. We are the most powerful country in the world. Some would argue we have advanced socially further than any other civilization in history. There are speed bumps and issues that we still need to work on as there will always be but we are doing pretty good in the grand scheme of things. I shouldn't have to talk to my kids about what to do when someone evil comes to their school and wants to kill them, their friends and their teachers. I have not been able to look into my kids eyes and have this talk with them yet and I have tried. When they look at me with their eyes full of curiosity and hope I can't say the words. They are too innocent and I want them to stay that way for as long as possible. Unfortunately the world isn't a safe place regardless of our advancements and I know that this is a conversation that needs to be had and it could mean the difference of my kids coming home if anything liked this ever happened to them. The talk is going to happen and soon I just wish this was something I could keep them sheltered from for a few more years.

 

[STV_Keith]

Saw this on Facebook today.
“We should arm every teacher!” ?
Those bastards won’t even buy them pencils and printer ink...now they got the budget for Glocks?

The owner of Front Sight in NV said he would provide free training to any teacher authorized to carry in their school. There's half the problem paid for.

 

[GRADS]

LMAO,

Criminal behavior is criminal behavior no matter what color it is!

Let's take the greater Sacramento area which you reside in.

You live in Lilly white Folsom, California where the % of people (of color) is almost nothing. You live in an area where many people of color do not have the social economic means to afford to live. You live in an area where there is little criminal activity compared to other areas of Sacramento. I'm going to assume one of the reasons you live in Folsom is because you don't want to live in other areas of Sacramento where violent criminal activity is rampant. Hmmmm, I wonder why? Unfortunately, a lot of the neighborhoods, in Sacramento, that are rampant with criminal activity, are populated with people of color, just the way it is. Not my fault, not your fault.

I grew up & worked in these neighborhoods.

You would be best not to take your butt into the gang/criminal infested neighborhoods of Sacramento where a lot of violent crime occurs, you are the wrong color & you ain't got that kind of swagger.

If some of the "boys from the hood" came up to Folsom, to your house, victimized you & your loved ones, you probably wouldn't be to happy because..........that's why you live up there, so you don't have to be exposed to rampant criminal activity.

Easy to live in Folsom, (in the ivory towers) & preach racial equality.

I don't live in Folsom.

 

[stevesdcb]

I don't live in Folsom.

Where do you live?

 

[was thatguy]

They aren’t there to police the campus. That is the staffs job / police departments job. They are there for when an act of domestic terrorism occurs, to immediately respond..

Again it’s a concept and there needs to be some dial in, but overall as a concept it works.

The thing you are referring to is Posse Comitatus, which limits military action on US soil etc, and is certainly one of the things that would need to be addressed in initiating the concept but it isn’t something that isn’t impossible to overcome.


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They aren’t reading what you are posting.
A recruitment center is just that, for some reason they are reading it as a military force on campus.

It would be more like a kiosk in a mall.

The backyard of our rented house is up against a JR high school.
There is a Vacaville police unit there in the parking lot every single day during school hours and after school events. The officer is rarely in the car so I have to assume they are in the school at all times.
Seems like a small cost for a deterrent.

 

[Outdrive1]

They aren’t reading what you are posting.
A recruitment center is just that, for some reason they are reading it as a military force on campus.

It would be more like a kiosk in a mall.

The backyard of our rented house is up against a JR high school.
There is a Vacaville police unit there in the parking lot every single day during school hours and after school events. The officer is rarely in the car so I have to assume they are in the school at all times.
Seems like a small cost for a deterrent.

Who’s they? I read it ten times and I think it’s a waste of time. I already gave my reasons why.


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[RodnJen]

They aren’t reading what you are posting.
A recruitment center is just that, for some reason they are reading it as a military force on campus.

It would be more like a kiosk in a mall.

The backyard of our rented house is up against a JR high school.
There is a Vacaville police unit there in the parking lot every single day during school hours and after school events. The officer is rarely in the car so I have to assume they are in the school at all times.
Seems like a small cost for a deterrent.

Just for clarification, RD originally referred to a small armory in the center. That’s more than a kiosk.

 

[Bobby V]

Just for clarification, RD originally referred to a small armory in the center. That’s more than a kiosk.

Just curious. Do they even have guns at recruitment centers? And if so what types of guns.

Edit...Found this link.

https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlik...li5why_cant_military_personnel_carry_guns_at/

 

[Taboma]

Just curious. Do they even have guns at recruitment centers? And if so what types of guns.

Edit...Found this link.

https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlik...li5why_cant_military_personnel_carry_guns_at/

Yeah, here's another one in the Military Times ---- yes and no is the answer.
https://www.militarytimes.com/news/...s-troops-recruiters-can-carry-concealed-guns/

 

[Outdrive1]

If we are going to spend money to move a recruiting center into every school in America and staff them with unarmed soldiers, we would be better off hiring extra cops and stationing them at every school.


Here’s another thought. Campus’s need to be closed to visitors. How are recruitment centers going to recruit people that don’t go to the school? I can’t imagine they are going to be signing up many k-8 graders. So what are these recruiters going to do all day? Patrol the schools without proper police type training and without weapons? The military idea is stupid. This is a police issue, they have the training, the authority, and they properly vet their employees with background checks. Hire more cops to station them at the schools. Implement new types of security with doors that lock from inside classrooms. Closed circuit cameras with a feed to the local police precinct that’s activated when there’s an emergency. Require all visitors to enter at one entrance and have a metal detector. Metal detectors must work, it works for commercial aviation, court houses, and stadiums.


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[nowski]

I heard this on the news last night UFB...

Cruz to offer guilty plea: Defense attorneys for Cruz plan to meet with prosecutors and offer a guilty plea in exchange for life in prison, Broward Public Defender Howard Finkelstein said Friday.

 

[Outdrive1]

I heard this on the news last night UFB...

Cruz to offer guilty plea: Defense attorneys for Cruz plan to meet with prosecutors and offer a guilty plea in exchange for life in prison, Broward Public Defender Howard Finkelstein said Friday.

Fuck that. [emoji1418] He doesn’t deserve to live.


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[WhatExit?]

The solution.

View attachment 621619

So you shared a liberal poster showing a pinhead's view of our world.

What's your solution? You want to ban boats because some boaters have killed?

 

[wsuwrhr]

Yep, string him up with a used rope.

I heard this on the news last night UFB...

Cruz to offer guilty plea: Defense attorneys for Cruz plan to meet with prosecutors and offer a guilty plea in exchange for life in prison, Broward Public Defender Howard Finkelstein said Friday.

Fuck that. [emoji1418] He doesn’t deserve to live.