Temporarily Suspended Longshoremen Strike

[Singleton]

Fun fact: I have read that foreign entities own 80% of US terminals.

Own or lease?
Port of LA, SD and Long Beach were some of my biggest clients when I worked at KPMG. They owned the land, but the terminals were land leased to other companies

 

[Looking Glass]

We are about to find out how difficult it is going to be.

I'm not running a port, but this will directly impact some of the things we do daily.

To me this is exactly what would push me over the top to automate anything and everything I could.

That crippling comment can absolutely back fire and I think it will over time.

Hopefully, people, in the future will be able to see "Videos" of these Union Organizers and have a Clear Picture of what happened AND how they are where they are now. No "Bullshitting & Blaming" others.

 

[DRYHEAT]

Hopefully, people, in the future will be able to see "Videos" of these Union Organizers and have a Clear Picture of what happened AND how they are where they are now. No "Bullshitting & Blaming" others.

Don’t think it really matters history ends up getting changed to the narrative they want.

 

[JDKRXW]

IMO, is this will be settled within 48 hrs. - either by legislation or caving to the money demand.
The union knows they've got dems over the barrel, and the dems know that the damage this causes if it goes on for more than a few days won't be forgotten in 40 days.

 

[MPHSystems]

Heads up, get your Christmas shopping done early… even this is just a little blip and over ina week, it’s going to exacerbate the record breaking biden era inflation by several orders of bazillions.

If you are a degenerate heathen commie who doesn’t celebrate the birth of our lord and savior, you can disregard this post.

 

[MPHSystems]

Don’t think it really matters history ends up getting changed to the narrative they want.

Ain’t that the truth. John Kerry flat out admits this

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1840223221120979211

 

[DRYHEAT]

Ain’t that the truth. John Kerry flat out admits this

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1840223221120979211

What this country needs is a good dictator!

Unfortunately, every side looks at life through their own rose colored glasses.

I am still waiting for the other side to show me how a man can have a baby. Maybe then they can convince me to vote for their side.

 

[Looking Glass]

Don’t think it really matters history ends up getting changed to the narrative they want.

AND!! POUND THE MESSAGE 24-7

 

[Looking Glass]

Catching up on the news.
Why people dislike the unions. It is due to this type of BS.

USMX reportedly made a new offer to the ILA on Monday afternoon that would've raised wages by nearly 50% over the new contract as well as tripling employer contributions to retirement plans, better health care and kept language about automation in the deal. Sources told FOX Business that the ILA rejected the offer and didn't make a counter.

The American working family does not want to hear this 'Greedy" B.S., especially with this past "4" Years of never-ending inflation, which the greedy demands will only hurt more.

I guess their thinking is to "grab" all we can NOW and worry about the "Future" when that time comes.

 

[Looking Glass]

The "ODD" situation is "Brandon" is not going to intervene, a Long Ugly Strike, will only hurt "KaMaLa" But then this White House/Administration has been in Opposite ends and going different Directions, from way before they were a President/Vice President Team.

 

[monkeyswrench]

I can tell you that this will really hurt my business in terms of bringing capital goods into the country.

People I think only see one or two angles of this. A company is out money on the equipment they have ordered from people like you. The order may be intended for a large job, that now can't be started on time. The company is out capital, and now hobbled in terms of raising more. Labor gets cut in the meantime, to shore up losses. That labor cuts their spending in an already stained economy.

Not good for anyone, but people only see what's right in front of them.

 

[Singleton]

Found some additional data points.

• The union is seeking wage hikes of $5 more per hour annually for six years, which represents a 77% pay increase over the length of the contract.
• The union’s current contract, negotiated in 2018, includes wages that go up to $39 an hour.
• The union wants a complete ban on automation

Now the kicker, that makes them look greedy as hell.

• ILA members make an average base salary of $81,000 per year, but on average pull in $200,000 annually with overtime.

I am sorry, when you find the data point that with OT the the average goes to 200k and they want a 77% increase, I only have one thing to say. FU - you are the problem. This will only increase inflation!

 

[Looking Glass]

People I think only see one or two angles of this. A company is out money on the equipment they have ordered from people like you. The order may be intended for a large job, that now can't be started on time. The company is out capital, and now hobbled in terms of raising more. Labor gets cut in the meantime, to shore up losses. That labor cuts their spending in an already stained economy.

Not good for anyone, but people only see what's right in front of them.

PEOPLE, only know what they are Experiencing and Living every day. The Average Family Ain't getting and rejecting a 50% raise over several years, BUT feeling an ever-increasing Inflation, and continues to "Tighten the belt that is already in the Last Notch.

If this "Union" is not telling its Members to Cut The Threats Message, they are making a Major Mistake. IMO they have already lost the Public Opinion Poll!!

 

[Sportin' Wood]

Ain’t that the truth. John Kerry flat out admits this

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1840223221120979211

Kamala's Dad worked for the Jamaican version of that when he met her mother. She will give Kerry what he wants and maybe make him the overlord.

 

[BHC Vic]

Found some additional data points.

• The union is seeking wage hikes of $5 more per hour annually for six years, which represents a 77% pay increase over the length of the contract.
• The union’s current contract, negotiated in 2018, includes wages that go up to $39 an hour.
• The union wants a complete ban on automation

Now the kicker, that makes them look greedy as hell.

• ILA members make an average base salary of $81,000 per year, but on average pull in $200,000 annually with overtime.

I am sorry, when you find the data point that with OT the the average goes to 200k and they want a 77% increase, I only have one thing to say. FU - you are the problem. This will only increase inflation!

I dunno. I’d say I make around 80-100 base… with OT I’m 150-170 I’d say. That 2400-2600 hours. That’s a shit ton of hours and 170k is not that much and I don’t think 200k is either I work extremely hard for my money and I know these guys do too and shitty hours. It’s very easy to say someone doesn’t deserve something when you don’t fully understand what it entails. I’m away from my family a lot. I’m underpaid as far as I’m concerned.

 

[TeamGreene]

Learn to code

 

[bonesfab]

I dunno. I’d say I make around 80-100 base… with OT I’m 150-170 I’d say. That 2400-2600 hours. That’s a shit ton of hours and 170k is not that much and I don’t think 200k is either I work extremely hard for my money and I know these guys do too and shitty hours. It’s very easy to say someone doesn’t deserve something when you don’t fully understand what it entails. I’m away from my family a lot. I’m underpaid as far as I’m concerned.

Not to be dick, but then go out on your own and earn what you are worth. Don't let the greedy union hold you back from your potential.

 

[BHC Vic]

Not to be dick, but then go out on your own and earn what you are worth. Don't let the greedy union hold you back from your potential.

Why??? Serious question. I’m good at what i do and I don’t want to wear bags anymore. Those days are done. I want to earn what I’m worth right here. Union or non union I don’t care I should be paid more for what I do. Only problem is there’s no way in hell I’d make anywhere near what I do non union. Non union doesn’t even have an apprenticeship. But again this isn’t a union be non union this is what do I actually deserve to make and what does it take to live comfortably. Again 200k in California is not a lot and saying someone who wants 200k is the problem is a little unfair

 

[Andy B.]

I dunno. I’d say I make around 80-100 base… with OT I’m 150-170 I’d say. That 2400-2600 hours. That’s a shit ton of hours and 170k is not that much and I don’t think 200k is either I work extremely hard for my money and I know these guys do too and shitty hours. It’s very easy to say someone doesn’t deserve something when you don’t fully understand what it entails. I’m away from my family a lot. I’m underpaid as far as I’m concerned.

Yes And these guys work rain or snow good ,bad conditions 24/7 .it's a very dangerous job especially when tieing down containers to the ship, guys die all the time.

 

[jetboatperformance]

When opportunity knocks Biden and Harris are once more asleep at the wheel , They should be all over this and the same for the disasters in North Carolina........ Morons

 

[j21black]

I dunno. I’d say I make around 80-100 base… with OT I’m 150-170 I’d say. That 2400-2600 hours. That’s a shit ton of hours and 170k is not that much and I don’t think 200k is either I work extremely hard for my money and I know these guys do too and shitty hours. It’s very easy to say someone doesn’t deserve something when you don’t fully understand what it entails. I’m away from my family a lot. I’m underpaid as far as I’m concerned.

It is a lot of money in Mobile, AL......

In CA, not so much....

 

[BHC Vic]

It is a lot of money in Mobile, AL......

In CA, not so much....

I could live real comfortable in Ohio

 

[Singleton]

I dunno. I’d say I make around 80-100 base… with OT I’m 150-170 I’d say. That 2400-2600 hours. That’s a shit ton of hours and 170k is not that much and I don’t think 200k is either I work extremely hard for my money and I know these guys do too and shitty hours. It’s very easy to say someone doesn’t deserve something when you don’t fully understand what it entails. I’m away from my family a lot. I’m underpaid as far as I’m concerned.

Vic-
Data last published in 2022.
The average family household income was $74,755.
The average income for households in California is $130,718. The median income for households in California is $91,905

You are doing better than most.
2080 is life of a 40hr per week worker. I average 2600 a year. Last year was 2850.

 

[angiebaby]

Own or lease?
Port of LA, SD and Long Beach were some of my biggest clients when I worked at KPMG. They owned the land, but the terminals were land leased to other companies

I believe you are correct. However, the sources are mixed. Some say leased, some the terminals are "owned and operated," by foreign entities.

 

[BHC Vic]

For us a full pension credit year is 1800
Extra credits earned up till 2200 then it goes into the slush fund

I’m exhausted
But I’m not complaining I’m thankful everyday

 

[BHC Vic]

Oh but this isn’t counting any travel hours either. I don’t know how I could track that but there were many hours in airports and on planes and in a car and what not.

 

[pronstar]

1840 hours/year for an average FTE is a pretty common number used by employers. We’ve used it an every company I’ve worked at.

 

[Singleton]

I could live real comfortable in Ohio

Stop buying toys and paying travel team dues

100% giving you a hard time. Housing in CA makes 150k look like peanuts

 

[j21black]

I could live real comfortable in Ohio

Median income here to be considered "Middle Class" is $39k.

Median Household income is $60K

$200K/year + in this state puts you in the top 5% income wise. - EDIT - 6.5% of households per the web

• 6.5% of Households in Alabama are High Income Households that make over $200,000 a year.

Also - I lived in Indiana for 29 years - I wouldn't recommend OHIO

 

[Singleton]

I believe you are correct. However, the sources are mixed. Some say leased, some the terminals are "owned and operated," by foreign entities.

Think of it like the Islander park model. Terminals are park models

 

[Singleton]

1840 hours/year for an average FTE is a pretty common number used by employers. We’ve used it an every company I’ve worked at.

That is after PTO and paid holidays. We use that for budgeting work load after PTO, Sick and Holidays.
2080 is counting everything.

 

[Floaterboat]

Why??? Serious question. I’m good at what i do and I don’t want to wear bags anymore. Those days are done. I want to earn what I’m worth right here. Union or non union I don’t care I should be paid more for what I do.

Reread your statement.. 20 times if you have to.

You are good at what you do, but aren’t willing to make a change to be compensated to what you believe you are worth.

So you are letting someone’s else chart your future for you, and letting telling them tell you what you are worth.

If that is your position, you don’t have much room to complain at the result or your compensation, because you have let someone else have control of your career.

This is the key problem with unions.

 

[Kachina26]

When the machines do all the work, who will have money to buy the stuff? Everyone pushing for the end of union wages despises UBI (as do I). But, I don't see a solution outside of it. These aren't unskilled workers for the most part. I agree, we do need to leverage technology to stay competitive, I just don't know what the solution is though.

 

[Sharky]

IMO, is this will be settled within 48 hrs. - either by legislation or caving to the money demand.
The union knows they've got dems over the barrel, and the dems know that the damage this causes if it goes on for more than a few days won't be forgotten in 40 days.

Bet its closer to the end of October. . . .

Strike has disrupted supplies & goods for a while. Prices have already started to rise and every day people are feeling it. . . . . in steps kamala to negotiate a deal and the strike ends. A week later, its election day.

Just watch. . . . .

 

[BHC Vic]

Reread your statement.. 20 times if you have to.

You are good at what you do, but aren’t willing to make a change to be compensated to what you believe you are worth.

So you are letting someone’s else chart your future for you, and letting telling them tell you what you are worth.

If that is your position, you don’t have much room to complain at the result or your compensation, because you have let someone else have control of your career.

This is the key problem with unions.

I could open a weld shop like CTM and I could teach people to weld and certify them. Same thing I do now. I’d make less money, have more stress, and no pension. Read that as many times as you want. Like I said, I’m not complaining but I don’t for one second think I’m over paid. Every union meeting they say exactly what’s being said in this thread. The owners are greedy. They make millions while you make thousands. They think you are over paid!!! Crowd goes crazy.

If we are being honest both sides are being greedy

 

[JLG614]

Reread your statement.. 20 times if you have to.

You are good at what you do, but aren’t willing to make a change to be compensated to what you believe you are worth.

So you are letting someone’s else chart your future for you, and letting telling them tell you what you are worth.

If that is your position, you don’t have much room to complain at the result or your compensation, because you have let someone else have control of your career.

This is the key problem with unions.

This is exactly what I thought when he posted his comment. I was in that same boat and felt very underpaid for what I did. I took the leap and made a career change to try to earn more and it has paid off incredibly. I do work more than I ever which can cut into family and fun time but the sky is the limit where I'm at so I will continue to push until I get to where I want to be in life

 

[Singleton]

I could open a weld shop like CTM and I could teach people to weld and certify them. Same thing I do now. I’d make less money, have more stress, and no pension. Read that as many times as you want. Like I said, I’m not complaining but I don’t for one second think I’m over paid. Every union meeting they say exactly what’s being said in this thread. The owners are greedy. They make millions while you make thousands. They think you are over paid!!! Crowd goes crazy.

If we are being honest both sides are being greedy

Everyone wants more money. Some decide to take the risk and the stress and go out on their own.
I did that once and the stress was not good for me and my family. The money was better, but the stress was ruining who I was.

So now, I bitch and moan about wanting more money and know the only way to do that, is to go out to market and find a new gig. Reason I don’t = the healthcare benefits I get today can’t be matched. When headhunters call, first thing we talk about is healthcare benefits and no one can touch what I get, so the conversations end.

 

[Floaterboat]

I don’t for one second think I’m over paid.

Union or non union I don’t care I should be paid more for what I do.

What?

You just said you don’t get paid enough, and then said that you don’t think you are overpaid?

Which position are you taking?

Not everyone is an entrepreneur, and not everyone can hustle. That life comes with risk or reward.

If you settle and compromise in some job, union or not union, that is your choice. It is also your option to make a change, take risk, etc

 

[Bobby V]

I could open a weld shop like CTM and I could teach people to weld and certify them. Same thing I do now. I’d make less money, have more stress, and no pension. Read that as many times as you want. Like I said, I’m not complaining but I don’t for one second think I’m over paid. Every union meeting they say exactly what’s being said in this thread. The owners are greedy. They make millions while you make thousands. They think you are over paid!!! Crowd goes crazy.

Vic. Keep on doing what you have been doing. I retired last year after 41 years. 2 pensions and SS is about 150k. $340 a month for full medical benefits. The “greedy” union fee is $10 a month.

 

[j21black]

When the machines do all the work, who will have money to buy the stuff? Everyone pushing for the end of union wages despises UBI (as do I). But, I don't see a solution outside of it. These aren't unskilled workers for the most part. I agree, we do need to leverage technology to stay competitive, I just don't know what the solution is though.

I get what you are saying completely.

My thing is, from a port standpoint, I'm going to do what I have to do to do not get put in this situation again. What happens when this contract expires, what are the demands next time around, when does it end? With machines it ends now - Cost of the equipment, figure "x" per operation man hour in maintenance, and "x" for replacement cost. They don't get tired, they don't need to take breaks. Granted, we can have the same discussion on maintenance techs to install and fix the equipment sometime in the future.

You want $15/hour to work at McDonalds? Fine here is a kisok you can use to place your order.

I agree these folks need jobs, and have zero issue with that, but at some point these guys have to look in the mirror and ask themselves if they are shooting themselves in the foot. Long term, they are IMO. They may get this 6 year with wording about no additional automation over the time period and a huge pay increase, but when it is getting time to draw up a new deal, I'd have have them off loading the equipment that is going to replace them when it expires.

At some point you have priced yourself out entirely. It is no different than manufacturing going overseas. Cheapest way almost always wins, right or wrong.

 

[BHC Vic]

Vic. Keep on doing what you have been doing. I retired last year after 41 years. 2 pensions and SS is about 150k. $340 a month for full medical benefits. The “greedy” union fee is $10 a month.

Exactly. At this point in my life theres no point in taking that risk. It’s a dumb bet. I do fine. Wife and kids are happy, good insurance, and I have my pensions annuity and 401k. It’s not the toys or sports or really even the mortgage that hurts. It’s the private school. But I think it’s worth it so I make it happen.

 

[CLdrinker]

I’ve never understood why a man would let another man argue his worth for him.

I’m worth X amount because this guy says so? wtf?

No you are worth what value you bring and how easily you are replaced.

Key “how easily you are replaced”

That is why unions stick together because they are not doing extremely difficult tasks from an intelligence stand point. It’s more labor based. They know they could be replaced by someone willing to do the job for less. If it wasn’t for unions allot of these guys wouldn’t be able to keep a job.

 

[BHC Vic]

What?

You just said you don’t get paid enough, and then said that you don’t think you are overpaid?

Which position are you taking?

Not everyone is an entrepreneur, and not everyone can hustle. That life comes with risk or reward.

If you settle and compromise in some job, union or not union, that is your choice. It is also your option to make a change, take risk, etc

Uhhh it’s the same thing. I think I should be paid more. Because I think I should be paid more , I do not think I’m over paid.

I know, words are hard…

Also… who has settled? I just got another raise last week for passing my wabo exam and I’ve been over scale for at least 10 years… it’s not as black and white as everyone likes to think

 

[Kachina26]

I’ve never understood why a man would let another man argue his worth for him.

I’m worth X amount because this guy says so? wtf?

No you are worth what value you bring and how easily you are replaced.

Key “how easily you are replaced”

That is why unions stick together because they are not doing extremely difficult tasks from an intelligence stand point. It’s more labor based. They know they could be replaced by someone willing to do the job for less. If it wasn’t for unions allot of these guys wouldn’t be able to keep a job.

Same reason you'd pay a lawyer to argue for you in court. Just because someone is good at what they do doesn't make them a good negotiator/advocator. Or, same reason you have group health insurance rather than try to negotiate your medical costs on your own. There's plenty of times in life you want someone doing the talking for you.

 

[clarence]

Yes And these guys work rain or snow good ,bad conditions 24/7 .it's a very dangerous job especially when tieing down containers to the ship, guys die all the time.

Automate and save lives.

 

[Floaterboat]

Uhhh it’s the same thing. I think I should be paid more. Because I think I should be paid more , I do not think I’m over paid.

I know, words are hard…

Also… who has settled? I just got another raise last week for passing my wabo exam and I’ve been over scale for at least 10 years… it’s not as black and white as everyone likes to think

I’m starting to see why there is a scale.

 

[Floaterboat]

Same reason you'd pay a lawyer to argue for you in court. Just because someone is good at what they do doesn't make them a good negotiator/advocator. Or, same reason you have group health insurance rather than try to negotiate your medical costs on your own. There's plenty of times in life you want someone doing the talking for you.

Not when you are outperforming everyone around you.

But if everyone is outperforming, you, sure, hide behind the collective and reap the rewards.

 

[Looking Glass]

Reread your statement.. 20 times if you have to.

You are good at what you do, but aren’t willing to make a change to be compensated to what you believe you are worth.

So you are letting someone’s else chart your future for you, and letting telling them tell you what you are worth.

If that is your position, you don’t have much room to complain at the result or your compensation, because you have let someone else have control of your career.

This is the key problem with unions.

During and After the Air Traffic Controllers, Strike, and then The "BOOT" the same "Old Story" of long hours, stressful job, how great they are at their job, On and On!!

I watched a Documentary on a group of these employees and although not all admitted it, many did say what a mistake it was to Assume they were "Irreplaceable" and one Young Controller admitted that everything comes down to "Attitude", not only in this situation but Everything, and If you have the Wrong Attitude, you might get the results you were not expecting. There are millions of Americans working Brutal Hours, for Shitty Wages, that have NO Pension coming in retirement (What Retirement) have No Time for Coaching "Little League" and don't even think about Vacations, Let alone in their "R-V", or Have Time to Spend on Social Media.

Many of these people are thankful for a job and have learned to adapt to the Hand they were dealt and do not have A "Union" to "?" These people, no matter how difficult things are usually come home to a Wife/Girlfriend/Family that all are dealing with their own life issues, and sure do not want to hear a "Poor Poor Pitiful Me"

 

[HBCraig]

Not to be dick, but then go out on your own and earn what you are worth. Don't let the greedy union hold you back from your potential.

I sell to both union and non union outfits. From what I am told, the union big dog of a massive Operating Engineers is a billionaire. Big, big money.

 

[DrunkenSailor]

When the machines do all the work, who will have money to buy the stuff? Everyone pushing for the end of union wages despises UBI (as do I). But, I don't see a solution outside of it. These aren't unskilled workers for the most part. I agree, we do need to leverage technology to stay competitive, I just don't know what the solution is though.

This... automation is coming for everyone's job. The pay increases aren't the issue here it's a way of life in a lucrative industry. The pay increases are included so they have something to bargain with. At least the union is trying to protect the jobs. Reality is it's not gonna matter and when automation comes for your job your probably not gonna have a union to fight for you. Only so many programmer jobs available and AI is gonna take those too.

When robot repair is done by robots and pogramming is done by AI. What jobs will be left?