Carl's Howard

[wsuwrhr]

The hatch also blew open on the ride home in the storm. I never liked that setup with no way to secure it down.

I taped the air intakes on the gunnels closed and took the rear seat cushion out for the remainder of the ride. I will have to dream up something in the future.

Other than electric actuators, how else are hatches secured?

 

[wsuwrhr]

When running at speed, the water temp crept up to 160 deg, but would barely crest 140 otherwise. Is this typical with logs? Seems like a great way to torch an exhaust valve.

Brian

 

[PVHCA]

Sorry to hear about the issues and hope they will be minimal for you, my only bit of advice is get a TOWING COVER, I've said it a million times and I'll continue to say it, I'd rather buff out a few lil rub marks then replace cushions or R & R an engine hatch. Not including you in this but I've never understood why people don't tow with the TOWING COVER on, it protects against all the shit flying through the air at 75MPH and keeps all the pertinent shit where it belongs, in the boat.

 

[oldschool]

When running at speed, the water temp crept up to 160 deg, but would barely crest 140 otherwise. Is this typical with logs? Seems like a great way to torch an exhaust valve.

Brian

Seems fine. How is you water system routed?

 

[wsuwrhr]

Sorry to hear about the issues and hope they will be minimal for you, my only bit of advice is get a TOWING COVER, I've said it a million times and I'll continue to say it, I'd rather buff out a few lil rub marks then replace cushions or R & R an engine hatch. Not including you in this but I've never understood why people don't tow with the TOWING COVER on, it protects against all the shit flying through the air at 75MPH and keeps all the pertinent shit where it belongs, in the boat.

I agree and that might be what I end up doing.

 

[240Hallett]

The hatch also blew open on the ride home in the storm. I never liked that setup with no way to secure it down.

I taped the air intakes on the gunnels closed and took the rear seat cushion out for the remainder of the ride. I will have to dream up something in the future.

Other than electric actuators, how else are hatches secured?

My Eliminator had mechanical latches (like you would see on an old Dart or Camaro hood) with a pair of billet handles for the release cables mounted near the floor on the front of the rear seat box. It was held open with the standard gas filled hatch supports.

 

[wsuwrhr]

Seems fine. How is you water system routed?

Raw water out of the Neovane into the rear of the log, out of the front of the log into the block, out of the block into the snail, and out of the exhaust.

 

[HavasuHank]

The hatch also blew open on the ride home in the storm. I never liked that setup with no way to secure it down.

I taped the air intakes on the gunnels closed and took the rear seat cushion out for the remainder of the ride. I will have to dream up something in the future.

Other than electric actuators, how else are hatches secured?

Sorry to hear about the issues and hope they will be minimal for you, my only bit of advice is get a TOWING COVER, I've said it a million times and I'll continue to say it, I'd rather buff out a few lil rub marks then replace cushions or R & R an engine hatch. Not including you in this but I've never understood why people don't tow with the TOWING COVER on, it protects against all the shit flying through the air at 75MPH and keeps all the pertinent shit where it belongs, in the boat.

Brian, did the hatch blow open while underway on the water, or while towing it home?

 

[oldschool]

The hatch also blew open on the ride home in the storm. I never liked that setup with no way to secure it down.

I taped the air intakes on the gunnels closed and took the rear seat cushion out for the remainder of the ride. I will have to dream up something in the future.

Other than electric actuators, how else are hatches secured?

Run a life vest strap from the hatch down into the rear seat somehow. Make it accessible from the back seat so you can buckle it when you need it secure.

 

[oldschool]

Raw water out of the Neovane into the rear of the log, out of the front of the log into the block, out of the block into the snail, and out of the exhaust.

:thumbsup

 

[BamBam]

Raw water out of the Neovane into the rear of the log, out of the front of the log into the block, out of the block into the snail, and out of the exhaust.

That is pretty normal for a set-up like that. There is no thermostat because you can't deadhead the neovane pump. At least it is being pre-heated in the logs before it goes into the motor. I hope for you it had a oil volume issue and there is no internal damage to the motor.

 

[wsuwrhr]

Brian, did the hatch blow open while underway on the water, or while towing it home?

Towing it home.

Engine is running and sucking air in on the water, plus, UCH don't go 60MPH on the water.

 

[Willie B]

When running at speed, the water temp crept up to 160 deg, but would barely crest 140 otherwise. Is this typical with logs? Seems like a great way to torch an exhaust valve.

Brian

... Is there a gate valve of some sort controlling the inlet of water that runs through the engine???...

...I use a gate valve to control the engine temperature,...regulating the amount of water flowing into the water pump and through the motor....I wouldn't worry about the 140 to 160? variation in eng temp... Not that extreme of a variation...

... There is also the possibility that the motor has a thermostat in it...you might check that...

 

[spectras only]

Brian, ditch the Neovane pump like I did for my LS6 in the Spectra. Here's a picture of the 396 I built up for display, showing the water cooling with thermostat.

 

[oldschool]

... Is there a gate valve of some sort controlling the inlet of water that runs through the engine???...

...I use a gate valve to control the engine temperature,...regulating the amount of water flowing into the water pump and through the motor....I wouldn't worry about the 140 to 160? variation in eng temp... Not that extreme of a variation...

... There is also the possibility that the motor has a thermostat in it...you might check that...

Be careful when controlling the flow of water at the inlet side of things. I would rather control the outflow, if at all.

 

[BamBam]

Be careful when controlling the flow of water at the inlet side of things. I would rather control the outflow, if at all.

Agreed!!! If you limit the flow you will melt the exhaust manifolds. I like the system that Spectras put up there. a thermostat with a bypass is the best way to run it.

 

[wsuwrhr]

... Is there a gate valve of some sort controlling the inlet of water that runs through the engine???...

...I use a gate valve to control the engine temperature,...regulating the amount of water flowing into the water pump and through the motor....I wouldn't worry about the 140 to 160? variation in eng temp... Not that extreme of a variation...

... There is also the possibility that the motor has a thermostat in it...you might check that...

No gate valve. No thermostat.

One pickup at the rear for the neovane, one pickup in the front for the gearbox and the velvet drive.

 

[dread Pirate]

Brian, ditch the Neovane pump like I did for my LS6 in the Spectra. Here's a picture of the 396 I built up for display, showing the water cooling with thermostat.

View attachment 482327

If you end up going with a system like this, let me know. I have a timing cover for you. :thumbsup

 

[wsuwrhr]

If you end up going with a system like this, let me know. I have a timing cover for you. :thumbsup

Timing cover looks like the same as what I have now.

 

[oldschool]

No gate valve. No thermostat.

One pickup at the rear for the neovane, one pickup in the front for the gearbox and the velvet drive.

IMO, run it as cool as it will run.

 

[Faceaz]

No oil cooler.

Not 5lbs of variance in the day, 5 lbs of gradual loss from Thursday to Sunday.

Just a thought... The old oil in the internals was probably thick like sludge. As it ran, cleansed itself & thinned out the sludge, the oil pressure would probably drop a tad. Or if the oil pump has a relief valve, possibly the same scenario.

 

[wsuwrhr]

IMO, run it as cool as it will run.

OK, we disagree on that. Under 160 runs the risk of damaging the exhaust valves/cylinder head.

Under 160 effects the efficiency of the oil as well, and efficiency of the engine overall.

 

[dread Pirate]

OK, we disagree on that. Under 160 runs the risk of damaging the exhaust valves/cylinder head.

Under 160 effects the efficiency of the oil as well, and efficiency of the engine overall.

My Daytona never got over 140 until I let off the throttle. Even with the blower motor. Usually ran right around 125. Then it would spike as the pump wasn't pushing as much volume. Most I have talked to say the same, but it is a jet bote.

 

[oldschool]

OK, we disagree on that. Under 160 runs the risk of damaging the exhaust valves/cylinder head.

Under 160 effects the efficiency of the oil as well, and efficiency of the engine overall.

In your application, NA, there will be some benefit in water temp. All the gurus have told me, run it cold. Oil temp and water temp are 2 different thing.

 

[wsuwrhr]

My Daytona never got over 140 until I let off the throttle. Even with the blower motor. Usually ran right around 125. Then it would spike as the pump wasn't pushing as much volume. Most I have talked to say the same, but it is a jet bote.

On my jet bote I ran my 440 with restrictors on the in and out sides with a pressure gauge and changed orifice sizes to achieve 160-180 operating temp and 20 PSI max in the engine.

 

[wsuwrhr]

In your application, NA, there will be some benefit in water temp. All the gurus have told me, run it cold. Oil temp and water temp are 2 different thing.

OK. Problem is the two temps will always be related. You can't really have a "cold" engine and "hot" oil.

 

[Bigbore500r]

I woudn't trust a old electric boat gauge. If you see pressure dropping over the weekend with sustained usage on a good mechanical that would be a problem though. For now, I would cut the filter open with a filter cutter and inspect the pleats for any metal. If something was coming apart, or a bearing going, it would most likely show in there. Or get a UOA on the oil you have in there! 4 days of straight boating should have enough time on the oil that if anything wierd was happening it may show up on a UOA report from blackstone

 

[oldschool]

OK. Problem is the two temps will always be related. You can't really have a "cold" engine and "hot" oil.

Yes and no. "typically" one will follow the other, true. But, I like to see my motor with oil temp about 180-200 and water temp as low as possible. With that said, I'm running a different set up than you. With regards to getting the oil out, I have the same issue. I have a 12 quart pan and it's a struggle to get it all out. If I use the "trick" drain setup I put on the pan it's a joke. I am going to try to use a pump to draw it out.
You might think of adding a simple mechanical oil pressure gauge to double check the electric one.

 

[wsuwrhr]

The internet is a beautiful thing.

From a suggestion from a boating client I looked up the Hardin marine engine specs.

http://www.hardin-marine.com/instructions/Hardin_Marine_engines.pdf

In the manual on page 19...."Maximum temperature for this engine is 195 deg F. The engine should be run around 140 under full throttle."

From the valvecover script UCH has a 405HP version, but from the oil pan specs she has a 425 version. 430HP version looks to be an offshore only engine and the exhaust is different.

Brian

 

[wsuwrhr]

Normal water temp 120-180.

Maximum RPM 5000

 

[dread Pirate]

So the cooling system is working perfect! Time to fix the hatch.

 

[wsuwrhr]

Yes and no. "typically" one will follow the other, true. But, I like to see my motor with oil temp about 180-200 and water temp as low as possible. With that said, I'm running a different set up than you. With regards to getting the oil out, I have the same issue. I have a 12 quart pan and it's a struggle to get it all out. If I use the "trick" drain setup I put on the pan it's a joke. I am going to try to use a pump to draw it out.
You might think of adding a simple mechanical oil pressure gauge to double check the electric one.

The pan has a remote drain on it. We will see about the oil this weekend.

No need to double up gauges I don't think. I will look for the same style of SW, just a mechanical version.

 

[wsuwrhr]

So the cooling system is working perfect! Time to fix the hatch.

My sentiments exactly.

If the mechanical gauge checks good, we are golden. If it doesn't.....then it's off to the shop for a date with my forklift.

 

[Willie B]

Be careful when controlling the flow of water at the inlet side of things. I would rather control the outflow, if at all.

... On my 63 Hallett with a 406 ford the water inlet is controlled before the Neovane... I run the boat at between 140 and 160 at speed...

... On my jet day cruiser the water is controlled on the outlet side...that boat needs to maintain at least 160? operating temperature at all times... Long story...

... My Sanger runner with an LS seven BBC has no gate valve I keep an eye on the temperature gages one in each head,,,

... My Spectra 24 BBC has no gate valve either..,no issues with any of them...

 

[oldschool]

... On my 63 Hallett with a 406 ford the water inlet is controlled before the Neovane... I run the boat at between 140 and 160 at speed...

... On my jet day cruiser the water is controlled on the outlet side...that boat needs to maintain at least 160? operating temperature at all times... Long story...

... My Sanger runner with an LS seven BBC has no gate valve I keep an eye on the temperature gages one in each head,,,

... My Spectra 24 BBC has no gate valve either..,no issues with any of them...

Nice stable.

 

[warpt71]

Run a life vest strap from the hatch down into the rear seat somehow. Make it accessible from the back seat so you can buckle it when you need it secure.

My Carrera is set up similar to this, if you want I can grab some pics this weekend. Basically there is a strap the comes through the back of the seat base, by pulling up the seat cushion I am able to hook the srtap to an eyelet and pull tight. There may even be some pics here from the sale add, Ill check

 

[460]

For what's it's worth. My ford with logs idles at 160 and drops to 140
While under way. I would say you are fine temp wise.

 

[Racey]

OK. Problem is the two temps will always be related. You can't really have a "cold" engine and "hot" oil.

Oil capacity and or a combination of a oil cooler thermostat and you can :thumbsup

These guys carry the old school SW gauges. http://gilmore-global.com/

 

[wsuwrhr]

Oil capacity and or a combination of a oil cooler thermostat and you can :thumbsup

These guys carry the old school SW gauges. http://gilmore-global.com/

Oh my, that page gives me a headache.

 

[Racey]

Oh my, that page gives me a headache.

just call em, lol

 

[Sharp Shooter]

Found this in my archives from a river trip back in april 2009. We all ran down to Topock Gorge for half a day. :thumbsup

 

[wsuwrhr]

Found this in my archives from a river trip back in april 2009. We all ran down to Topock Gorge for half a day. :thumbsup

As always, solid work SS.

 

[t&y]

My Carrera is set up similar to this, if you want I can grab some pics this weekend. Basically there is a strap the comes through the back of the seat base, by pulling up the seat cushion I am able to hook the srtap to an eyelet and pull tight. There may even be some pics here from the sale add, Ill check

Who ever set that up is a real smart dude When I bought my Carrera..cough cough.. the owner had the strap going over the back seat to a hook:bash:

 

[BHC Vic]

Found this in my archives from a river trip back in april 2009. We all ran down to Topock Gorge for half a day. :thumbsup

Wonder where the Bimini went

 

[wsuwrhr]

Run a life vest strap from the hatch down into the rear seat somehow. Make it accessible from the back seat so you can buckle it when you need it secure.

My Carrera is set up similar to this, if you want I can grab some pics this weekend. Basically there is a strap the comes through the back of the seat base, by pulling up the seat cushion I am able to hook the srtap to an eyelet and pull tight. There may even be some pics here from the sale add, Ill check

Who ever set that up is a real smart dude When I bought my Carrera..cough cough.. the owner had the strap going over the back seat to a hook:bash:

For some reason, OS's post just didn't make sense until I read it again on Warps quote after his reply. Good idea.

The hatch on UCH does have a loop strap to open it. I can do exactly that, attach a strap to the loop to secure it for towing as well as sealing the gunnel vents like I did afterwards.

Brian

 

[t&y]

For some reason, OS's post just didn't make sense until I read it again on Warps quote after his reply. Good idea.

The hatch on UCH does have a loop strap to open it. I can do exactly that, attach a strap to the loop to secure it for towing as well as sealing the gunnel vents like I did afterwards.

Brian

The strap I modified was secured to the hatch. There was a hole on the back of the rear seat (about 6" round") that gave access to the rear hatch area from inside the rear seat base. So I'd close the hatch making sure the strap was dangling near the hole, pick up the rear seat, reach through and grab the strap then hook it to a "eye" hook that was affixed to the inside of the rear seat. Zero issues towing 70+ after that.

This may or may not closely resemble warpt's set up

 

[oldschool]

Typically my posts are clear as mud.

 

[wsuwrhr]

Typically my posts are clear as mud.

It's not you, it is me.

Made perfect sense the second time.

 

[oldschool]

Found this in my archives from a river trip back in april 2009. We all ran down to Topock Gorge for half a day. :thumbsup

Great pic. Can't wait to go there next month.

 

[wsuwrhr]

The strap I modified was secured to the hatch. There was a hole on the back of the rear seat (about 6" round") that gave access to the rear hatch area from inside the rear seat base. So I'd close the hatch making sure the strap was dangling near the hole, pick up the rear seat, reach through and grab the strap then hook it to a "eye" hook that was affixed to the inside of the rear seat. Zero issues towing 70+ after that.

This may or may not closely resemble warpt's set up

My setup is similar, and this is how I'll fix it. Wasn't real fond of a linear or hyd setup anyway.

UCH will never see 70 on the water and the motor will consume any air put into the engine compartment while underway.