Wind warning

[4Waters]

NOPE. On the chance of a malfunction
I say. Shut all the fucking lower off. And you all can deal with it.

Then I should get compensated for not having power even though I paid my bill on time

 

[Mr. C]

Then I should get compensated for not having power even though I paid my bill on time

Nope. Safety first. You know. Gotta protect everybody before your personal needs come into play. . Sorry

 

[Taboma]

Then I should get compensated for not having power even though I paid my bill on time

You pay for what you use, if it's shut off you're not using any --- are you ?

 

[CLdrinker]

While I'm not up to date on the terms but know them when you say it, this is exactly what I was thinking, Edison will know very quickly if they had failure at the tower. I've said it a hundred times, I don't think it's Edisons equipment causing damn near every fire now when their equipment very very rarely caused fires 20+ year's ago. You and @oldman both state that lack of maintenance is not an issue but some dumbass at Edison said it was on live TV in 2018, so I will keep hammering the "Maintain your shit"

So just because someone says something that makes it fact? C’mon.

I’m not going to argue with you.

But I will leave you with this. Who else pays up if they are found at fault? The state? lol a arsonist? lol

The utility? Bingo

 

[4Waters]

NOPE. On the chance of a malfunction
I say. Shut all the fucking power off. And you all can deal with it.

Just remember, this wasn't a problem until 15 years ago when almost all the the fires became Edison's fault, previous to that it was almost never a utility issue, I still don't believe it is a utility issue.

 

[WYRD]

You guys have it all wrong. Leave the power on. All you have to do is get rid of the 4 ists..... arsonists, environmentalists, leftists and socialists

 

[4Waters]

You pay for what you use, if it's shut off you're not using any --- are you ?

I'm paying for it to be on and maintained, if it's not maintained and they turn it off because of that then compensate us

 

[rrrr]

So you'll be mad if they turn the wires off or if they leave the wires on. Got it.

Your problem is you are assuming lack of maintenance. Are you in the industry? Do you know the required maintenance did not occur on the lines in question?

I was reading today that there was a line that went down (not the Eaton one) that was designed to withstand 90km/h, but failed as a result of 150km/h force. How does a utility "maintain" against that?

What I'm hearing is these have been the strongest winds that anybody has ever seen here...the strongest in 30 years or something like that. And you still want to blame the utilities? What's next? An 8.0 earthquake brings a transmission tower down, it starts a fire, and you blame the utility for not making the tower footings 20 feet in diameter and 100 feet deep?

I agree with your premise, but 90 and 150 km/h are 54 and 90 MPH respectively. That's not much. Might be why the information was released in that format, probably not too many people can do the conversion in their head and think that's a lot of wind.

 

[Angler]

You pay for what you use, if it's shut off you're not using any --- are you ?

The cost of propane and the use of a generator should be compensated, for their fucked up system.

 

[4Waters]

So just because someone says something that makes it fact? C’mon.

I’m not going to argue with you.

But I will leave you with this. Who else pays up if they are found at fault? The state? lol a arsonist? lol

The utility? Bingo

That right and that's why the pussies up top need to sing and tell all the ins companies looking for handouts to fuck off, that's why people had their policies canceled because of the hey let's blame Edison crap

 

[CLdrinker]

I see that this is heading into bash the utility phase of the thread.

If anyone has questions send me a PM

 

[Wizard29]

So why don’t they make all utility lines under the ground like all new neighborhoods in Arizona? Too much $$$?

+Environmental
+Difficulty to maintain

 

[Taboma]

I see that this is heading into bash the utility phase of the thread.

If anyone has questions send me a PM

I applaud your patience in dealing with this subject that seasonally blows into River Dave's Place out of the east ----
Commonly referred to as The Wind of the 4Waters.

 

[Angler]

I see that this is heading into bash the utility phase of the thread.

If anyone has questions send me a PM

When will edison send me my check for me having to supply my own electricity?

 

[4Waters]

I see that this is heading into bash the utility phase of the thread.

If anyone has questions send me a PM

I applaud your patience in dealing with this subject that seasonally blows into River Dave's Place out of the east ----
Commonly referred to as The Wind of the 4Waters.

You buy a new truck, you bought a maintenance program with it and you make your payments on time and take your truck in every 5k miles, at 32k the engine seizes and come to fine out that when you were taking your truck in for oil changes they didn't do them. Would you be ok if they told you to bad you have to pay for a new engine?

I already know the answer, it's yes you would be ok with that, me on the other hand would not be ok with that

 

[Taboma]

In other news, we go from the dirt to the air ---- Let's all give a hearty welcome to Cal Fire's MAFF System Aerial weapon --- C-130 Number 122, based currently out of Ramona. The big Hercules carries 4,000 gallons of retardant. I read they put it to work yesterday and today on the Palisades fire.

 

[Taboma]

You buy a new truck, you bought a maintenance program with it and you make your payments on time and take your truck in every 5k miles, at 32k the engine seizes and come to fine out that when you were taking your truck in for oil changes they didn't do them. Would you be ok if they told you to bad you have to pay for a new engine?

I already know the answer, it's yes you would be ok with that, me on the other hand would not be ok with that

Don't kid yourself if you don't think that when you purchase a new vehicle the actuaries haven't calculated the odds and the expense of the company that's providing it, including any potential for warranty work.
Nothing is free in this world, either is the any and all costs associated with keeping your lights on --- which does not come with any guarantees.
Now, I won't argue that perhaps the shareholders in this company, are raking in to much, or the CEO or top brass aren't either, that's a whole different problem.

You want everything buried -- Bottom line, you can't friggin afford it.

How's all this ranting on RDP every time the wind blows from the east working out for you ?? Are you winning yet ??

 

[Wizard29]

I agree with your premise, but 90 and 150 km/h are 54 and 90 MPH respectively. That's not much. Might be why the information was released in that format, probably not too many people can do the conversion in their head and think that's a lot of wind.

I agree. Big difference between the two numbers though no matter if it's KM or MPH. The actual wind was almost double the rating regardless of whatever unit of measurement gets used to describe it.

A 90MPH wind in an area where the wind studies (containing data often provided by the state) indicate a 54MPH wind load design is required certainly qualifies as significant.

 

[rivrrts429]

It’s super expensive. Min 1mill a mile.

That’s a fuck ton of Ukrainian dollars that Edison could’ve used to bury lines lol

 

[HCP3]

What if a SoCal Edison employee fails to put their grocery cart back in the corral?

 

[Wizard29]

When will edison send me my check for me having to supply my own electricity?

Likely never. Like with any other service, you are free to not be a customer and source your own through whatever means you have available.

 

[4Waters]

Don't kid yourself if you don't think that when you purchase a new vehicle the actuaries haven't calculated the odds and the expense of the company that's providing it, including any potential for warranty work.
Nothing is free in this world, either is the any and all costs associated with keeping your lights on --- which does not come with any guarantees.
Now, I won't argue that perhaps the shareholders in this company, are raking in to much, or the CEO or top brass aren't either, that's a whole different problem.

You want everything buried -- Bottom line, you can't friggin afford it.

How's all this ranting on RDP every time the wind blows from the east working out for you ?? Are you winning yet ??

You purchased a maintenance plan and you make your payments, you would expect the maintenance to be done since you make your payment.

I pay my bill and I expect maintenance to be done, the problem is that "my oil wasn't getting changed even though I was told it was".

My bill covers the payment for the utilities and the maintenance of the equipment.

My bill covers the payment for the vehicle and the maintenance of the equipment.

There is no difference in expectations, none.

If maintenance wasn't an issue then the brass at Edison should have never said that it was on live TV. If DWP said Edison wasn't maintaining their equipment then I would be assuming they are speaking the truth but since it was Edison there is no reason to take it as anything other than fact.

 

[Mr. C]

I see that this is heading into bash the utility phase of the thread.

If anyone has questions send me a PM

It’s really no different than many threads.
I thank you for your inside info.
And will let it rest from my end. Hopefully. lol

 

[4Waters]

Likely never. Like with any other service, you are free to not be a customer and source your own through whatever means you have avavailable.

Here are our 2 options for a power utility
1, Edison
2, Edison

And that is why they can get away with this. Maybe Edison could pay to put solar everyone's house and a power wall so we can turn off our mains? Oh can't do that, that would put them out of business.

 

[rrrr]

That right and that's why the pussies up top need to sing and tell all the ins companies looking for handouts to fuck off, that's why people had their policies canceled because of the hey let's blame Edison crap

They had their policies cancelled because the Insurance Commission refused to allow insurers to charge premiums that reflect risk. They were also prohibited from including reinsurance costs in the premiums. That's been standard in the insurance industry since Lloyd's of London was incorporated in the 1600s. Laying off risk through a secondary reinsurer is a principle of primary insurance that is critical for the ability of the insurer to remain solvent. That the Commission prevented it is reckless and stupid.

For many years, insurers in the LA area have been paying out $1.09 for losses for every $1.00 in premiums. Would you stay in a market under those circumstances? Of course not.

 

[Wizard29]

Leave them on, simple and I'm not assuming anything, some dumbass from Edison said at a press conference in 2018 after the woosley fire that they were behind in repairs and maintenance, on live TV

But you are assuming these recent fires were caused by lack of maintenance. Your other reply to me was, "Maintain your shit." So on the Eaton circuits, they did. Now what?

Just remember, this wasn't a problem until 15 years ago when almost all the the fires became Edison's fault, previous to that it was almost never a utility issue, I still don't believe it is a utility issue.

So it is a utility issue or it isn't? I'll agree it's less of a utility issue than a state issue.

Scenario: You are responsible at the highest levels for providing electric service. You play by the rules, follow all of the regulations, and your maintenance is squared away. Then the state still comes in and blames you for a fire when the wind is blowing. Your only option to avoid the liability is to stop the service when the wind is blowing. That way there is no question you cannot be at fault because nothing else seems to work. You'd still keep the power on and roll the dice in this fucked up state? I doubt it.

 

[RVR SWPR]

35 million on a fleet of choppers is likely less costly than a fleet of workers....careful what you wish for. I think I'm paying more than enough for power as it is. If I was Edison, I'd do just like the insurance companies and tell everyone in fire areas to fuckoff.

Edison constantly inspecting & maintaining power lines using choppers. Vin Scully son lost his life flying his chopper inspecting power lines.
Bullshit Edison responsible for wild fires is in fact bullshit.

 

[rightytighty]

They have been mega dropping the red phosphate stuff for days.

Any chance of that stuff running low/out?

 

[Taboma]

You purchased a maintenance plan and you make your payments, you would expect the maintenance to be done since you make your payment.

I pay my bill and I expect maintenance to be done, the problem is that "my oil wasn't getting changed even though I was told it was".

My bill covers the payment for the utilities and the maintenance of the equipment.

My bill covers the payment for the vehicle and the maintenance of the equipment.

There is no difference in expectations, none.

If maintenance wasn't an issue then the brass at Edison should have never said that it was on live TV. If DWP said Edison wasn't maintaining their equipment then I would be assuming they are speaking the truth but since it was Edison there is no reason to take it as anything other than fact.

I believe you're right in regards to not just Edison, but public utilities in general not having kept up with the required maintenance. I've seen it on the Navy bases, College campuses, as well and I've worked on every one in San Diego County. But the "Fix When Broken" program was instituted back in the mid 90's is when I started noticing it.

So yes, I believe some of the failures that have contributed to wildfires, including the one in '07 that destroyed my house, was due to lack of maintenance.

That however and burying all the electrical utility lines are two entirely different subjects.

The power lines to my home are buried and have been since 1974, they've been upgrading and repairing this UG system the past two years, including upgrading the overhead lines and poles serving our area. We've had far more power outages and have had my generator running more frequently than any other time in the past 30 years we've lived here.

Take some time and study how power is distributed and some of the engineering challenges working with the higher voltages, it will be quite insightful.

Write a letter to SCE, because all the ranting on this board is not going to change one damned thing.
Good Luck with your quest.
PS: We sleep better with the power being shutoff around us during high winds, ours frequently is included in those.

 

[Wizard29]

Here are our 2 options for a power utility
1, Edison
2, Edison

And that is why they can get away with this. Maybe Edison could pay to put solar everyone's house and a power wall so we can turn off our mains? Oh can't do that, that would put them out of business.

Why should Edison pay for your solar panels and a power wall? Go turn off your main, inform Edison they can disconnect your service, and go buy/install the solar panels and power wall yourself. You won't see another bill from Edison and you'll have power in your house (mostly).

It's still a free market. Go be free.

 

[bilz]

Many traffic signal poles in la city are being changed to 100 mph poles.

 

[4Waters]

Why should Edison pay for your solar panels and a power wall? Go turn off your main, inform Edison they can disconnect your service, and go buy/install the solar panels and power wall yourself. You won't see another bill from Edison and you'll have power in your house (mostly).

It's still a free market. Go be free.

I can't afford that, plus they are in the business of providing power, not me

 

[Angler]

Likely never. Like with any other service, you are free to not be a customer and source your own through whatever means you have available.

I do have a nice sized solar system, Unfortunately, you can not be disconnected the grid.

 

[Wizard29]

I can't afford that, plus they are in the business of providing power, not me

Fair enough and unfortunately, power being provided at a rate you can afford comes with certain inconveniences.

It's kind of like flying private versus commercial. Most people can't afford to fly private, so they must endure canceled/late flights.

 

[4Waters]

I believe you're right in regards to not just Edison, but public utilities in general not having kept up with the required maintenance. I've seen it on the Navy bases, College campuses, as well and I've worked on every one in San Diego County. But the "Fix When Broken" program was instituted back in the mid 90's is when I started noticing it.

So yes, I believe some of the failures that have contributed to wildfires, including the one in '07 that destroyed my house, was due to lack of maintenance.

That however and burying all the electrical utility lines are two entirely different subjects.

The power lines to my home are buried and have been since 1974, they've been upgrading and repairing this UG system the past two years, including upgrading the overhead lines and poles serving our area. We've had far more power outages and have had my generator running more frequently than any other time in the past 30 years we've lived here.

Take some time and study how power is distributed and some of the engineering challenges working with the higher voltages, it will be quite insightful.

Write a letter to SCE, because all the ranting on this board is not going to change one damned thing.
Good Luck with your quest.
PS: We sleep better with the power being shutoff around us during high winds, ours frequently is included in those.

It's the payment and expectation of maintenance that people don't understand, I appreciate you actually understanding what I've been trying to say for years.

Yes I do believe that it is somewhat of an issue with all utilities, it's obvious that DWP is having issues keeping up with water mains but not with their electricity, honestly, I see 7 power crews for every 1 water crew, it's not that the water crews are working there asses off because they are but it appears there are fewer water crews.

 

[oldman]

Not my problem, maintain your shit, those lines didn't cause fires in the 70's 80's 90's. We've been paying our bills they should have been maintaining their equipment instead of paying big bonuses. There should be no bonuses for anyone associated with public utilities, ever.

70's 80's 90's were no different that today ( they probably caused MORE fires back then YOU really have no clue.) other that your homeowners ins covered it and Edison was not held labial, ( I explained all of this that fell on deaf ears in a previous post) the courts started making rulings against Edison and the landscape changed. Edison started getting sued Oh and your Fire ins still goes up along with your rates..

Same number of fires same number of claims, ( probably more) also when Edison says they are not doing infrastructure replacement and concentrating on fire mitigation, what they are saying is they are installing a ton of high end monitoring equipment, and fault protection equipment and not concentrating on just poles and wires, but a ton of other fire mitigation is going on. (back to you your chart through those years they spent 100 million a year.. do you have a clue how much that is?)

Do you know that most of the wind, temp, humidity, and general climate info you see on TV comes from Edison? They have thousands and thousands of weather stations mounted in some of the most remote portions of the territory If electricity traverses it they have a weather station monitoring it.

If

 

[oldman]

Yup, I got the word last week from a firm that I send some cases to that they would be taking Eaton Fire cases.

I'm guessing the video of it starting right under a power line tower was enough to start the push.

Thats too bad.

 

[4Waters]

70's 80's 90's were no different that today ( they probably caused MORE fires back then YOU really have no clue.) other that your homeowners ins covered it and Edison was not held labial, ( I explained all of this that fell on deaf ears in a previous post) the courts started making rulings against Edison and the landscape changed. Edison started getting sued Oh and your Fire ins still goes up along with your rates..

Same number of fires same number of claims, ( probably more) also when Edison says they are not doing infrastructure replacement and concentrating on fire mitigation, what they are saying is they are installing a ton of high end monitoring equipment, and fault protection equipment and not concentrating on just poles and wires, but a ton of other fire mitigation is going on. (back to you your chart through those years they spent 100 million a year.. do you have a clue how much that is?)

Do you know that most of the wind, temp, humidity, and general climate info you see on TV comes from Edison? They have thousands and thousands of weather stations mounted in some of the most remote portions of the territory If electricity traverses it they have a weather station monitoring it.

If

In the 70's I was too young but I remember in the 80's and 90's the news (back when they were reliable) updating the info and the majority were deemed arson.

 

[lbhsbz]

Here are our 2 options for a power utility
1, Edison
2, Edison

And that is why they can get away with this. Maybe Edison could pay to put solar everyone's house and a power wall so we can turn off our mains? Oh can't do that, that would put them out of business.

What many public sector people fail to understand is that there is a point at which things become too expensive to justify....or be possible. While I don't have the answer as to how to make everything perfect and affordable, I do understand that compromises need to exist.

Lets say, for example. Edison was to update all their equipment, bury lines, and do whatever exists with today's technology in order to make it so that electricity is 100% reliable under every possible conceivable condition and those we haven't thought of yet....who would pay for all that? You and I certainly couldn't afford it. So we compromise. If the fucking lawyers would keep their hands out of it, things would be better because instead of lining their pockets, a bit more money could be directed towards useful projects.

DWP has an effectively unlimited budget, from money stolen from taxpayers....are they perfect? no. Far from it...but they can spend as much as they want because when the government runs out of money, they just take/print/borrow more.

I've never sued anyone, and don't plan on ever doing so. Sometimes shit just happens and placing blame on another outfit who is doing the best, or at least pretty damn good with what they've got work is just a shitty thing to do. Why can't the rest of people get that through their fucking heads?

Want solar? Get solar. Wanna disconnect from Edison or whatever utility provides your power....get a generator if you're too cheap to get solar or it doesn't work for you for whatever reason. It's pretty damn simple. You have a choice, as does everyone else. You don't get to make a certain choice because you can't do better than the service they provide for the price they provide it for and then blame them when something goes wrong. If you don't like 'em, don't use 'em.

Private Sector people tend to understand this because they're playing wtih real money....public sector plays with monopoly money

 

[4Waters]

Thats too bad.

It really is and I hope that Edison can prove that their equipment had no failures, it should be fairly easy being the fire started under the tower. They did say it was off, if Edison is not at fault they need to stand their ground

 

[4Waters]

They had their policies cancelled because the Insurance Commission refused to allow insurers to charge premiums that reflect risk. They were also prohibited from including reinsurance costs in the premiums. That's been standard in the insurance industry since Lloyd's of London was incorporated in the 1600s. Laying off risk through a secondary reinsurer is a principle of primary insurance that is critical for the ability of the insurer to remain solvent. That the Commission prevented it is reckless and stupid.

For many years, insurers in the LA area have been paying out $1.09 for losses for every $1.00 in premiums. Would you stay in a market under those circumstances? Of course not.

I doubt that

 

[DarkHorseRacing]

I'm old and remember Dr George on ABC7 calling these the Santana Winds (Satan's winds) 40-50 years ago, and telling the TV audience that "Santa Ana" was just a lazy corruption. Anybody else recall this?

Wikipedia does say that they are referred to as “devil winds”.

 

[oldman]

100% Trying to make it look obvious what started.
But… The most common occurrence for the utility to be responsible would be conductor slap. That happens mid span. Not at the base of a tower.
A Dead End insulator could maybe fail and drop the conductor. Well the conductor would not fall straight down lol.

Maybe a suspension insulator failed and that would drop the conductor straight down possibly allow it to slap the tower. Not likely.

Edison had a fire start in Santiago Canyon two years ago from a CATV messenger cable that was loos and slapped into the 12kv lines and started a fire. Guess who was on the hook for that???????

Not spectrum, them communication company with the loose wire, Edison got drug in, along with some random ass field guys to testify, I know more than I'd like to about that one.

 

[lbhsbz]

Wikipedia does say ...

The most trusted source of news and facts....

 

[4Waters]

I'm old and remember Dr George on ABC7 calling these the Santana Winds (Satan's winds) 40-50 years ago, and telling the TV audience that "Santa Ana" was just a lazy corruption. Anybody else recall this?

I remember him

 

[4Waters]

Edison had a fire start in Santiago Canyon two years ago from a CATV messenger cable that was loos and slapped into the 12kv lines and started a fire. Guess who was on the hook for that???????

Not spectrum, them communication company with the loose wire, Edison got drug in, along with some random ass field guys to testify, I know more than I'd like to about that one.

And that's Bullshit

 

[oldman]

all power lines should be underground! Problem SOLVED!


Change my mind

I'd take overhead lines every day,

 

[TrollerDave]

First pic 10:56am, 2nd pic 11:16. Just 20mins.
View attachment 1466996 View attachment 1466997

So a week later. from this distance, you wouldn’t really know there was a fire.

Towards Alta Dena

Last Thursday, the sky was black overhead. Crazy.

 

[oldman]

Great, if it's all upgraded and up to par leave it on

Please explain that standard to the class.
Your quick to say it's not , but your not giving us what it should be.

Because you don't have a clue what any of the inter workings are. Your upset because the media told you to be.

 

[oldman]

I can tell you, my cranes customers are absolutely slammed with work for SCE

New work from fires, or pre fire work?