Sand Rail vs. SxS

[HPBoats83]

I'm looking into getting back into the sand scene after about 5 years and my question is with the advancement of SxS technology/capability, what would the pros and cons be of having one vs. the other? I'm fairly aggressive behind the wheel of what ever I do; however, I have 2 young kids that would occasionally come with us.

So pros and cons in a rail vs SxS (entry level V6 long travel for around 25k or a RZR41k)

 

[Meaney77]

You are going to get a bunch of different opinions. My only advice would be to look around and really think about what you want. Sounds like your budget is around $20-25k, in my opinion that's a lot to spend on a SxS but to each their own. For that kind of dough you should be able to find a really nice off road car that would kick ass in the dirt, do well in the sand, and also be street legal. A nice baja, long travel Manx or VW thing. Keep your eyes open they are out there. Loom on race dezert, samba, Glamis dunes, and Craigslist. Good luck

 

[TPC]

Less or no wrenching with a SxS, over-the counter parts, 60 month warranty, easily turbocharged, the whole family wants to drive it and ride in it,, easy resale and it holds it's value. IMHO more fun to drive.

[video=youtube;wXiGKr6IdXU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXiGKr6IdXU[/video]

[video=youtube;6gvCi7QG3qk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gvCi7QG3qk[/video]

[/URL][/IMG]

 

[Hammer]

Less or no wrenching with a SxS, over-the counter parts, 60 month warranty, easily turbocharged, the whole family wants to drive it and ride in it,, easy resale and it holds it's value. IMHO more fun to drive.

[video=youtube;wXiGKr6IdXU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXiGKr6IdXU[/video]

[video=youtube;6gvCi7QG3qk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gvCi7QG3qk[/video]

[/URL][/IMG]

Holds it's value ? Rhinos are only worth 5 grand these days, I don't see the RZR holding its value when a new bigger/badder one comes out every year. To keep up with the jones' you'd have to upgrade every year or two so you don't lose your ass after 3 years of owning a new SxS .

The SxS are cool and all, just not 20-25k cool. Sure, they are easy to store, trailer and everyone can drive it, but IMO they are 10k overpriced for what they are. I'd go with a nice rail for that price range.

 

[throttle]

My thoughts were that I wanted a sand car. Sure 25k is a lot for a sxs. However, in my research, the guys with sand cars talk about all the extra time, work and money for maintenance. I like to keep things simple. I also didn't have a whole lot of confidence that buying a used $25k sand car was gonna be the end financially. someone else's problem soon could of been mine. The warranty on my new RZR will give me more confidence for sure.

 

[Meaney77]

Don't forget easy to finance, you can go down and get one financed including all of your aftermarket trinkets.

One thing to add- you mentioned you were a fairly aggressive driver. Regardless of what you own SxS, rail, buggy that will eventually be the demise of any things reliability.

 

[HPBoats83]

How do the SxS's do dunning compared to an entry level long travel

 

[Meaney77]

There are a ton out there and look to dune pretty well. Did you see Throttles write up? He had a good article with some good info.

 

[HPBoats83]

Don't forget easy to finance, you can go down and get one financed including all of your aftermarket trinkets.

One thing to add- you mentioned you were a fairly aggressive driver. Regardless of what you own SxS, rail, buggy that will eventually be the demise of any things reliability.

It's not so much that I'm going to beat the shit out of everything, I just like to "use" my toys. If I have a long travel there will be a little jumping for sure just as I would if I had a RZR

 

[throttle]

How do the SxS's do dunning compared to an entry level long travel

My resent test drive of the RZR xp4 1k was excellent! I wasn't trying to compare but I had been driving the dunes for several days prior to my test drive, it was not even close to the same. With all of the new changes, I was very impressed. After all, I can't afford a hundred thousand dollar sand car, I'm sure I will dump $10k into my new ride just like my last one and I hope it scratches my itch for a sandcar.

 

[HPBoats83]

My resent test drive of the RZR xp4 1k was excellent! I wasn't trying to compare but I had been driving the dunes for several days prior to my test drive, it was not even close to the same. With all of the new changes, I was very impressed. After all, I can't afford a hundred thousand dollar sand car, I'm sure I will dump $10k into my new ride just like my last one and I hope it scratches my itch for a sandcar.

I did read your write up, it was great

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[Cole Trickle]

A new rzr xp1000 4 sweater is like a swiss army knife....

It will dune right along with a v6 long travel car car. Then you can take it to the desert or mountains and use it in an area that requires 4x4.

They are not a 500hp/mendeloa Lt car but there a lot of fun and can be used everywhere.

The maintenance is easy to perform and they take a beating. My uncle went from 2 300+ HP buggies and now has a xp. He seems to like the swap as its cheaper and less work

 

[Wicky]

Would you rather own a boat or a seadoo? That said....rail hands down would be my choice....my wife thinks the SxS are cute though....just sayin'

 

[Froggystyle]

Holds it's value ? Rhinos are only worth 5 grand these days, I don't see the RZR holding its value when a new bigger/badder one comes out every year. To keep up with the jones' you'd have to upgrade every year or two so you don't lose your ass after 3 years of owning a new SxS .

More accurately, the first SxS on the market, with no four seater available, with a small, underpowered carbureted engine, congenitally weak frames and mounting points, no way to make street legal in CA, recalled due to tendency to roll over, is only worth 50% of it's new purchase price after 7 years.

They were only $10k new for the big one. No rebates, no haggling... They couldn't keep them in stock.

What percentage of new price do you think an '06 GSXR 600 is worth today? Or an '06 Camry?

Shit depreciates, and yes, progress and time marches on. The new SxS aren't hardly anything like the first ones. They are powerful, refined, have awesome suspensions and seats stock, have well built cages and are probably 10x safer than the one that I early-adopted.

Ross has it right... And he's had all of the above.

 

[BDMar]

I've owned sand rails, quads, dirt bikes my whole life. All my friends, including my daughter and son in law, have SXS's. My Daughte rand son in law have a brand new RZR just done up by SDR and with paddles. Beautiful piece of equipment.
We just spent 5 days in Glamis and there is no comparison. Hands down Sand rail. The big dunes are soft this time of year and the RZR will not make it up all of them.
They definitely have their place and some advantages. Just no comparison performance wise. Put 4 adults in a SXS and 4 adults in a rail.....

 

[Flyinbowtie]

I was into rails for 20 years. I got out right as the LT cars were hitting the sand in big numbers. I drove a couple of BuckShot cars, and a couple of others.
I, too like to go fast. Really fast. The most fun you can have on the sand, IMHO, is finding the steepest, longest, smoothest hill there is, idle up to the bottom and stand on the gas, and see how fast you can be going before it is time to lift, then just tickling the steering brake, and a little wheel, and spin it around..
Nothing like it with 6-800 HP behind you. Nothing.
That said many of the sand cars today are maint. nightmares, they've grown too big, too heavy, and too damn full of gizmos. And too expensive. And when they break...$$$$
If there is more than sand in your vacation plans, if you like to run fire roads, explore the mountains or desert other than dunes, then you need to look past the sand cars. If those activities are in your plans, then I'd get a SXS or a Manx.
If sand only...I would get a sand car.
I will close with this...we've seen more country, explored more ghost towns, and generally had more fun with our lowly long-travel Teryx than I thought was possible. If I ever give it up it might be for a tricked out Samurai or something, but I will never go back to a single-purpose vehicle again.

 

[Froggystyle]

I was into rails for 20 years. I got out right as the LT cars were hitting the sand in big numbers. I drove a couple of BuckShot cars, and a couple of others.
I, too like to go fast. Really fast. The most fun you can have on the sand, IMHO, is finding the steepest, longest, smoothest hill there is, idle up to the bottom and stand on the gas, and see how fast you can be going before it is time to lift, then just tickling the steering brake, and a little wheel, and spin it around..
Nothing like it with 6-800 HP behind you. Nothing.
That said many of the sand cars today are maint. nightmares, they've grown too big, too heavy, and too damn full of gizmos. And too expensive. And when they break...$$$$
If there is more than sand in your vacation plans, if you like to run fire roads, explore the mountains or desert other than dunes, then you need to look past the sand cars. If those activities are in your plans, then I'd get a SXS or a Manx.
If sand only...I would get a sand car.
I will close with this...we've seen more country, explored more ghost towns, and generally had more fun with our lowly long-travel Teryx than I thought was possible. If I ever give it up it might be for a tricked out Samurai or something, but I will never go back to a single-purpose vehicle again.

Agreed 100%. On all counts.

I am trying to get the Manx done now, and I'm hoping to be in the market for an aging, non-competitive Class 1 like 4 seat buggy for the family.

I don't like sand anywhere near as much as I like hard pack, and fuck the crowds as they exist today at the dunes. It makes 4th of July at the river look like a Yanni concert.

I'm looking forward to having a house in the keys with a garage for the buggy.

And a plane to get there with.

 

[77charger]

IMO if you plan on mostly dunes then go for the sand rail many great deals out there.Something with a 4 seater v6/091 combo can be had for a great price.The v8s LTs will tear up transmissions alot faster and other parts.

The pluses of a rail are better for a family of 4 no doubt.More room and power to start with.

As far as maintenance there isnt as much as people make it sound change oil here and there,check cvs each season,good look over the whole car here and there and drive it.SxSs also break stuff as well they too will need oil changes and look overs.Like anything abuse it then stuff will wear out or break.

If your main use is desert trails then you may want to consider a SxS.Remember too if go with a razor xp4 you will be buying seats,belts,roof,doors,tires,etc before you even start going out a used sand rail will most likely already have all that.

 

[HPBoats83]

IMO if you plan on mostly dunes then go for the sand rail many great deals out there.Something with a 4 seater v6/091 combo can be had for a great price.The v8s LTs will tear up transmissions alot faster and other parts.

The pluses of a rail are better for a family of 4 no doubt.More room and power to start with.

As far as maintenance there isnt as much as people make it sound change oil here and there,check cvs each season,good look over the whole car here and there and drive it.SxSs also break stuff as well they too will need oil changes and look overs.Like anything abuse it then stuff will wear out or break.

If your main use is desert trails then you may want to consider a SxS.Remember too if go with a razor xp4 you will be buying seats,belts,roof,doors,tires,etc before you even start going out a used sand rail will most likely already have all that.

Thanks for the input, what about suspension maintenance (rebuilding coilovers, heims, etc..) what's up with that?


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[LowRiver2]

Thanks for the input, what about suspension maintenance (rebuilding coilovers, heims, etc..) what's up with that?


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77 Charger is one of the few guys I know that can run a rail on a budget similar to a SXS. His set up is righteous fun for the buck less than most SxS. However, most rail guys run a set up much more expensive/and time consuming service wise than his rail too(and probably dont have as much fun). Being a boater first, I've found the number of guys that run a sand car and boat shrink drastically in the last 5 years. Very few LS/LT big brand sand car owners that own boats. Service costs is the main reason I hear when asked why "dual sporting" guys dump rails for SxS's and jeeps.
The amenities on some of the new sxs's have taken away the need for some aftermarket items. The new rzr seats are pretty nice for stock.
2 sxs's over last 7 years, I've spent 10 times more wrenching/servicing sessions on friend's rails than my sxs's, fwiw.

 

[throttle]

I've owned sand rails, quads, dirt bikes my whole life. All my friends, including my daughter and son in law, have SXS's. My Daughte rand son in law have a brand new RZR just done up by SDR and with paddles. Beautiful piece of equipment.
We just spent 5 days in Glamis and there is no comparison. Hands down Sand rail. The big dunes are soft this time of year and the RZR will not make it up all of them.
They definitely have their place and some advantages. Just no comparison performance wise. Put 4 adults in a SXS and 4 adults in a rail.....

I would agree with most of this, sand car or rail all day long would be nice if I could spend a hundred grand on one. I can't so to get my fix, the new RZR is prolly as close as I can get. I didn't hit a dune that I couldn't go over.

I agree that there is no comparison, however... I was thinking we op was comparing a $25k sand car to a new $25k sxs.

 

[Aaron]

You may want to look into a Buckshot bullet. Has the cost and versatility of a higher end SxS but has a little more kick in the pants and can fit the family. Just my opinion

 

[77charger]

77 Charger is one of the few guys I know that can run a rail on a budget similar to a SXS. His set up is righteous fun for the buck less than most SxS. However, most rail guys run a set up much more expensive/and time consuming service wise than his rail too(and probably dont have as much fun). Being a boater first, I've found the number of guys that run a sand car and boat shrink drastically in the last 5 years. Very few LS/LT big brand sand car owners that own boats. Service costs is the main reason I hear when asked why "dual sporting" guys dump rails for SxS's and jeeps.
The amenities on some of the new sxs's have taken away the need for some aftermarket items. The new rzr seats are pretty nice for stock.
2 sxs's over last 7 years, I've spent 10 times more wrenching/servicing sessions on friend's rails than my sxs's, fwiw.

It helps that i do all my own work for the most part i built my beam car from bare frame and did my own motor as well and upgraded stuff a little at a time as money allowed.I will say i have less than 10k into my car total.

After every trip i pull car out and go over every thing most times its just a look over,oil gets changed every 3 trips,gear oil before every season,cvs checked once a year,valves adjusted usually at beginning of season and checked mid season.I would guess i spend less than 150 bucks a year for maintenance.

My brother has a nice trick racing LT car 450hp ls1 2d trans i also get more time driving mine than he does yes his car is fast and takes the bumps very good but last season he finally got his trans fixed went out had a problem with motor tune up not much he could do til he gets it to a shop with a computer.Year before he blew out trans,year before that he had issues with a trans rebuild from transworks it was popping out of gear in 3rd or 4th took two tries and still not fixed then it went boom.Rancho finally fixed it right(just before last season)

I dont compare in power and handling but like you say fun factor and reliabilty i'll take anytime anyday.From what i learned is that if you want to drive and have fun a lower hp rail is the way do not overpower a trans and drivetrain and they will be low maintenance.Like i said any v6 will do the job fine.

 

[77charger]

Thanks for the input, what about suspension maintenance (rebuilding coilovers, heims, etc..) what's up with that?


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I dont run coil overs as of yet but what guy at makenzies told me dont worry about it til you see oil leaking then get them rebuilt.Some of the best money that can be spent is getting your suspension dialed in and that goes for anything(rail,quads,razors,etc).When it comes to heims i aint running any still using the international tie rods for front end but i hear they tend to be a lil noisy.My guess is not worry til they start to get loose then change them out.

 

[HPBoats83]

It helps that i do all my own work for the most part i built my beam car from bare frame and did my own motor as well and upgraded stuff a little at a time as money allowed.I will say i have less than 10k into my car total.

After every trip i pull car out and go over every thing most times its just a look over,oil gets changed every 3 trips,gear oil before every season,cvs checked once a year,valves adjusted usually at beginning of season and checked mid season.I would guess i spend less than 150 bucks a year for maintenance.

My brother has a nice trick racing LT car 450hp ls1 2d trans i also get more time driving mine than he does yes his car is fast and takes the bumps very good but last season he finally got his trans fixed went out had a problem with motor tune up not much he could do til he gets it to a shop with a computer.Year before he blew out trans,year before that he had issues with a trans rebuild from transworks it was popping out of gear in 3rd or 4th took two tries and still not fixed then it went boom.Rancho finally fixed it right(just before last season)

I dont compare in power and handling but like you say fun factor and reliabilty i'll take anytime anyday.From what i learned is that if you want to drive and have fun a lower hp rail is the way do not overpower a trans and drivetrain and they will be low maintenance.Like i said any v6 will do the job fine.

I dont run coil overs as of yet but what guy at makenzies told me dont worry about it til you see oil leaking then get them rebuilt.Some of the best money that can be spent is getting your suspension dialed in and that goes for anything(rail,quads,razors,etc).When it comes to heims i aint running any still using the international tie rods for front end but i hear they tend to be a lil noisy.My guess is not worry til they start to get loose then change them out.

Good info, thank you.

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[77charger]

The Honda v6 seem to be a very good motor in a buggy stock their 260 hp if paired with a mendeola even better. But a well prepped 091 will do you just got to treat it well don't try to pop clutch to wheelie avoid slamming they whoops where wheels come off ground and you are on the gas.

The Subis do good to ESP with a turbo. Just think of bravo being an 091 with a mild big block it can last. The 2e mendi a lil stronger. The 2d like the next stronger bravo. And the fortin or albins are the number 6 drives.

 

[Wicky]

Less or no wrenching with a SxS, over-the counter parts, 60 month warranty, easily turbocharged, the whole family wants to drive it and ride in it,, easy resale and it holds it's value. IMHO more fun to drive.

[video=youtube;wXiGKr6IdXU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXiGKr6IdXU[/video]

[video=youtube;6gvCi7QG3qk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gvCi7QG3qk[/video]

[/URL][/IMG]

Huge air??? Really? Cough cough...

I'm into my buggy for less than $10K...Haven't been beat by an LS car yet going up a dune at St Anthonys and flat out walk away from the SxSs. Actually, I haven't seen a SxS make it up choke cherry yet either.
RIP Big Jim Hale....He was a pioneer and built some of the very first sandrails ever in socal

 

[TPC]

Holds it's value ? Rhinos are only worth 5 grand these days, I don't see the RZR holding its value when a new bigger/badder one comes out every year. To keep up with the jones' you'd have to upgrade every year or two so you don't lose your ass after 3 years of owning a new SxS .

The SxS are cool and all, just not 20-25k cool. Sure, they are easy to store, trailer and everyone can drive it, but IMO they are 10k overpriced for what they are. I'd go with a nice rail for that price range.

Bought my XP900 for $15.000, sold it 3 years later for $13.500. That ain't no farm implement Rhino. The day of people buying Rhinos and dropping another $12.000 in options ended when the Rzr S hit the market and you know that.
I had a $190 roof, five point belts and a $120 LED light. I kept the sand tires and wheels for our next Rzr.

More power to ya if ya want a clunky, boring, limited-in-what-you-can-do-with-it old rail.
BTW: The last three rail roll-overs our riding group has seen had a dead person strapped into them.
The last 3 Rzr roll-over we've seen or rolled ourselves we righted the Rzr and it continued on with the trip un damaged, all safe.

 

[TPC]

Huge air??? Really? Cough cough...

I'm into my buggy for less than $10K...Haven't been beat by an LS car yet going up a dune at St Anthonys and flat out walk away from the SxSs. Actually, I haven't seen a SxS make it up choke cherry yet either. View attachment 301516 View attachment 301517 View attachment 301518 View attachment 301519 View attachment 301520
RIP Big Jim Hale....He was a pioneer and built some of the very first sandrails ever in socal

You roll that thing and you're going to get killed in it. Good thing you'll be alone because no passengers want to ride along.
And, cough,,, cough,, let's see a video of you jumping a better, bigger jump.
Ahhhh, maybe not,,, Huh. That'll never happen.
Broken welds,, snapped,, cracked frame, broken axle.
Cough, cough cough yeah,, right you'll jump it.

I'll digress from this thread until I see a video of you getting bigger air.

 

[hav19]

Huge air??? Really? Cough cough...

I'm into my buggy for less than $10K...Haven't been beat by an LS car yet going up a dune at St Anthonys and flat out walk away from the SxSs. Actually, I haven't seen a SxS make it up choke cherry yet either.

Well My SxS was a little Hot Rodded but I made it up Choke Cherry a bunch of times even with passengers

[video=youtube;vIASK_LG3qw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIASK_LG3qw"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIASK_LG3qw[/video]


As Far as the Question at hand - I've had both (at the same time) both were a blast to drive! Both require repairs and maintenance to stay running correctly and be reliable -- I loved my LT Blown Rail but the only time it came out of the garage was at the dunes (6 times a year if I was lucky) My RZR I drove on the street, off road and the Dunes -- Just as in boating, I seem to drive to the limits of whatever I'm in and have a blast doing it, so no matter what you decide - Don't Worry you're going to Love it!!

 

[Luvnlife]

IMO if you plan on mostly dunes then go for the sand rail many great deals out there.Something with a 4 seater v6/091 combo can be had for a great price.The v8s LTs will tear up transmissions alot faster and other parts.

The pluses of a rail are better for a family of 4 no doubt.More room and power to start with.

As far as maintenance there isnt as much as people make it sound change oil here and there,check cvs each season,good look over the whole car here and there and drive it.SxSs also break stuff as well they too will need oil changes and look overs.Like anything abuse it then stuff will wear out or break.

If your main use is desert trails then you may want to consider a SxS.Remember too if go with a razor xp4 you will be buying seats,belts,roof,doors,tires,etc before you even start going out a used sand rail will most likely already have all that.

Along these lines. I think rails versus sxs are apples and oranges. Where we ride dirtbikes the good trails are to narrow for rails. When I'm gone on my dirtbike the wife can jump in her Rhino, no drama and cruise wherever she wants. If we had a rail we would be going to a different riding area. Don't get me wrong I would like to add a rail to the fleet but I'm toyed out.

 

[SJP]

I have had a VW platform rail (in avatar), currently have a rhino that I bought in 06, and just got a RZR 1KXP4. A couple of my thoughts and experiences.

1. In a previous life I had access to a full garage, AV gas on site, master rail mechanic, all of this was on the dessert range, storage for the sand car, parts stocked, and his daughter was easy on the eye. So owning and operating a sand car was a lot of fun. If all of the stars do not align in my opinion the 1 trick pony is a pain in the ass. Bottom line is we were always wrenching, we had all the best people, facilities and did not have to worry about transport or storage. I do not know how people justify just pushing the cars around their shop when they are not using them.

2. The new XP is awesome. The technology has come Soooooo far. I have to be honest with you I was a little leery at first going back and forth asking myself why should I get a new SXS. Rhino has been bullet proof. We do primarily 95% use in our backyard in LHC and not needing a ton of speed. The XP machine can go over a 6 inch straight curb into the open dessert (I honestly did not feel it cross). It is awesome. The speed, power, safety of operating with 4 people. Glad we took the plunge.

3. A lot of friends have asked me about the Rhino. Honestly I think I am going to keep it. Still is plated for the street. Great ride for guests. Small footprint in the garage. My boys need something to learn how to drive (4-5 -> 7-8 years old overnight). It is dependable. I think they are worth every bit of the 5-7k people are asking for them.

SJP

 

[Froggystyle]

Along these lines. I think rails versus sxs are apples and oranges.

Not when the question is... should I get one or the other.

Where we ride dirtbikes the good trails are to narrow for rails. When I'm gone on my dirtbike the wife can jump in her Rhino, no drama and cruise wherever she wants. If we had a rail we would be going to a different riding area. Don't get me wrong I would like to add a rail to the fleet but I'm toyed out.

I'm learning with the hot rod V-drive right now that it is an awesome second boat. That I probably need a competition ski boat to be my utility boat that I take out the majority of the time without issue, without worry, without noise. The kid will dig it, momma will love it.

In this analogy, the comp boat is like the SXS... it does everything you want or need a boat to do, will cost a similar amount for a nice one, and basically everyone but me will have more fun. The Spectra is the TT,LS,LT rail... purpose built, aggro, extraordinarily fast, hard to maintain, always trying to sink, always trying to break stuff or get me wet, and if I go over it'll probably kill me.

Nobody's saying there isn't a place in life for a rail... or a hot rod V-drive... it's just something you get if you already have a nice SxS in the garage and you can afford it.

I may have to sell the Spectra to get a boat that I can use more for skiing and hanging out. The TT Spectra is an animal, and unless I can figure out how to afford two nice boats, one of them has to go to get the other.

 

[squirtnmyload]

If i was planning on doing the sand thing only and with that budget, without question i would be in the sand rail market. Reliable v6 , long travel.

Sxs's are definately more versitile and i had a shitload of fun with my rzr in the deserts, till i moved to the mountains. Forest roads bored me to death, to big for the hundreds of miles atv trail system(limited to 50 inches width), can't ride on the reservation, too cold most of the time, too much snow in the winter, wife didn't want to go, rains most every day from july-sept, and so on. Since i was spending all my time in the woods, I ended up dumping the sxs and buying a jeep, when people thought i was an idiot, and i couldn't be happier

I guess what i'm getting at is decide the vehicles main purpose, and go with what best suits it.

You can always pick up a tricked out rhino for a deal nowadays if the need arises down the road, and maybe have both!

 

[OutCole'd]

My Rhino was fun, went anywhere, always ran, etc. i just got tired of the open cockpit like a rail. Get's cold where we ride. Jeeps are slow, i'd like to get back into a baja bug or Thing. Fairly dependable, easy to work on, faster than a jeep, and WINDOWS!

 

[Meaney77]

Lots of good info and opinions here. I think Froggy had a great analogy between boats, to each their own. At the end of the day go with whatever you think will best suit your needs.

 

[77charger]

You roll that thing and you're going to get killed in it. Good thing you'll be alone because no passengers want to ride along.
And, cough,,, cough,, let's see a video of you jumping a better, bigger jump.
Ahhhh, maybe not,,, Huh. That'll never happen.
Broken welds,, snapped,, cracked frame, broken axle.
Cough, cough cough yeah,, right you'll jump it.

I'll digress from this thread until I see a video of you getting bigger air.

My beam car can jump but none of the stuff you claim that will happen happened.Another thing you saying none have been killed in UTV roll overs?Alot of buggy rollovers do involve high speeds at which a utv cant compare in the dunes and the what kills a person in a buggy rollover will probably kill any other vehichle as well

Alot of the razors you see jumping i am sure are not stock off the floor models they too have weak points i know 2 who have bent frames on the xps of course they probably did something they shouldnt have tried though.All comes down to what has been upgraded.

Each have their purpose if i was to do all desert them yes a side x side would fit me better but i got a dirtbike for that.

 

[Hammer]

More accurately, the first SxS on the market, with no four seater available, with a small, underpowered carbureted engine, congenitally weak frames and mounting points, no way to make street legal in CA, recalled due to tendency to roll over, is only worth 50% of it's new purchase price after 7 years.

They were only $10k new for the big one. No rebates, no haggling... They couldn't keep them in stock.

What percentage of new price do you think an '06 GSXR 600 is worth today? Or an '06 Camry?

Shit depreciates, and yes, progress and time marches on. The new SxS aren't hardly anything like the first ones. They are powerful, refined, have awesome suspensions and seats stock, have well built cages and are probably 10x safer than the one that I early-adopted.

Ross has it right... And he's had all of the above.

Bought my XP900 for $15.000, sold it 3 years later for $13.500. That ain't no farm implement Rhino. The day of people buying Rhinos and dropping another $12.000 in options ended when the Rzr S hit the market and you know that.
I had a $190 roof, five point belts and a $120 LED light. I kept the sand tires and wheels for our next Rzr.

More power to ya if ya want a clunky, boring, limited-in-what-you-can-do-with-it old rail.
BTW: The last three rail roll-overs our riding group has seen had a dead person strapped into them.
The last 3 Rzr roll-over we've seen or rolled ourselves we righted the Rzr and it continued on with the trip un damaged, all safe.

You both make valid points , if I had kids or a wife I would look into a SxS so the wife and kid can go for rides by themselves and I know they would be safe . Only way I could justify the price tag. If I go to the desert I have my jeep and/or my dirt bike and they both work well for me and what I want to do . When I go to Glamis I have my tricked out quad and I don't need extra seats, I will go the sandrail route eventually for my next sand toy. I also think it depends on what ATV's your group has. All my friends have dirt bikes,quads and rails. Over the years we've gone from just dirt bikes to quads and now sandrails .

Only reason some of them went the rail route was to bring dune sluts along. Being single my needs in toys are different than yours. It makes more sense to me to get a sand sprite , mazzone for 5-8 grand over a 15k SxS . The only thing I will finance in the future is a home or a vehicle or both.

My point is it depends on where you are in life, something like Wes' Spectra would suit me perfectly for instance and a ski boat would work better for him now that Carly is in the picture.

Good analogy comparing the v-drive to a rail Froggy.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I've had both. Several Funcos, Sand Cars Unlimited, etc over the years as well as a 800 and now a 900 RZR. There is nothing that compares with slamming my Funco into a turn grabbing the turn brake and then nailing a 700 hp blown LS3 coming out of the turn into a wheelie. It's pretty intoxicating. That being said, considering a new Funco will set you back way north of $100,000 and then you need a stacker trailer to get your buggy and RZR to the dunes plus all of the work on a buggy before during and after a dune trip, I'll admit the new powerful side by sides are hard to beat for money versus fun versus low maintenance.

 

[overdue]

Sand Rail vs. SxS,,,,,,
get the SxS,,,when they finally close glamis because of all the assholes out there, you have something you can still use

 

[Racey]

If all you are going to do is go to the dunes, get a rail, if you are going to spend a large amount of your time in the desert or other terrain the sxs is probably better.

Unless your rail is pretty stout you are gonna have to baby it in the desert somewhat. And even then you are still limited to at the most gnarly old race courses and washes. If you get into some place where the trails narrow and start getting steep and crawly you are screwed in a car, you can't turn the thing around, and they don't crawl well. A sxs will kick that things ass the amount of different terrain you can navigate while enjoying it.

 

[Froggystyle]

If all you are going to do is go to the dunes, get a rail...

And a life.

With everything we have available to us in terms of riding terrain, going all in on the most fickle, season limited, crowded and oppressed riding area under the most legal scrutiny is absurd.

 

[squirtnmyload]

And a life.

With everything we have available to us in terms of riding terrain, going all in on the most fickle, season limited, crowded and oppressed riding area under the most legal scrutiny is absurd.

Lol, not that i don't somewhat agree with you but maybe he has the same opinion about people that go to the river, havasu, or the same lakes every weekend.

Maybe people think the same about me going skiing every weekend in the winter.

I know people that never even take the paddles off of their sxs's, quads and bikes. They live for the dunes and they go all year long. To each their own. Its not my cup o tea, but if it was i'd go the sand rail route too.

 

[BDMar]

I would agree with most of this, sand car or rail all day long would be nice if I could spend a hundred grand on one. I can't so to get my fix, the new RZR is prolly as close as I can get. I didn't hit a dune that I couldn't go over.

I agree that there is no comparison, however... I was thinking we op was comparing a $25k sand car to a new $25k sxs.

Hi Cameron,
You would be amazed at the bargains out there. My car and trailer are both 2006 and like new. Bought them as a package one year ago for 23K. Not a big name brand car but light with 18" travel and kings all around. Mendeola trans, u-joint style axles (no CV's ) v-6 "shortstar", 4 seater, 22' racer enclosed trailer, etc. Medium travel car that is an amazing dune car. Not gonna keep up with the LT cars in the whoops, but excellent dune car.
Definitely not a dirt car but that's not what I wanted.
Point is, there are excellent deals out there. Figure out what vehicle fits your needs, then spend some time and search. For me, there was no decision. All sand = car. Trails would be SxS. Dual purpose desert and sand would also be a car.
This is what works for me.

 

[Luvnlife]

You both make valid points , if I had kids or a wife I would look into a SxS so the wife and kid can go for rides by themselves and I know they would be safe . Only way I could justify the price tag. If I go to the desert I have my jeep and/or my dirt bike and they both work well for me and what I want to do . When I go to Glamis I have my tricked out quad and I don't need extra seats, I will go the sandrail route eventually for my next sand toy. I also think it depends on what ATV's your group has. All my friends have dirt bikes,quads and rails. Over the years we've gone from just dirt bikes to quads and now sandrails .

Only reason some of them went the rail route was to bring dune sluts along. Being single my needs in toys are different than yours. It makes more sense to me to get a sand sprite , mazzone for 5-8 grand over a 15k SxS . The only thing I will finance in the future is a home or a vehicle or both.

My point is it depends on where you are in life, something like Wes' Spectra would suit me perfectly for instance and a ski boat would work better for him now that Carly is in the picture.

Good analogy comparing the v-drive to a rail Froggy.

Noted, dune sluts:thumbsup

 

[rivermobster]

I'm looking into getting back into the sand scene after about 5 years and my question is with the advancement of SxS technology/capability, what would the pros and cons be of having one vs. the other? I'm fairly aggressive behind the wheel of what ever I do; however, I have 2 young kids that would occasionally come with us.

So pros and cons in a rail vs SxS (entry level V6 long travel for around 25k or a RZR41k)

Side by side

Pros: Fits in the back of a truck and a small toy hauler. Very easy to transport. This is the number one reason people buy em. Easy to drive. At 50 inches wide, they can go on most quad trails (and quad people HATE that they can). Good on fuel. Can be converted to carry four people. Lots and lots of available accessories. If you are already a very experienced duner, you can get them to work decent in the sand.

Cons: Major lack of power in the sand. Very small and cramped. There are ALREADY laws in place that have made the ones that have been converted to four seaters illegal, but are not yet being enforced. High center of gravity. Very expensive to modify correctly (to keep the stock reliability). Stock suspension will beat the crap outa you (compared to any sandrail). Very easy to get hurt in one, due to the cramped design. If you get stuck in the sand, good luck.

I'm think'n for 25k you could buy a bitchin mid travel turbo subie. I have a couple of friends with em, and they never ever work on the things.

Pros: Killer power to weight ratio. They can go up any hill you can find. Lots of room for tools and ice chests and any thing you would want to take on a long ride. Cadillac suspension. Easily seat four adults. Fun as fuck to fly around the dunes or the hardpack. Very good on fuel. No race gas required. Easy to get unstuck with two guys. Well built roll cage and chassi will keep you all very safe. Hand restraints, quality seats and five point harnesses will make sure nobody gets hurt. Tons of power to spare. You'll be loving life at St Anthonys.

Cons: For a good sized four seater, youll need a min 30 foot toy hauler, and a ford tow boss to be legal. (sand rails should Always be backed into a trailer so the weight is distributed right) Motor homes with enclosed trailers work good as well, but motor homes have minimal tow capacity and up VERY long. A class C with a diesel would work real nice, but they dont have a whole lot of room. Costs big money to transport em right. You can always use luv2camp to have a trailer ready for you when you show up, and just use a truck and a flat bed trailer. Just depends how comfy you want to be. Your friends are gonna Always wanna hang out with you cause they know you have a dependable ride! Fuel consumption will be high cause you'll be driving the crap outa it. Your gonna spend a ton of money out having fun.


Good luck! :thumbsup

 

[Wicky]

You roll that thing and you're going to get killed in it. Good thing you'll be alone because no passengers want to ride along.
And, cough,,, cough,, let's see a video of you jumping a better, bigger jump.
Ahhhh, maybe not,,, Huh. That'll never happen.
Broken welds,, snapped,, cracked frame, broken axle.
Cough, cough cough yeah,, right you'll jump it.

I'll digress from this thread until I see a video of you getting bigger air.

I never claimed to catch "huge air" as your video caption describes. The cough cough comment was regarding your self proclaimed "Huge Air" which, IMO was definitely not "huge air." I kind of think of it like the video captioned, "stock 454 jet boat that does 100mph." But, once again, that is just my opinion.
Sorry, no vids of my current car yet and the only huge air I have ever obtained was on my dirt bikes. Guaranteed, my new car will and has left the ground and there are no broken welds snapped, or cracked frame and no, no broken axles. Cars nor SxSs were never built to catch "huge air." Bikes on the other hand.....well, they were and do actually catch huge air. Here are some pics of me catching "small air" in past cars. Oh yeah, I had a line of people waiting for rides last time I had my new car out and believe it or not, everyone lived to tell about their ride....I'm not here for a "huge air" pissing match because no matter what form you are catching "huge air" in, eventually, something will break even in an unlimited class 10 car and somebody will always catch bigger air than you or I!! Sorry I ruffled your feathers.

 

[Enen]

I'll throw my .02 in this. I agree w TPC, grab a RZR 1K and call it done.

There were a lot of shops that started building rails in the home equity crazy days of '05, '06. Just because a car has King shocks and the wheel will travel 18 inches doesn't mean the suspension geometry was properly designed. There were guys that knew how to bend tube and weld that became LT rail builders. They essentially copied a design that was copied from another builder, a lot like performance boats.

The way the suspension travels is IMO is equally as important as how many inches of travel you have. Polaris or Can-Am have the engineering down solid. There are LT Rail shops that really know their stuff, but their cars ain't cheap.

 

[Racey]

And a life.

With everything we have available to us in terms of riding terrain, going all in on the most fickle, season limited, crowded and oppressed riding area under the most legal scrutiny is absurd.

Going to Glamis on pretty much every weekend excluding the holidays, and staying for a couple of the weekdays is pretty much impossible to beat riding wise. Legal scrutiny is pretty much non existent on non holidays, especially during the week. It's fucking great when it's great, and it sucks when it sucks. But the riding is impossible to get anywhere else. Desert and Sand riding are two totally different things, it would be like comparing offshore to river boating, not saying which is which, just that they are two totally different styles, some people dig one, others dig the other, some like a little of both. Like I said, if you are a sand guy, and all you want to do is the sand, then the sand car is unbeatable, but just don't plan on using it anywhere else.


Sand dunes are riding in 2 dimensions you pick the line, desert is riding in 1 you are on a trail. They both have their good and bad points. Different Strokes, i love both, but I wouldn't give up one for the other. And for people that are going to just have 1 ride, the new UTV's are pretty hard to beat. They do both the desert and the sand well, but neither great. it's a trade off. Where they really excel is in technical and slow trails, crawling etc. And that opens up an entire new set of riding options, getting up into the pines etc.



BTW if i had a SxS the first thing i'd be doing would be replacing that stock cage, those things are flimsy pieces of crap. I've seen more than one "wrecked" rzr with all 4 wheels attached and drivable but the cage is smashed into the cockpit.

 

[RiverDave]

I find myself gravitating towards the sxs market.. That being said in 75 my old man bout a vs powered rail from a trapper for 3/4k.. That thing ran every trail in Parker and all we did was change the oil in it for decades.. In 2012 we sold it for 4k.

In 2010 I bought a teryx for 12k.. Had around another 12-15 into it in upgrades etc.. Sold it in 2013 for 12k after 3 motors..

I'm not seeing the low maintenance sxs program.. Compared to a cruiser old school rail.

For the sand only rail all day long.. For desert and occasional sand I would think a sxs hands down.