RPM Boats

[Ocean goer]

According to Facebook (take it for what its worth) RPM is having some trouble. Post copied and pasted below.

"Hey all, just letting everyone know we are no longer building the RPM outboard boat. This is a result of extremely poor communication and customer service. Leading us to have no confidence the boat would be completed as promised. Since requesting our money back we have been cussed at and hung up on. I would strongly caution anyone considering doing business with RPM. We are now the 2nd customer in a row to ask for their money back. We are now taking necessary steps to collect our cash deposit."

I can back up this post with my horrible experience with “new RPM builder”
We bought the last RPM Steve built #15 from Joe Malich with the intent the boat would be done in less with 6 weeks.
After looking at the boat and signing PO writing a check for 22k (which was cashed and cleared with 48 hours) as deposits we thought we were going to get a bad ass boat. One week later we over nighted Joe Malich the remaining balance 83k that was cashed with less then 48 hours that was given to him. With PO in hand and parts that we were promised at the time of the signed PO things started to change.
It was excuse after excuse for more then 4 weeks of what was not happening and what we were where not getting.
Finally after so much BS I called it off and demanding our money back, which Joe Malich did deliver in a weeks time only shorting us $400.00 and some wanna be lawyer he had write up to make himself feel better about the situation.
We decided not to make a stink about it, I wish would have!
Joe Malich bought these molds with no business plan whatsoever, he should sell the molds so these boats can be produced because I am a firm believer this is one of the baddest 26’ boat on the market.
Buyers beware!!!!!!

 

[pwerwagn]

Hard to read

I like the "boat show display discount" of 100,600$.

I remember talking to Steve years ago about building a twin 300xs RPM. He was super excited to try it. One of my favorite looking hulls, with the performance to back it up!

 

[Carrera205]

I like the "boat show display discount" of 100,600$.

Right. Smoking deal. The RW post just got deleted after the buyer was getting schooled. He only
Paid part of his promised deposit and is mad the builder isn't moving forward. I wouldn't either. He is trying to "pay as you go" which tells me he doesn't or can't come up with the money. And he tired to
Use public humiliation to get out of his contract. I hope RPM takes him to court. And wins. I don't blame RPM one bit. The last thing a builder wants is to be sitting there with a personalized boat trying to sell it to someone else. If my memory serves correct Jim cole had the same thing happen to him. Sitting on a custom boat. The builder probably had to write a check to get it strung and it was gona bounce because the buyer didn't pay up. Maybe he didn't have the money to pay for it himself (builder). Doesn't matter. I know I wouldn't want to owe anyone in the marine industry money so I don't blame the builder For stoping before getting it strung.

 

[Ouderkirk]

This whole deal is so outside of what I would consider normal business practices.

The idea that one is doing a "pay as you go" arrangement is perculiar to me and it seems to lead to exactly where the two parties are now.

 

[Ocean goer]

The last 30 days we have been waiting for $ you said you had. You signed a purchase contract. You were short on $. You have serial numbers and everything you needed. You kept promising $ and it never came. your dad was even going to co-sign for you. Is any of this sound familiar? I have more texts to freshen your memory.

I don’t believe a word you are saying Joe, I gave you 105k within a week of each other. After you got our money all I heard was excuse after excuse on why the boat couldn’t get done. You are a liar and nothing but a used cars salesman!
You should sale the molds to someone who can really build them and go back to selling peoples stuff for them like you do!
I keep all the text messages so don’t call my bluff otherwise I will post!!!!!!!
Have a great day, give Andrew back his money and sell the molds!!!!

 

[Enen]

I can back up this post with my horrible experience with “new RPM builder”
We bought the last RPM Steve built #15 from Joe Malich with the intent the boat would be done in less with 6 weeks.
After looking at the boat and signing PO writing a check for 22k (which was cashed and cleared with 48 hours) as deposits we thought we were going to get a bad ass boat. One week later we over nighted Joe Malich the remaining balance 83k that was cashed with less then 48 hours that was given to him. With PO in hand and parts that we were promised at the time of the signed PO things started to change.
It was excuse after excuse for more then 4 weeks of what was not happening and what we were where not getting.
Finally after so much BS I called it off and demanding our money back, which Joe Malich did deliver in a weeks time only shorting us $400.00 and some wanna be lawyer he had write up to make himself feel better about the situation.
We decided not to make a stink about it, I wish would have!
Joe Malich bought these molds with no business plan whatsoever, he should sell the molds so these boats can be produced because I am a firm believer this is one of the baddest 26’ boat on the market.
Buyers beware!!!!!!

So you bought a boat, cancelled the sale, had to sign a contract outlining the termination of the sale and the refund ( written by a lawyer) and got back $ 104,600? What exactly should a buyer beware about?

 

[Carrera205]

This whole deal is so outside of what I would consider normal business practices.

The idea that one is doing a "pay as you go" arrangement is perculiar to me and it seems to lead to exactly where the two parties are now.

Well the original down payment was 45k and the buyer only Paid up 27.5 and is mad that the build hasn't gone further. Now he wants more
Work done and isn't paying the remaining 17.5. The buyer is trying to do pay as you go and the builder isn't having it. Being that RPM is new I'm sure the builder doesn't have 200k laying around to just build the boat. And then get paid when it's completed. He needed the money from the complete down payment to start. And then when homeboy got his financing completed he'd need the remaining amount to complete the build. That seems reasonable. Where RPM failed is starting without the full down payment. Where the buyer failed is requesting a schedule and where the money would be distributed thruought the build. But it doesn't seem like he was worried about that at first. I think he tried to finance a big boy boat while buying a home. And the bank said no. And then he tried to use the free dinner tactic "my food was cold but I ate all of it but I'm not paying for this"

 

[SJP]

This is exactly why I buy gently pre owned boats.

 

[Ocean goer]

So you bought a boat, cancelled the sale, had to sign a contract outlining the termination of the sale and the refund ( written by a lawyer) and got back $ 104,600? What exactly should a buyer beware about?

You finally admit here that I called off the sale of the #15 RPM, Thank you.
You can now stop telling people you called of the sale due to me” never be happy” this is a perfect example the lies you live in Joe, can’t even remember what lie you told.
Yes, I called off the sale due to your lies on what motor I was getting (fresh build later to find out it has 170 hours), drive and who was even going to put it together. How many people did we have to go through Joe to try and get this boat put together? How many times did I text and took you two days to respond? When you have someone’s money ($105k) god damn right you better respond in a timely matter!!!! I am happy I got almost all of our money back from you, things would have been really really bad you if I didn’t. I can live with being shorted $400.00 when we are dealing with $105k. What goes around comes around!!!!!
As for the wanna be fake lawyer letter you sent me, that was a joke, if that’s what makes your business dealing make you feel better and sleep at night then so be it!
I hope you never sell another RPM and if you do I feel sorry for the buyer and what they will have to experience.



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[milkmoney]

I don’t believe a word you are saying Joe, I gave you 105k within a week of each other. After you got our money all I heard was excuse after excuse on why the boat couldn’t get done. You are a liar and nothing but a used cars salesman!
You should sale the molds to someone who can really build them and go back to selling peoples stuff for them like you do!
I keep all the text messages so don’t call my bluff otherwise I will post!!!!!!!
Have a great day, give Andrew back his money and sell the molds!!!!

Ok that made me laugh.

" don't call my bluff otherwise I will post "
[emoji4] [emoji202]


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[ChiliPepperGarage]

So you bought a boat, cancelled the sale, had to sign a contract outlining the termination of the sale and the refund ( written by a lawyer) and got back $ 104,600? What exactly should a buyer beware about?

I don't know any of the parties in this mess but I think this guy is saying that the builder did not meet the promised build schedule and lied about subsequent deadlines resulting in a refund. So, any one considering having boat built should be aware that promised deadlines may not be met.We don't know if that is true or not but that is what his point is.

A couple things here just amaze me. Coming from the construction industry where a contract can be a hundred pages long, I can't comprehend how a builder or a customer paying over $100K for a boat build would want a vague one or two page hand written contract. If I were in either position I would want a contract that clearly states the scope of work of the build including all parts used, build schedule (Gantt chart) and payment schedule with down payment, progress payments based on percentage of build, and final payment. The buyer gets to do a "walk through" inspection prior to delivery and create a punch list based on the original scope of work. This protects both parties involved.

The other thing is the desire to air your dirty laundry via social media. It is always a no win situation for both parties as everyone wants to put their two cents in, especially friends of each party. It ends up becoming a pissing match with ridiculous claims and things like, "He spelt a word wrong so nothing he says has any credibility".

If I were the buyer and called the builder to discuss something and he cursed at me and hung up the very next call would be to an attorney. If I were the builder and the buyer was flaking on payment or making unrealistic demands I would give him a short time period to comply and if he didn't then again, a quick call to an attorney would be made. It might cost a few hundred bucks to have them write up a letter stating that you are in breach of contract and if you don't comply legal action will be taken. This usually gets things rolling or brings people to their senses and keeps their egos in check.

No one here knows the full story but I'm sure the lawyers will work it out and cost both parties more money than they had hoped. I'm sure they will have a field day perusing through all the social media posts possibly adding libel accusations as well!

 

[milkmoney]

This is exactly why I buy gently pre owned boats.

Me to Sam. Beat up old shit boxes [emoji106] [emoji202]

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[ArizonaKevin]

You finally admit here that I called off the sale of the #15 RPM, Thank you.
You can now stop telling people you called of the sale due to me” never be happy” this is a perfect example the lies you live in Joe, can’t even remember what lie you told.
Yes, I called off the sale due to your lies on what motor I was getting (fresh build later to find out it has 170 hours), drive and who was even going to put it together. How many people did we have to go through Joe to try and get this boat put together? How many times did I text and took you two days to respond? When you have someone’s money ($105k) god damn right you better respond in a timely matter!!!! I am happy I got almost all of our money back from you, things would have been really really bad you if I didn’t. I can live with being shorted $400.00 when we are dealing with $105k. What goes around comes around!!!!!
As for the wanna be fake lawyer letter you sent me, that was a joke, if that’s what makes your business dealing make you feel better and sleep at night then so be it!
I hope you never sell another RPM and if you do I feel sorry for the buyer and what they will have to experience.



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That's not Joe you're talking too....

 

[wsuwrhr]

Me to Sam. Beat up old shit boxes [emoji106] [emoji202]

Schiadas, Noted.

 

[Ocean goer]

That's not Joe you're talking too....

It’s meant for him and to protect all people that have to deal with him!


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[Uncle Dave]

This whole deal is so outside of what I would consider normal business practices.

The idea that one is doing a "pay as you go" arrangement is perculiar to me and it seems to lead to exactly where the two parties are now.

After 08 "pay as you go's" are pretty common now with most being thirds, or quarters.

If you have specific funding milestones that are clear and a good working agreement it can work pretty well.

Most banks wont hold a payment construct "open" for more than 90 days without a full recertification of credit and situation analysis again - and its very difficult to nearly impossible for a small builder to build a completely custom boat in that timeframe.
I've seen core material delays take 45 days or more, and parts in your custom style, color, and config are rarely to never sitting on shelves anymore. 3rd party Interiors took 4-6 months last season- AFTER you gave a deposit.

Usually a full 3rd is engine driveline and rigging components.

Ever wonder why many builders bother to post picts of low end engine and drive packages that excite no one?
(no one but the guy who wrote the check for them) Its typically to demonstrate to the client his money was spent on these components and that the builder has made good on the milestone payment and didnt rob Peter to pay Paul.



UD

 

[rpmsrup]

This is exactly why I buy gently pre owned boats.

Amen brother, write there with you

 

[ArizonaKevin]

After 08 "pay as you go's" are pretty common now with most being thirds, or quarters.

If you have specific funding milestones that are clear and a good working agreement it can work pretty well.

Most banks wont hold a payment construct "open" for more than 90 days without a full recertification of credit and situation analysis again - and its very difficult to nearly impossible for a small builder to build a completely custom boat in that timeframe.
I've seen core material delays take 45 days or more, and parts in your custom style, color, and config are rarely to never sitting on shelves anymore. 3rd party Interiors took 4-6 months last season- AFTER you gave a deposit.

Usually a full 3rd is engine driveline and rigging components.

Ever wonder why many builders bother to post picts of low end engine and drive packages that excite no one?
(no one but the guy who wrote the check for them) Its typically to demonstrate to the client his money was spent on these components and that the builder has made good on the milestone payment and didnt rob Peter to pay Paul.



UD

Hey UD, with your experience with Lavey can you shed some light on the ballpark costs to get where this boat is as it sits with a carbon layup?

 

[milkmoney]

Schiadas, Noted.

That is a stupid comment

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[rpmsrup]

Come on rpmsrdwn, your a Fk'n hater!! j/k



I don't know the story, nor care. Read it, but there's three sides to everything. I've done business with Joe, and he has sent me plenty of business over the years. I've never experienced anything negative with him. I wish the best for both parties, and hope they are able to come to a resolve that is good for both.

LOL dick!

 

[Jed-O]

The receipt shows 36500 for the down to get the hull laid. Buyer paid 27500. Rpm is owed 10k that wasn't paid. Now buyer wants his money back after the hull is laid... Someone didn't get the answer they wanted from the bank. Who buys a house and a boat at the same time?

Exactly. This is finance 101 stuff! No lender in their right mind will loan $ to someone who (within the past 6 months) just applied for or got approved for another big ticket item(car, boat, real estate). IMO, the buyer should have spoken to a financial adviser before he even listed his previous home on the market.

 

[Outdrive1]

151k for a carbon fiber hull and twin 400’s? Damn that’s a smokin deal.


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[Outdrive1]

Is a complete carbon fiber hull 36k???


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[ArizonaKevin]

Is a complete carbon fiber hull 36k???


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The invoice looked like the carbon and custom gel upcharge was 36k

 

[RiverDave]

So you bought a boat, cancelled the sale, had to sign a contract outlining the termination of the sale and the refund ( written by a lawyer) and got back $ 104,600? What exactly should a buyer beware about?

I'm kind of wondering the same thing?

You finally admit here that I called off the sale of the #15 RPM, Thank you.
You can now stop telling people you called of the sale due to me” never be happy” this is a perfect example the lies you live in Joe, can’t even remember what lie you told.
Yes, I called off the sale due to your lies on what motor I was getting (fresh build later to find out it has 170 hours), drive and who was even going to put it together. How many people did we have to go through Joe to try and get this boat put together? How many times did I text and took you two days to respond? When you have someone’s money ($105k) god damn right you better respond in a timely matter!!!! I am happy I got almost all of our money back from you, things would have been really really bad you if I didn’t. I can live with being shorted $400.00 when we are dealing with $105k. What goes around comes around!!!!!
As for the wanna be fake lawyer letter you sent me, that was a joke, if that’s what makes your business dealing make you feel better and sleep at night then so be it!
I hope you never sell another RPM and if you do I feel sorry for the buyer and what they will have to experience.



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Two things..

1. That's not Joe from RPM. That is Enen out of PHX, which he asked a fairly legitimate question (The same question I would ask as well).

2. It's no secret that when Joe was first getting going he was attempting to find a home for his boat builds.. The first two shops he went to ended up delaying some processes, before he finally pulled everything and landed down at Archer (whom is now getting things done in a timely fashion).

The fact is though after you cancelled a build, you received your money back in less than a week? I'm not sure what else you could really ask for out of someone?

RD

 

[RiverDave]

Is a complete carbon fiber hull 36k???


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More..

RD

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

This is exactly why I buy gently pre owned boats.

I prefer to use the term vintage.

 

[Uncle Dave]

Hey UD, with your experience with Lavey can you shed some light on the ballpark costs to get where this boat is as it sits with a carbon layup?

Not knowing a thing about the build I dont want to insert mere opinion as that isn't fair to anyone here, but I can share the typical process.

Typically a carbon/kevlar layup gets a layup computation from the material source provider that includes a weight per foot and stiffness and strength in terms of tensile at 45 and 90 as well as shear, and shear modulus calculation per boat component. Top, bottom, sides, etcetera

You usually get 3 "formulas" and the price varies accordingly.

1. cosmetic ( a final layer on top of everything to "look cool") , this doesn't do much but add cost and looks cool $. This is what most pleasure boats that claim a "carbon layup" are.

2 Light - This is where it get serious - usually about 10% weight reduction the kevlar goes into a min of 2 layers and usually lets you take out 2-3 layers. $$$

3. ultra light- 10+ 15% or more lighter $$$$$

The prices vary dramatically based on what you actually do and I have no idea what these guys do or did.

UD

 

[Enen]

I don’t believe a word you are saying Joe, I gave you 105k within a week of each other. After you got our money all I heard was excuse after excuse on why the boat couldn’t get done. You are a liar and nothing but a used cars salesman!
You should sale the molds to someone who can really build them and go back to selling peoples stuff for them like you do!
I keep all the text messages so don’t call my bluff otherwise I will post!!!!!!!
Have a great day, give Andrew back his money and sell the molds!!!!

You must be the Peter guy that has been mentioned online. Please allow me to introduce myself Peter, I am not Joe. We've never met, and have never done business.

 

[DrunkenSailor]

After 08 "pay as you go's" are pretty common now with most being thirds, or quarters.

If you have specific funding milestones that are clear and a good working agreement it can work pretty well.

Most banks wont hold a payment construct "open" for more than 90 days without a full recertification of credit and situation analysis again - and its very difficult to nearly impossible for a small builder to build a completely custom boat in that timeframe.
I've seen core material delays take 45 days or more, and parts in your custom style, color, and config are rarely to never sitting on shelves anymore. 3rd party Interiors took 4-6 months last season- AFTER you gave a deposit.

Usually a full 3rd is engine driveline and rigging components.

Ever wonder why many builders bother to post picts of low end engine and drive packages that excite no one?
(no one but the guy who wrote the check for them) Its typically to demonstrate to the client his money was spent on these components and that the builder has made good on the milestone payment and didnt rob Peter to pay Paul.



UD

Timelines are all out of whack because of suppliers. No one really has any inventory of anything. Too many people got caught holding the bag in 08 and sat on inventory that they couldn't move. Everything ordered requires a payment upfront as the supplier has to order it from the source. Hence pay as you go.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul works in almost every industry that keeps inventory because its cheaper to buy in bulk than it is for a one off build. This practice is looked down upon in the boat industry because of all the stories of people getting screwed when the next order doesn't come in. If you can control costs you can increase the bottom line and hopefully pass the savings on to the consumer which in a competitive market can earn you more sales. It's business 101 unfortunately it doesn't seem to work in the boat industry unless you have a couple of builds at the exact same stage. I have seen the rolls of Kevlar in some of the build threads and I am always shocked at the amount just sitting on a roll. That's a fair amount of money sitting on a shop floor and whatever is left over is a sunk expense until the next custom build comes along and your probably ordering more at that point because whats left from the last build wont cover the next one. I am always impressed by the level of craftsmanship that goes into these builds and the cost management that goes into keeping these companies moving from one build to the next. The modern boat company needs to be backed by deep pockets, extremely talented artists and a wizard in the back office working financial magic. Not to mention you have to have someone who can talk to people on the front end.

Bayliner proves that if you have everything except the artist you can still be successful. I have never seen a shittier boat than what I saw at the Bayliner booth at the LA boat show. I would have actually loved to see RD do a write up on one just to tear it apart.

 

[pwerwagn]

You must be the Peter guy that has been mentioned online. Please allow me to introduce myself Peter, I am not Joe. We've never met, and have never done business.

Sounds like you owe him 400$ tho. Lol

 

[Bigbore500r]

If buying a new custom boat was like construction....
-No downpayment, submit your SOV and I will tweak it till it suits me, then allow you to bill thereafter based on progress.
-You will be subjected to Liquidated damages of $xxxx.xx per day past scheduled completion
-Your pricing is limited to cost plus 15% on all changes I may make
-I will probably pay you on a 60-90 day cycle
-Payment applications are subject to progress assessment and open for subjective negotiation
-Your 2nd tier subs will be paid when paid (good thing for you, or you'd really be cash negative!!)
-25% of your labor / subcontractors labor must be local hire from zip code(s) xxxxx
-15% of your contract value must be DVBE sourced
-10% retention will be held until the build is complete, tested, enjoyed, showcased, and used for 6 months while I decide if I am fully satisfied or not.
-Warranty timeline starts after I decide I am substantially complete / satisfied - See line above
-You will provide daily reports on shop conditions and headcount for labor, and certified payroll reports to back up the headcount
-Oh yea, i can get insurance cheaper than you can, so enroll in my OCIP drug test everyone on your crew.
-Don't use any epoxies, paints or smelly shit - I'm going for LEED GOLD

 

[Ouderkirk]

Well the original down payment was 45k and the buyer only Paid up 27.5 and is mad that the build hasn't gone further. Now he wants more
Work done and isn't paying the remaining 17.5. The buyer is trying to do pay as you go and the builder isn't having it. Being that RPM is new I'm sure the builder doesn't have 200k laying around to just build the boat. And then get paid when it's completed. He needed the money from the complete down payment to start. And then when homeboy got his financing completed he'd need the remaining amount to complete the build. That seems reasonable. Where RPM failed is starting without the full down payment. Where the buyer failed is requesting a schedule and where the money would be distributed thruought the build. But it doesn't seem like he was worried about that at first. I think he tried to finance a big boy boat while buying a home. And the bank said no. And then he tried to use the free dinner tactic "my foodwas cold but I ate all of it but I'm not paying for this"

Yuck...too many balls in the air at one time, on both sides.

 

[COCA COLA COWBOY]

View attachment 622467

Yup, she would look him square in the eyes and say...you have X, you make Y, you need your daddy to cosign, and you want to buy a $150,000 boat and now it's his fault?

We need guys like this to buy new boat though. How else would we be able to buy these awesome boats for cheap when they have a financial crisis!

 

[DaveC]

Getting a custom boat built in six weeks. That is the funniest damn thing I have read so far in this thread.

Also as was mentioned no bank is going to give a loan until the boat is done. One bank will do it before 100% completion for a portion of the boat (with significant cash down) but they will NOT do installments. The bank will ask for an MSO so really hull needs to be done and paid for to get the MSO so we are really talking about a re-finance.

So to have a boat built now you need to have significant down payments or access to capital to pay installments over the build. That is the reality of the situation. Incidentally this is why many people use HELOC's is because of logistics. They would prefer to do installment loans but they are just not available for some more custom builds.

I just went through all of this. I had to finance the build myself since the bank wanted nothing to do with the process. Which was fine because I was putting a lot of money down. But I did it in a deliberate way since I bought parts myself that were mine all along. And paid for the boat at certain stages of completion that we agreed to beforehand.

Sounds like all the knuckleheads involved should have sat down and worked out the logistics and put into the work order in writing before they started. That would avoid the confusion.

Bottom line is down payments along the way with miles stones is just part of the process to build a custom boat. As a buyer you need to find someone you are comfortable with and get everything in the contract beforehand.

 

[Enen]

Sounds like you owe him 400$ tho. Lol

LOL. Our company attorney costs quite a bit more than $400 an hour, he wouldn't have gotten as much $ back from me.

It sounds like in this particular case, a company went under new ownership. The new guy ( the real Joe) had some challenges getting his supply chain in place and operating.

As a business owner that outsources the majority of our companies production ( non-boating related ) I have found myself in a position before where a vendor promises a timeline, and doesn't make it happen. As the company owner, that mistake becomes my mistake. I can understand how a customer could get frustrated. In that case you give them their money back and move on. Sometimes deals go bad. It's part of business. Again, it sounds like that is exactly what Joe did, gave an emotional customer his money back.

I am however having a hard time connecting the logic between these two customer experiences.

The first guy ( Ocean goer) is coming on here and 'warning us" about the real Joe. While his experience, I'm sure is true, it's widely known that RPM has had to turn-over several underperforming vendors. It seems that they have found vendors that are performing to expectations and have grown through the "teething pains" many new ventures experience. This really mitigates any self-righteous public service announcement Ocean goer feels he is protecting the general public from.

 

[Wmc]

How much for the hull as it sits?

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[ChiliPepperGarage]

If buying a new custom boat was like construction....
-No downpayment, submit your SOV and I will tweak it till it suits me, then allow you to bill thereafter based on progress.
-You will be subjected to Liquidated damages of $xxxx.xx per day past scheduled completion
-Your pricing is limited to cost plus 15% on all changes I may make
-I will probably pay you on a 60-90 day cycle
-Payment applications are subject to progress assessment and open for subjective negotiation
-Your 2nd tier subs will be paid when paid (good thing for you, or you'd really be cash negative!!)
-25% of your labor / subcontractors labor must be local hire from zip code(s) xxxxx
-15% of your contract value must be DVBE sourced
-10% retention will be held until the build is complete, tested, enjoyed, showcased, and used for 6 months while I decide if I am fully satisfied or not.
-Warranty timeline starts after I decide I am substantially complete / satisfied - See line above
-You will provide daily reports on shop conditions and headcount for labor, and certified payroll reports to back up the headcount
-Oh yea, i can get insurance cheaper than you can, so enroll in my OCIP drug test everyone on your crew.
-Don't use any epoxies, paints or smelly shit - I'm going for LEED GOLD

Dang, that brings back a lot of memories (or nightmares)! You forgot to mention that you were the low bid so your margins were shit to begin with.

I used to play that game, getting sucked into the belief that because it was a big project for a major GC or public works project that I really wanted the job. After working with many big name GC's I came to the conclusion that A: they had no idea what they were doing. B: they will jerk around subs anyway they can and blame them for the GC's deficiencies. C: they will do everything they can to delay payment, reduce payment or not pay at all.

After a while you smarten up and realize that even though they are high dollar projects the net margin is so low it is not worth doing them. Plus, they take so long to complete robbing your resources that could be used on other more profitable projects. I'd rather bang out a bunch of small jobs with higher margins and quick turn arounds.

 

[USMC2010]

Yup, she would look him square in the eyes and say...you have X, you make Y, you need your daddy to cosign, and you want to buy a $150,000 boat and now it's his fault?

We need guys like this to buy new boat though. How else would we be able to buy these awesome boats for cheap when they have a financial crisis!

This is how we got ours.

 

[Bobby V]

If buying a new custom boat was like construction....
-No downpayment, submit your SOV and I will tweak it till it suits me, then allow you to bill thereafter based on progress.
-You will be subjected to Liquidated damages of $xxxx.xx per day past scheduled completion
-Your pricing is limited to cost plus 15% on all changes I may make
-I will probably pay you on a 60-90 day cycle
-Payment applications are subject to progress assessment and open for subjective negotiation
-Your 2nd tier subs will be paid when paid (good thing for you, or you'd really be cash negative!!)
-25% of your labor / subcontractors labor must be local hire from zip code(s) xxxxx
-15% of your contract value must be DVBE sourced
-10% retention will be held until the build is complete, tested, enjoyed, showcased, and used for 6 months while I decide if I am fully satisfied or not.
-Warranty timeline starts after I decide I am substantially complete / satisfied - See line above
-You will provide daily reports on shop conditions and headcount for labor, and certified payroll reports to back up the headcount
-Oh yea, i can get insurance cheaper than you can, so enroll in my OCIP drug test everyone on your crew.
-Don't use any epoxies, paints or smelly shit - I'm going for LEED GOLD

Sounds like BNBuilders, Turner, Matt, Rudolph Sletten and Swinerton.

 

[OldSchoolBoats]

I don’t believe a word you are saying Joe, I gave you 105k within a week of each other. After you got our money all I heard was excuse after excuse on why the boat couldn’t get done. You are a liar and nothing but a used cars salesman!
You should sale the molds to someone who can really build them and go back to selling peoples stuff for them like you do!
I keep all the text messages so don’t call my bluff otherwise I will post!!!!!!!
Have a great day, give Andrew back his money and sell the molds!!!!

So you actually thought that you were going to get a boat done in 6 weeks, during the middle of summer, when Joe was literally just getting up and running?!! He was pretty clear on several forums regarding the challenges he was having finding good help.

Granted, the boat was already out of the mold (I think) but it wasn't rigged.

Doubt Andrew will be getting a dime until that hull sells........

 

[j21black]

Exactly. This is finance 101 stuff! No lender in their right mind will loan $ to someone who (within the past 6 months) just applied for or got approved for another big ticket item(car, boat, real estate). IMO, the buyer should have spoken to a financial adviser before he even listed his previous home on the market.

I've had zero issues with it. Bought a new house in August 2016 - Bought wife a new car on an "unsecured loan" (I have the Title) in November of 2016. Of course the lender knew I had enough cash on hand to buy the car a few times over, and have a 800 credit score.

But I guess that is what happens when you have always made timely payments, and you debt to income ratio isn't out of whack.

 

[Ocean goer]

I'm kind of wondering the same thing?



Two things..

1. That's not Joe from RPM. That is Enen out of PHX, which he asked a fairly legitimate question (The same question I would ask as well).

2. It's no secret that when Joe was first getting going he was attempting to find a home for his boat builds.. The first two shops he went to ended up delaying some processes, before he finally pulled everything and landed down at Archer (whom is now getting things done in a timely fashion).

The fact is though after you cancelled a build, you received your money back in less than a week? I'm not sure what else you could really ask for out of someone?

RD

If this is not Joe why are you even speaking on his behalf, were you there when we signed the original PO looked at each other man to man and shook hands and gave a $22k deposit? Did you listen in on every phone call, I don’t think, so you should STFU!!!!!!
You think just because I got almost all my money back I should be a satisfied customer, is this how you guys do business????
I learned my lesson from you and Joe and I think everyone should know about your foul practices,broken contracts and for sure definitely no honor or integrity in “YOUR WORD!”
Take a hike you jack ass and good luck selling Boats......


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[Icky]

 

[Ocean goer]

So you actually thought that you were going to get a boat done in 6 weeks, during the middle of summer, when Joe was literally just getting up and running?!! He was pretty clear on several forums regarding the challenges he was having finding good help.

Granted, the boat was already out of the mold (I think) but it wasn't rigged.

Doubt Andrew will be getting a dime until that hull sells........


View attachment 622531

My wife and actually laughed when he told us that too “six weeks” but Joe said it would get done! You “think the boat was out of the mold and wasn’t rigged?” Just show how stupid you really are!!! Boat was running and fully put together when Joe bought, funds were low so he took out the Merc 700 and NXT drive. The boat was fully rigged minus motor and drive which should have been done immediately. Later found out Joe had no motor or drive, he had to use my funds to buy motor and drive that he said he already had! I think you should STFU now and let Joe speak for himself!


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[OldSchoolBoats]

If this is not Joe why are you even speaking on his behalf, were you there when we signed the original PO looked at each other man to man and shook hands and gave a $22k deposit? Did you listen in on every phone call, I don’t think, so you should STFU!!!!!!
You think just because I got almost all my money back I should be a satisfied customer, is this how you guys do business????
I learned my lesson from you and Joe and I think everyone should know about your foul practices,broken contracts and for sure definitely no honor or integrity in “YOUR WORD!”
Take a hike you jack ass and good luck selling Boats......


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Purchase order in the middle of June and you didn't even give him the full 6 weeks to rig and finish your boat, in the middle of summer!!!

You were out cruising the Delta with your "new ride" on July 23rd.

So 4-5 weeks and you cancel? I would be pissed too.



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[RiverDave]

If this is not Joe why are you even speaking on his behalf, were you there when we signed the original PO looked at each other man to man and shook hands and gave a $22k deposit? Did you listen in on every phone call, I don’t think, so you should STFU!!!!!!
You think just because I got almost all my money back I should be a satisfied customer, is this how you guys do business????
I learned my lesson from you and Joe and I think everyone should know about your foul practices,broken contracts and for sure definitely no honor or integrity in “YOUR WORD!”
Take a hike you jack ass and good luck selling Boats......


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I’m not sure if you have a reading comprehension problem or what.. I am not Joe. I did not speak on his behalf.. A build went sideways and you were made whole (that’s an actual term by the way).

You are saying buyer beware because he gave you your money back. It doesn’t seem to make any sense to me or Enen or anyone else?

Here’s your proof that I’m not Joe by the way.

You might notice the name on the shirt and the logo on the hat match the name of the website which also correlated to the screen name I’m posting with. That’s how I do business buddy.. lol. Feel free to go and tell the world buyer beware because I didn’t give you a refund for posting on here.

 

[Uncle Dave]

LMFAO

UD

 

[Ocean goer]

If this is not Joe why are you even speaking on his behalf, were you there when we signed the original PO looked at each other man to man and shook hands and gave a $22k deposit? Did you listen in on every phone call, I don’t think, so you should STFU!!!!!!
You think just because I got almost all my money back I should be a satisfied customer, is this how you guys do business????
I learned my lesson from you and Joe and I think everyone should know about your foul practices,broken contracts and for sure definitely no honor or integrity in “YOUR WORD!”
Take a hike you jack ass and good luck selling Boats......


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Ok RD, when we made “the deal” GT was supposed to put the boat together, how about that? You don’t even know so don’t make assumptions that you have no facts about ok.... Thanks


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[pwerwagn]

This thread gets better and better and better.