4 seat speed UTV

[LargeOrangeFont]

No just beholden to hisun

They are building the car to his specs, not the other way around.

You are welcome to buy your own hand built race car as well. Can you do that from Polaris or Can Am?

 

[Boatymcboatface]

They are building the car to his specs, not the other way around.

You are welcome to buy your own hand built race car as well. Can you do that from Polaris or Can Am?

Nope I want a factory produced car like the one in my garage! Where’s the factory built speed car? knowing how the hand built car did in Dakar I’ll pass on that one!

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

If you're asking me...

I know better than to buy a (let's say) a first model release of any new vehicle.

Buying the first edition of a whole new vehicle, period?

That's a huge bag of nope for me.

And if they are asking for my input, all that does is convince me they really don't know what the fuck they are doing.

Normally I wouldn’t buy a first gen anything, but the design of this thing is better than anything else. It’s the safest car on the market, period. The discounted price for getting onboard early makes it a no lose proposition.. then Covid pricing and inflation happened.

They are not asking for input, but have taken some suggestions that have made the cars better. You know this already. Every manufacturer asks for input or does focus groups to figure out what customers want.. Speed just did it on Instagram or at off road shows.

 

[Bpracing1127]

If you're asking me...

I know better than to buy a (let's say) a first model release of any new vehicle.

Buying the first edition of a whole new vehicle, period?

That's a huge bag of nope for me.

And if they are asking for my input, all that does is convince me they really don't know what the fuck they are doing.

To add from a brand new company with ZERO released products to date

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

They are building the car to his specs, not the other way around.

Nope I want a factory produced car like the one in my garage! Where’s the factory built speed car? knowing how the hand built car did in Dakar I’ll pass on that one!

The Dakar car didn’t start because of some rules snafu is what I heard.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

To add from a brand new company with ZERO released products to date

And you’d buy mine in 2 seconds if I offered it to you for what I have in it

 

[Bpracing1127]

And you’d buy mine in 2 seconds if I offered it to you for what I have in it

Yep, I’m just a bench racer

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Yep, I’m just a bench racer

I’m sure my Speed car will be more reliable than my RZR. Like I’ve said from the beginning, Speed has a low bar to hit.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

He didn’t say there were issues that weren’t addressed, he said they have identified improvements and refinements for the next gen cars.

Anyone buying anything knows that the products down the road will be better and faster. It happens with cars, off road toys, phones etc. it does not stop people from buying this years iPhones, new C8 corvettes, Broncos, Pro R RZRs, etc when it is a certainty there will be better, faster models out later.

If you think that is going to diminish demand for these in the fall, you are living in a fantasy.

You had people in this thread whining that RG is trying to make the car too perfect and taking too long, now you are worried the car is not perfect enough and there will be no demand for these in the fall.

You're mixing me up with someone else.
I've never encouraged anyone to whine about anything. Particularly that Speed was trying to make the car too perfect.
I'm also in no way shape or form "worried" that the car is not perfect enough.

Also my recent comments here have NOTHING to do with anyone's position on their purchase of a build spot.

1Carl is trying to sell build spots and the far and away most likely buyer is someone who doesn't currently have their own build spot. They will now be balancing the option of buying for double the money and getting a car Speed has already acknowledged will have improvements made to it in short order.

In short, they can buy a better car for half the money.
All I said is that is a steep hill to climb for 1Carl and his sales.

 

[rivermobster]

To add from a brand new company with ZERO released products to date

That's what I was trying to say. Guess I didn't say it just right.

In five years or so, definite maybe.

 

[dspracing]

So Carl thinks his car #35 will be built on day one or two. My basic mind says it would be a stretch for a production line to roll out 18+ cars/day starting from day one. That’s 5k+ units per year, certainly a stretch based on forecasted numbers I’ve seen in this thread.

Thoughts on realistic first week, month and year production numbers?

 

[Raffit78]

The Dakar car didn’t start because of some rules snafu is what I heard.

Don’t quote me on this, I believe in episode 86. He says that the Dakar speed car blew out transmission seals. That is why they were doing a new design to have the seals on the outside of the casing. To make replacing them easier.

About 2 1/2 minute mark.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

So Carl thinks his car #35 will be built on day one or two. My basic mind says it would be a stretch for a production line to roll out 18+ cars/day starting from day one. That’s 5k+ units per year, certainly a stretch based on forecasted numbers I’ve seen in this thread.

Thoughts on realistic first week, month and year production numbers?

First batch of 400 cars is gonna be slow obviously.

Honestly, I don’t know why we keep talking about their production because none of us know the details of the factory or their supply chain.

If they can only make 5 cars a day forever, the business is going to fail. There is no reason to mass produce them at that point, they‘d be loosing money on every car.

They only way they can make it work is 20+ cars a day minimum and they are trying for a little more once they get rolling. Todd Romano is not an idiot, he knows this. We all know nothing about their supply chain and know this as well.

It is going to take them a couple years to fill the backlog of 16k cars at 24 ish cars per day.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

You're mixing me up with someone else.
I've never encouraged anyone to whine about anything. Particularly that Speed was trying to make the car too perfect.
I'm also in no way shape or form "worried" that the car is not perfect enough.

Also my recent comments here have NOTHING to do with anyone's position on their purchase of a build spot.

1Carl is trying to sell build spots and the far and away most likely buyer is someone who doesn't currently have their own build spot. They will now be balancing the option of buying for double the money and getting a car Speed has already acknowledged will have improvements made to it in short order.

In short, they can buy a better car for half the money.
All I said is that is a steep hill to climb for 1Carl and his sales.

Your premise is that the person wants to stand in line and wait another for a year for a car and hope to get one for a deal. Those people exist certainly.

There is going to be an 18month long backlog of these Speed cars. There are always people that will overpay to get the newest thing right now. Carl will be fine, and will sell his cars for what the market will bear.

Anyone buying a SXS knows that next year a bigger, better, faster car is coming out and yet this seems to stop very few people from buying them... I don’t see inventory of any SXS very plentiful right now. There sure aren’t a hell of a lot of Can Ams in inventories out there, and it is a near certainty they will have a new car soon.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

Your premise is that the person wants to stand in line and wait another for a year for a car and hope to get one for a deal. Those people exist certainly.

There is going to be an 18month long backlog of these Speed cars. There are always people that will overpay to get the newest thing right now. Carl will be fine, and will sell his cars for what the market will bear.

Anyone buying a SXS knows that next year a bigger, better, faster car is coming out and yet this seems to stop very few people from buying them... I don’t see inventory of any SXS very plentiful right now. There sure aren’t a hell of a lot of Can Ams in inventories out there, and it is a certainty they will have a new car soon.

So is your premise that it will be 18 months or more before a dealer gets any inventory?

Also a buyer doesn't need to wait and HOPE for a deal, the price is stated on the website they would just have to wait.

Dealers will absolutely not be selling the cars for the same double cost 1Carl is asking. Again, buy from Speed directly.

That leaves 1Carl marketing to those who don't like to wait.
When the builder states, prior to building a single production car, that they have identified things they will improve in near future builds, that will tend to make waiting more attractive.

You're right in one thing for sure, 1Carl will sell for whatever the market will bear.
I'll be stunnned if it bears $80K.
More power to him if it does

 

[riverroyal]

Soooo much to type.....i cant

 

[Loo Dog]

He didn’t say there were issues that weren’t addressed, he said they have identified improvements and refinements for the next gen cars.

Anyone buying anything knows that the products down the road will be better and faster. It happens with cars, off road toys, phones etc. it does not stop people from buying this years iPhones, new C8 corvettes, Broncos, Pro R RZRs, etc when it is a certainty there will be better, faster models out later.

If you think that is going to diminish demand for these in the fall, you are living in a fantasy.

You had people in this thread whining that RG is trying to make the car too perfect and taking too long, now you are worried the car is not perfect enough and there will be no demand for these in the fall.

I think most peeps you disagree with in this post are simply pointing out RG may have bit off more than he could chew at this point, and yet still you refuse to believe this scenario could possibly exist. I don’t want anyone on RDP or any of my personal friends that currently have deposits down to lose money. As far as the ambulance chasers who are still trying to make huge profits on this start up, my opinion is perfectly clear.

 

[HCP3]

I just put up some of my cars for sale. I have too many. I still have more besides these.

Have you sold one?

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I think most peeps you disagree with in this post are simply pointing out RG may have bit off more than he could chew at this point, and yet still you refuse to believe this scenario could possibly exist. I don’t want anyone on RDP or any of my personal friends that currently have deposits down to lose money. As far as the ambulance chasers who are still trying to make huge profits on this start up, my opinion is perfectly clear.

I said he bit off more than he could chew 2 years ago when I said these cars would be late. It’s in the first page of this thread, and in the thread from September 2019. They never intended to produce 16k of these a year when they started out. They never intended to design their own engine and gearbox.

Honestly they seem to be chewing it all, it just is taking some extra time.

I think all of the people in this thread including me have no idea about their supply chain or manufacturing process either, so anything discussed one way or another is purely conjecture and speculation on everyone’s part.

Honestly, as I’ve said before I don’t really care how the car is made. I didn’t put money down for a car to worry about Speed’s assembly and supply chain. Just tell me when to come pick it up. I don’t worry about the assembly and logistics for any other product in my life.

 

[Loo Dog]

Have you sold one?

A few thousand posts ago I stated he should bring his first sucker in here to bear the brunt of the RDP inmates. My guess is no.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

So is your premise that it will be 18 months or more before a dealer gets any inventory?

Also a buyer doesn't need to wait and HOPE for a deal, the price is stated on the website they would just have to wait.

Dealers will absolutely not be selling the cars for the same double cost 1Carl is asking. Again, buy from Speed directly.

That leaves 1Carl marketing to those who don't like to wait.
When the builder states, prior to building a single production car, that they have identified things they will improve in near future builds, that will tend to make waiting more attractive.

You're right in one thing for sure, 1Carl will sell for whatever the market will bear.
I'll be stunnned if it bears $80K.
More power to him if it does

Dealers will have cars a few months out, unless they preorderd some directly for themselves I’d think. They have said the 4K customer cars will be first. That means Carl myself and others have a small window of a few months before these hit dealers. Dealers are gonna sell these things for full MSRP plus fees.

I have no idea what the buying direct program will look like after these roll out. Speed is not going to undercut its dealers, and the MSRP is going to go up.

Again, it is a forgone conclusion that later cars will be refined. Very few seem to care. By the time you wait for the refinements, there will be more refinements to wait for.

What about your friend that bought the Pro R? Is he worried about it? No he bought the car and does not care that in 18 months there will be a better Pro R out.

 

[702sandman]

Yea he wanted to control his own destiny, do it better, and not beholden to Textron. The car is 10x better for it.

This is based on the car HE HAND built not a production car that isn’t finished yet. Of course that HAND built car should be better. But you can’t say that about a car that hasn’t been produced fully yet ? It may suck compared the textron.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

This is based on the car HE HAND built not a production car that isn’t finished yet. Of course that HAND built car should be better. But you can’t say that about a car that hasn’t been produced fully yet ? It may suck compared the textron.

It may suck and it may be the best thing on the market. Who knows, we will just have to find out.

On paper this car is better than a wildcat XX in every way. Again, we will have to see what happens in the public’s hands.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

Dealers will have cars a few months out, unless they preorderd some directly for themselves I’d think. They have said the 4K customer cars will be first. That means Carl myself and others have a small window of a few months before these hit dealers. Dealers are gonna sell these things for full MSRP plus fees.

I have no idea what the buying direct program will look like after these roll out. Speed is not going to undercut its dealers, and the MSRP is going to go up.

Again, it is a forgone conclusion that later cars will be refined. Very few seem to care. By the time you wait for the refinements, there will be more refinements to wait for.

What about your friend that bought the Pro R? Is he worried about it? No he bought the car and does not care that in 18 months there will be a better Pro R out.

You're still missing my point.
My friend bought the ProR because he wanted a ProR not because he wanted to sell it.
He also didn't pay a 100% markup from MSRP while having Polaris say there were issues to be addressed soon.

My only comment was that Speed did not do 1Carl and others trying to sell early builds any favors by making that statement in the video.

 

[702sandman]

I’m sorry but the pro R in just a few races has proven it is the baddest SXS out there period !! We have got our asses handed to us by the class 10 cars in this race and for Mitch to bring it home 2nd overall shows what this car can do. He ran stock suspension with gussets installed, and this course was jacked up. We pre ran it Friday and I can tell you it was beyond rough and the new car ate it up. Carl might be a ”savage” to you but to me he’s a doushe bag that has no clue how to act… weird that Mitch pushed that car hard in the race and no folded shock

Mitch Guthrie Jr. on Instagram: "@polarisrzr Pro R dancing on the way to 2nd overall and 1st UTV across the line yesterday - courtesy of @4wheelpartsofficial @optichelicopters @caleb__norman"

2,207 likes, 34 comments - mitchguthrie5 on January 30, 2022: "@polarisrzr Pro R dancing on the way to 2nd overall and 1st UTV across the line yesterday - courtesy of @4wheelpartsofficial @optichelicopters @caleb__norman".

www.instagram.com

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

You're still missing my point.
My friend bought the ProR because he wanted a ProR not because he wanted to sell it.
He also didn't pay a 100% markup from MSRP while having Polaris say there were issues to be addressed soon.

My only comment was that Speed did not do 1Carl and others trying to sell early builds any favors by making that statement in the video.

You are saying someone won’t by Carl’s because they think a better car is coming?

They won’t buy Carl’s because he’s asking too much for them, not because a better car is coming in 18 months. The market will set his prices if he truly wants to unload them.

An asking price does not set the market. Carl can ask whatever he wants.

With Polaris it is a forgone conclusion there will be improvements because every car they come out with needs recalls and changes when it debuts.

My comment regarding improvements is that there are so few people that care enough to wait 12-18 months for the next model year’s refinements, it is not going to matter to anyone selling a car when they begin deliveries. It is common sense that the cars will be better next year.

I’m pretty sure these things will start coming with the 1.3l engine in the next couple years.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I’m sorry but the pro R in just a few races has proven it is the baddest SXS out there period !! We have got our asses handed to us by the class 10 cars in this race and for Mitch to bring it home 2nd overall shows what this car can do. He ran stock suspension with gussets installed, and this course was jacked up. We pre ran it Friday and I can tell you it was beyond rough and the new car ate it up. Carl might be a ”savage” to you but to me he’s a doushe bag that has no clue how to act… weird that Mitch pushed that car in the car hard in the race and no folded shock

Mitch Guthrie Jr. on Instagram: "@polarisrzr Pro R dancing on the way to 2nd overall and 1st UTV across the line yesterday - courtesy of @4wheelpartsofficial @optichelicopters @caleb__norman"

2,207 likes, 34 comments - mitchguthrie5 on January 30, 2022: "@polarisrzr Pro R dancing on the way to 2nd overall and 1st UTV across the line yesterday - courtesy of @4wheelpartsofficial @optichelicopters @caleb__norman".

www.instagram.com

The new car looked impressive. I agree it is the best thing on the market we have today.

The next year should be pretty interesting with all the competition.

 

[Singleton]

Found it interesting Speed had zero presence at KOH.

 

[Loo Dog]

Found it interesting Speed had zero presence at KOH.

No but Polaris did. As did Ford, with a whole truckload of Broncos that actually exist. In Speed’s defense, an appearance at KOH this year would have been in poor taste.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Found it interesting Speed had zero presence at KOH.

They said they aren’t going to race until the cars are in production. Aside from SST that is.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

No but Polaris did. As did Ford, with a whole truckload of Broncos that actually exist. In Speed’s defense, an appearance at KOH this year would have been in poor taste. View attachment 1084167

Note that both Polaris and Bronco debuted over a year late too, and the Bronco still had problems upon release.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

You are saying someone won’t by Carl’s because they think a better car is coming?

I'm not saying that at all.
I'm saying Speed made it much more difficult for him though.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I'm not saying that at all.
I'm saying Speed made it much more difficult for him though.

I say the people that buy his cars are not going to care what new improvements come out in 18 months, regardless of what they ultimately pay him. They will be happy to get the car then and have fun and make memories with it.

 

[Loo Dog]

Note that both Polaris and Bronco debuted over a year late too, and the Bronco still had problems upon release.

Note these are both products from well established companies. Big difference.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

I say the people that buy his cars are not going to care what new improvements come out in 18 months, regardless of what they ultimately pay him. They will be happy to get the car then and have fun and make memories with it.

Probably.
To be accurate though, Speed did not say it would be 18 months before the improvement's would be made, only that it wouldn't be done on the first run stuff.

And they, and I, were not speaking of the normal evolution of any product.
It is specifically items they had identified needing or capable of improvement already before any cars are done.

 

[JayBreww]

They said they aren’t going to race until the cars are in production. Aside from SST that is.

Didn’t they race a few times after stating that?

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Note these are both products from well established companies. Big difference.

Exactly, it is a huge difference. So why are you holding Speed to different standards when the big guys can’t even get it together in a global supply chain crunch?

They are taking the time to make it they best car that can.

 

[Bpracing1127]

Note that both Polaris and Bronco debuted over a year late too, and the Bronco still had problems upon release.

the point there is the debuted.



RG is over engineering the car at this point. Release it get it out there make version 2 shortly after. People in masses are the best R&D and its FREE

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Probably.
To be accurate though, Speed did not say it would be 18 months before the improvement's would be made, only that it wouldn't be done on the first run stuff.

And they didn’t say anything about what those things would be. Again, not many people in their right mind would sit around and waste another year waiting for the perfect car.

Keep in mind we got a bunch of Intercooler and intake improvements and refinements already that were incorporated in spring of 2021.

 

[Singleton]

They said they aren’t going to race until the cars are in production. Aside from SST that is.

No need to race. Get a vendor spot and show the car (Maybe sell some spots).
Every other SXS mfg had booths and demo rides available.
the Pro R was looking very nice.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

the point there is the debuted.



RG is over engineering the car at this point. Release it get it out there make version 2 shortly after. People in masses are the best R&D and its FREE

The point is they were late. If RG gets the Speed cars out this year, he still got them out quicker than Polaris brought the Pro R to market and quicker than Ford brought the Bronco to market.

And no he’s not over engineering the car at this point. They can’t afford a bunch of dumb problems when they launch this car. If what they have said is true, the design and engineering is pretty much done. After an extra year of waiting none of us want a car that was rushed to get out for a summer delivery anyway.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

No need to race. Get a vendor spot and show the car (Maybe sell some spots).
Every other SXS mfg had booths and demo rides available.
the Pro R was looking very nice.

I’d be more annoyed with that personally, I would have rather seen the thing race if they made the effort to get out there.

They have said repeatedly over the last month that getting these cars to production is the firms top priority. I’m glad they are noses down grinding out the details to get these things out. It shows commitment to that promise he made his customers.

 

[1Carl]

So Carl thinks his car #35 will be built on day one or two. My basic mind says it would be a stretch for a production line to roll out 18+ cars/day starting from day one. That’s 5k+ units per year, certainly a stretch based on forecasted numbers I’ve seen in this thread.

Thoughts on realistic first week, month and year production numbers?

The first 20 cars are Speed cars. First car sold to public is car 21.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Didn’t they race a few times after stating that?

They had sponsor commitments and said up front the only races they were running were those committed races.

 

[Loo Dog]

Exactly, it is a huge difference. So why are you holding Speed to different standards when the big guys can’t even get it together in a global supply chain crunch?

They are taking the time to make it they best car that can.

I’m definitely not, I agree it’s a giant difference. You’re the one holding them to the same standard. If the all mighty Ford Motor Company is having supply chain issues (read computer chips), why the optimism or excuses for a SxS start up? This will drag out to be the largest thread in RDP history. Congrats! I hope you and several of my buddies get your cars before they’re horribly outdated.

 

[Lunatic Fringe]

. Again, not many people in their right mind would sit around and waste another year waiting for the perfect car.

Drop the word perfect (since you're the only one using it) and isn't that exactly what you have already done?
And I might say, defended it the entire time by saying you'd rather wait for the correct car than an on time car.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I’m definitely not, I agree it’s a giant difference. You’re the one holding them to the same standard. If the all mighty Ford Motor Company is having supply chain issues (read computer chips), why the optimism or excuses for a SxS start up? This will drag out to be the largest thread in RDP history. Congrats! I hope you and several of my buddies get your cars before they’re horribly outdated.

I’m not holding them to any standard aside from tell me when to pick it up. Remember I said these would be late from the beginning, and that was pre pandemic. So if I thought they would be late then, why would a supply chain fiasco make things happen faster? I thought they’d be don't late last year, it didn’t happen. I was never confident enough to sell my current SXS.

Make no mistake I think the car will be great and I’m excited to get it. I’m not worried about it being outdated, it’s going to be competitive with the current crop of new cars, and will be safe for me and my family.

Why are you congratulating me it’s not my thread

 

[Loo Dog]

I’m not holding them to any standard aside from tell me when to pick it up. Remember I said these would be late from the beginning, and that was pre pandemic. So if I thought they would be late then, why would a supply chain fiasco make things happen faster? I thought they’d be don't late last year, it didn’t happen. I was never confident enough to sell my current SXS.

Make no mistake I think the car will be great and I’m excited to get it. I’m not worried about it being outdated, it’s going to be competitive with the current crop of new cars, and will be safe for me and my family.

Why are you congratulating me it’s not my thread

Don’t kid yourself pal, this has been YOUR thread for quite some time.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Drop the word perfect (since you're the only one using it) and isn't that exactly what you have already done?
And I might say, defended it the entire time by saying you'd rather wait for the correct car than an on time car.

Nope. Recall I got into this with the expectation that the cars would be very late. Also I never sold my current car because I was not that confident with their timelines last year. I’m fine waiting for them to make the best out of what they have. Seems they are about ready to go now.

 

[702sandman]

Exactly, it is a huge difference. So why are you holding Speed to different standards when the big guys can’t even get it together in a global supply chain crunch?

They are taking the time to make it they best car that can.

i think this is a easy answer. It’s simply because even thought Polaris came out late with their car they never asked anyone for a dime to develop this new car unlike speed Asking for deposits 2 YEARS in advance. Polaris dealers took deposits 1-3 months ahead of production just to give people the opportunity to save a highly coveted spot. They sold out almost immediately.