I may have missed the satire in your post. Sorry if I did. It's been a long day.
On water safety check in havasu, bullshit
- Thread starter riverroyal
- Start date
I may have missed the satire in your post. Sorry if I did. It's been a long day.
Wicky
Mr. Potatohead
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2007
- Messages
- 7,953
- Reaction score
- 6,329
The more I read, the more I feel like a black person in Ferguson.
Boaters lives matter damnit!!
Boaters lives matter damnit!!
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
I'm eager to see his reply.
The officer said I had no options, I asked about beaching and he said no, I inquired about leaving my wife as captain when she had no idea how to operate the vessel, as well as leaving them both as well as my property adrift in the river. I was made into a joke, didn't give a flying fuck about my concerns, just his bullshit safety inspection, which I felt he MADE an unsafe situation, and rolling the dice to get his dui stop.
Damaged my vessel with his when he came along side, and pushed my boat off with his boot.
Fuck him.
Brian
The officer said I had no options, I asked about beaching and he said no, I inquired about leaving my wife as captain when she had no idea how to operate the vessel, as well as leaving them both as well as my property adrift in the river. I was made into a joke, didn't give a flying fuck about my concerns, just his bullshit safety inspection, which I felt he MADE an unsafe situation, and rolling the dice to get his dui stop.
Damaged my vessel with his when he came along side, and pushed my boat off with his boot.
Fuck him.
Brian
HALLETT BOY
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2007
- Messages
- 6,962
- Reaction score
- 10,545
I'm eager to see his reply.
The officer said I had no options, I asked about beaching and he said no, I inquired about leaving my wife as captain when she had no idea how to operate the vessel, as well as leaving them both as well as my property adrift in the river. I was made into a joke, didn't give a flying fuck about my concerns, just his bullshit safety inspection, which I felt he MADE an unsafe situation, and rolling the dice to get his dui stop.
Damaged my vessel with his when he came along side, and pushed my boat off with his boot.
Fuck him.
Brian
Was it these guys ? This was after a " safety " inspection a couple years at Cottonwood , all safety equipment , no drinking , gotta find something ...
Attachments
Ballyhoo
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 1,186
- Reaction score
- 1,920
I'm eager to see his reply.
The officer said I had no options, I asked about beaching and he said no, I inquired about leaving my wife as captain when she had no idea how to operate the vessel, as well as leaving them both as well as my property adrift in the river. I was made into a joke, didn't give a flying fuck about my concerns, just his bullshit safety inspection, which I felt he MADE an unsafe situation, and rolling the dice to get his dui stop.
Damaged my vessel with his when he came along side, and pushed my boat off with his boot.
Fuck him.
Brian
Your recourse is a formal complaint after the fact. Were you able to so that?
Ballyhoo
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 1,186
- Reaction score
- 1,920
The best way to get respect is to give it. When doing these inspections, the cops should be treating everyone with respect unless the situation dictates otherwise. If they treat you like crap and or you didnt like the way things went, demand to speak with their boss or call/go to their office and complain formally. There is no reason for them to act like aholes or to treat you like an ahole- unless you dictate that it goes that way.
You could suggest or ask to move to what you think is a safer spot. It will likely not happen as training and our safety teach us to control situations. Just like if I stop you in your car. Once stopped, I would not let you move to another spot that you liked better.
If they cause any damage to your boat, ask for their boss and make a formal complaint. As far as recording goes, they are almost for sure already recording the incident, it could be just audio or a video recording. I love having recordings of all of my contacts. The only complaints that I have had since I started recording contacts have all been found to be false complaints. Recording has always benefited me.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
Naive.
BC told me I could have after I had posted about the event...maybe a year after it happened.
Had so much time not passed I would have.
...edit....
You are LE.....noted
Brian
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
It was some time ago. I couldn't tell you to be honest. I remember the boat had an alum railing or hull, more like a deck boat. Not the soft sided deal. It gouged the fuck out of my gunnel. He just laughed, that was already there. I had just regelled the whole boat, it was nice.
My wife's version of the story, in my opinion, was much better. I think she told PVHCA, or another member, once. She asked to the effect of,"WTF? I don't know how to drive it, what if someone hits us or if we get swamped while floating?"
Warlock1
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2011
- Messages
- 3,217
- Reaction score
- 2,727
I don't drink when I am driving a boat, ever. So I don't care one way or another about being stopped. However I would very much care if they did to me what Brian went through.
I did get stopped once at Lake Pleasant. They announced that it was for a safety check. The first thing they asked was had I been drinking. I said no and opened the cooler which had only water and they said thank you and have fun. I said wait a minute since this is a safety check you need to check my stuff. The officer looked at me funny and said oh ok. So I pulled it all out slowwwwwwwly to show them I had it all.:thumbup:
Sonya said what was that all about. I said I was assisting the officer on making sure we were safe
I did get stopped once at Lake Pleasant. They announced that it was for a safety check. The first thing they asked was had I been drinking. I said no and opened the cooler which had only water and they said thank you and have fun. I said wait a minute since this is a safety check you need to check my stuff. The officer looked at me funny and said oh ok. So I pulled it all out slowwwwwwwly to show them I had it all.:thumbup:
Sonya said what was that all about. I said I was assisting the officer on making sure we were safe
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
I have asked for a watch commander during other bullshit stops and jackboot attitudes since this event, and I have educated myself on how much shit I have to take from thugs with badges.
Shit changes in a hurry when you request a watch commander.
"Have a nice day"
Yea mutherfucker, don't go tripping over yourself.
Brian
riverroyal
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2007
- Messages
- 14,443
- Reaction score
- 20,071
I have a tin can also! I guess Im a dumb ass like my friend for spending too much money huh.
He saw the LE, he didn't leave, he didn't look the other way. He simply got stopped for having a wonderful day. BULLSHIT. There were 1000 other boats on the lake, there were hundreds going the wrong direction at that section of the lake. So many real rules being broke it's amazing, but..... He got pulled over in 100k tin can for safety check. Maybe he should have been in his $5000 beater wakeboard boat, which he has.
I started the thread not to bash LE, I have zero issues with them. I was more curious about rights I have when it happens to me, cause it will at some point. I don't want them on my boat, not because I'm doing anything illegal, but because I didn't break any law. (Assuming it's a safety check) I'm sorry but it don't feel it's right. Unfortunately when it does happen to me I have a feeling I will be a compete dick.
There's no 'educating' boaters on Labor Day in havasu, if they have that free time then they are over staffed for the day
BoatCop
Retired And Loving It.
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 5,392
- Reaction score
- 9,598
Regarding the Type IV throwable. It is required to be "immediately available". Not "within arms length" or some such BS. Immediately available means that it can be grabbed and thrown without having to open compartments, move things, etc.
"Readily Accessible" is the standard for wearable PFDs, fire extinguisher, etc. That means it can be found with a minimum of steps. Opening a compartment would be OK. Having to move the ice chest, skis, kids, tubes, dogs, towels, etc. wouldn't be.
As far as when a driver is taken into custody and the disposition of the boat. This is a training and common sense issue. I always trained my guys to ask the operator (or owner) what they want done with the boat. We could release it to a sober passenger, tow it ourselves to a safe mooring, hand it off to another unit (or Coast Guard Auxiliary) to tow it. Call for commercial vessel assist, etc. We would NEVER just leave it out there with an unqualified driver.
A lot of times, the owner will tell us that no one except he drives the boat, thinking it would get him out of the arrest and wouldn't tell us where he was camped for us to tow it to. It was only when we began to call the tow company with the flat bed roll back, that he remembered that his wife knew how to drive just fine.
We would also never go on another boat. (Except if we had to take someone resisting into custody). Why put ourselves into THEIR environment. It just takes away a safety buffer between us and a potentially hostile situation. I'll tell you a secret. At least for me. If I stopped you, you were doing FSTs from the moment I stopped you. I'd ask for registration, a form of ID, a wearable PFD for each person, a type IV throwable, and a fire extinguisher. A sober person would get me each of those things with little or no further prompting. An impaired person would forget what I asked for and stop after the registration. I'd have to keep asking for the equipment. He'd forget where the PFDs were. Forget where the fire extinguisher was, etc. This would all be noted. It was also suspicious when the driver would just sit there with a blank stare, while the other people on the boat would get the stuff and talk to me.
Another reason I'd ask for everything at once, is that when you ask for one thing at a time, it looks like you're "fishing", as in "let me see your PFD". OK, "let me see your registration", OK "let em see your Fire extinguisher", etc. Ask for it all at once and they know from the start what you're looking for.
At this point I'd ask the driver to put on a PFD and come over to my boat. I'd watch as he put the PFD on, to see if he could do it and do it correctly. The impaired person would just put it on without buckling it, if he put it on right at all, and when asked to buckle it, would only do one or two straps. I'd also note how he moved around the boat, if he was more unsteady than he should have been given the wave/wake action at the time. Once on my boat, I could then better evaluate his speech, odor of booze, etc. If, at this point, I determined he was NOT impaired, I'd issue the ticket or warning and send him on his way. If I felt more investigation was needed, I'd do the HGN, FSTs, etc. and take it from there.
One note about the preliminary breath test. (PBT, PAS, whatever) This is done after all other FSTs. Its only purpose is to confirm that the impairment you see in other FSTs is from alcohol and not drugs. If someone fails the FSTs and blows .000 or really low, then you have to look for drugs. The numerical results from the PBT ARE NOT admissible in court. All we can testify to is that it showed a presence of alcohol. This aids in the decision about whether we do the intoxilyzer or take blood.
The evidentiary test (blood or breath) and "implied consent" only applies AFTER you have been arrested. At this point you should already have enough to allege "impairment" and the test is simply to measure the BAC.
Since we don't go on your boat, there's nothing to worry about scratching the gel coat. If any of my guys came to work with anything other than sneakers, tennis shoes, deck shoes, or other soft soled shoes, I'd send them home.
If an officer damages your boat in any way. FILE A CLAIM!. You've got a camera. Take pictures. Ask for a supervisor. Ask for HIS supervisor, if you don't get satisfaction from the first one. Follow up. But don't expect that a mistake (an unexpected wake, etc) that scratches the boat means that you're going to get off from a violation.
Too many people don't follow up on inconsiderate or asshole officers and the conduct continues. We are supposed to be professional, courteous, and know and do our jobs correctly. There's no place for douchebags in this profession. But the administrators can't do anything if we don't know about it. And we need to know about it from the person wronged (not a friend, or the wife, or an uninterested bystander). We need to know about it when it happens (or as close as practical). Not three weeks later or after you lose your case. We need to know the facts. Don't make stuff up. Remember that there may be audio or video of the incident. Any blatant embellishment or false accusations will destroy your credibility and nullify any complaint.
I don't disagree that there are doucehbags in the profession. But the more the public accepts it, the more it is allowed to continue. And complaints work. I have personally sent several people packing who wouldn't or couldn't get with the program. File the complaint and follow up through the proper channels. Playing tough guy on the internet doesn't accomplish anything.
"Readily Accessible" is the standard for wearable PFDs, fire extinguisher, etc. That means it can be found with a minimum of steps. Opening a compartment would be OK. Having to move the ice chest, skis, kids, tubes, dogs, towels, etc. wouldn't be.
As far as when a driver is taken into custody and the disposition of the boat. This is a training and common sense issue. I always trained my guys to ask the operator (or owner) what they want done with the boat. We could release it to a sober passenger, tow it ourselves to a safe mooring, hand it off to another unit (or Coast Guard Auxiliary) to tow it. Call for commercial vessel assist, etc. We would NEVER just leave it out there with an unqualified driver.
A lot of times, the owner will tell us that no one except he drives the boat, thinking it would get him out of the arrest and wouldn't tell us where he was camped for us to tow it to. It was only when we began to call the tow company with the flat bed roll back, that he remembered that his wife knew how to drive just fine.
We would also never go on another boat. (Except if we had to take someone resisting into custody). Why put ourselves into THEIR environment. It just takes away a safety buffer between us and a potentially hostile situation. I'll tell you a secret. At least for me. If I stopped you, you were doing FSTs from the moment I stopped you. I'd ask for registration, a form of ID, a wearable PFD for each person, a type IV throwable, and a fire extinguisher. A sober person would get me each of those things with little or no further prompting. An impaired person would forget what I asked for and stop after the registration. I'd have to keep asking for the equipment. He'd forget where the PFDs were. Forget where the fire extinguisher was, etc. This would all be noted. It was also suspicious when the driver would just sit there with a blank stare, while the other people on the boat would get the stuff and talk to me.
Another reason I'd ask for everything at once, is that when you ask for one thing at a time, it looks like you're "fishing", as in "let me see your PFD". OK, "let me see your registration", OK "let em see your Fire extinguisher", etc. Ask for it all at once and they know from the start what you're looking for.
At this point I'd ask the driver to put on a PFD and come over to my boat. I'd watch as he put the PFD on, to see if he could do it and do it correctly. The impaired person would just put it on without buckling it, if he put it on right at all, and when asked to buckle it, would only do one or two straps. I'd also note how he moved around the boat, if he was more unsteady than he should have been given the wave/wake action at the time. Once on my boat, I could then better evaluate his speech, odor of booze, etc. If, at this point, I determined he was NOT impaired, I'd issue the ticket or warning and send him on his way. If I felt more investigation was needed, I'd do the HGN, FSTs, etc. and take it from there.
One note about the preliminary breath test. (PBT, PAS, whatever) This is done after all other FSTs. Its only purpose is to confirm that the impairment you see in other FSTs is from alcohol and not drugs. If someone fails the FSTs and blows .000 or really low, then you have to look for drugs. The numerical results from the PBT ARE NOT admissible in court. All we can testify to is that it showed a presence of alcohol. This aids in the decision about whether we do the intoxilyzer or take blood.
The evidentiary test (blood or breath) and "implied consent" only applies AFTER you have been arrested. At this point you should already have enough to allege "impairment" and the test is simply to measure the BAC.
Since we don't go on your boat, there's nothing to worry about scratching the gel coat. If any of my guys came to work with anything other than sneakers, tennis shoes, deck shoes, or other soft soled shoes, I'd send them home.
If an officer damages your boat in any way. FILE A CLAIM!. You've got a camera. Take pictures. Ask for a supervisor. Ask for HIS supervisor, if you don't get satisfaction from the first one. Follow up. But don't expect that a mistake (an unexpected wake, etc) that scratches the boat means that you're going to get off from a violation.
Too many people don't follow up on inconsiderate or asshole officers and the conduct continues. We are supposed to be professional, courteous, and know and do our jobs correctly. There's no place for douchebags in this profession. But the administrators can't do anything if we don't know about it. And we need to know about it from the person wronged (not a friend, or the wife, or an uninterested bystander). We need to know about it when it happens (or as close as practical). Not three weeks later or after you lose your case. We need to know the facts. Don't make stuff up. Remember that there may be audio or video of the incident. Any blatant embellishment or false accusations will destroy your credibility and nullify any complaint.
I don't disagree that there are doucehbags in the profession. But the more the public accepts it, the more it is allowed to continue. And complaints work. I have personally sent several people packing who wouldn't or couldn't get with the program. File the complaint and follow up through the proper channels. Playing tough guy on the internet doesn't accomplish anything.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
If you are commenting on what I said....tough guy means shit. I have stated what happened several times in the past. You would have little idea what it feels like to have someone be a jackboot while you are forced to take their shit.
This wasn't an arrest....but they demanded I leave my vessel.
This was in your area, I believe, since it was Parker. The officer was wearing regular boots.
As far as the last part, you were the one who told me I had recourse. Up until then, call me naive, but I didn't think anything would be done. "If I knew then, what I know now." I would have, I assure you.
Brian
This wasn't an arrest....but they demanded I leave my vessel.
This was in your area, I believe, since it was Parker. The officer was wearing regular boots.
As far as the last part, you were the one who told me I had recourse. Up until then, call me naive, but I didn't think anything would be done. "If I knew then, what I know now." I would have, I assure you.
Brian
Ballyhoo
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 1,186
- Reaction score
- 1,920
Nobody is bashing your boat-take it easy. I respect your opinion on this issue as nobody really likes to get stopped for any reason by the cops, I get that.
Labor Day is the perfect time to educate boaters as many occasional boaters are out on the water. Some times folks that are veteran boaters who are not violating any laws will get contacted. It's just the way it is under the current, well litigated laws. It's not the cops it's the legislators.
You can act and do whatever you feel you have to or need to do when you get stopped for a boat safety inspection. If you would like to act like a complete dick that is your decision to make. The cops will do their job either way.
PVHCA
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 9,806
- Reaction score
- 3,025
I've only had one bad encounter with LEO's and that was at Mead years ago, I followed up and filed a complaint with their Captain and from what I understand and experienced they got some shit for going about my deal all wrong.
As for an LEO not entering a boat, well it happened when we got pulled over coming through the gorge a few years back. My buddy's wife(VERY obviously pregnant), experienced boater and a DDS was driving our 3 drunks for the day, we got waved into the "SAFETY CHECK POINT" at Jack Kelly's beach just below the I10/Topock bridge. Rocky to say the least near the CK POINT, she idled over and stated she wasn't coming into the rocky beach, they idled over on a different boat to meet her, as they got close one deputy jumped into the boat with BLACK BOOTS right onto the white seat, my buddy got a lil pissed but kept composure when he asked the deputy to step off the seat, deputy became an instant asshole, insisting she beach the boat, do a safety check and breathalyzer. She said NO, do the check here and give me the test, dude decide just to make her blow, 0 point 0 came back. He jumped off and we left.
My most recent dealings and one I thought was handled terribly.
As for an LEO not entering a boat, well it happened when we got pulled over coming through the gorge a few years back. My buddy's wife(VERY obviously pregnant), experienced boater and a DDS was driving our 3 drunks for the day, we got waved into the "SAFETY CHECK POINT" at Jack Kelly's beach just below the I10/Topock bridge. Rocky to say the least near the CK POINT, she idled over and stated she wasn't coming into the rocky beach, they idled over on a different boat to meet her, as they got close one deputy jumped into the boat with BLACK BOOTS right onto the white seat, my buddy got a lil pissed but kept composure when he asked the deputy to step off the seat, deputy became an instant asshole, insisting she beach the boat, do a safety check and breathalyzer. She said NO, do the check here and give me the test, dude decide just to make her blow, 0 point 0 came back. He jumped off and we left.
My most recent dealings and one I thought was handled terribly.
Ballyhoo
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 1,186
- Reaction score
- 1,920
I don't think anyone has doubted your story. I know that you have posted it before. It did not sound like it was any fun at all. Just remember that you do have recourse. Go make a formal complaint. BC is right, they actually will listen to you.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
Dude, your supposed to take the harassment with a smile and deep expression of thanks. Didn't you know that? :yikes
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
Next time, lay on your belly in the boat and pull your pants down. That way the cop has a place to park his bike.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
cofooter
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2012
- Messages
- 6,001
- Reaction score
- 10,256
Thank for the explanation Boatcop, that certainly seems reasonable to me. I have a question though on how boaters are targeted for a safety inspection. I've never been pulled over, but then again I avoid doing knucklehead things. On any given weekend in Parker there are dozens of idiots that have zero clue about safe boating. The pass or follow too close, drive on the wrong side, drive erratically, have an overloaded boat, etc, etc. They are everywhere and it would seem like it would be a full time job for the LEO's just reeling in and lecturing those guys. And a lot of good would come from it. My question is, if I'm just floating, or cruising slowly from point A to point B, am I just as much of a target as those guys? Or how do you decide who to pull over? And if I'm out at night putting around with the correct lights, am I a target just because I'm out at night? For the record, I boat sober just like everyone else on this site, just prefer not to be hassled. Thanks
riverroyal
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2007
- Messages
- 14,443
- Reaction score
- 20,071
Litigated laws, legislators have absolutely nothing to do with boarding a boat for a safety check. Boarding a boat for a safety check on a holiday in havasu is looking for a BUI. I'm sorry, but we don't see eye to eye on this, so yes I will be a dick. Because just like they can stop me for something unwarranted, I can be a dick for being harassed. Even if the LE is completely polite, he approached me, I didn't approach him. That's a waste of my time and family time.
So no throw cushion at arms length? Wasn't there a whistle law before, or air horn? I know I had one on my magic before I got the tin can.
BoatCop
Retired And Loving It.
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 5,392
- Reaction score
- 9,598
Personally, I looked for an obvious violation or unsafe maneuver before contacting a boat. Expired registration, obvious underage without PFDs, speeding through congested waters (worming in and out around floating boats, such as the Dam area), causing wake in no wake area, near misses, wrong way, improper lights, excess speed at night, etc. I always found something they were doing wrong before stopping them.
A quick note here on Probable Cause and Reasonable Suspicion. Reasonable suspicion is actions that would make a reasonable person believe that something illegal might be going on, but might not be enough to arrest and/or charge a person with a crime. For example, a person wearing dark clothes, gloves, and carrying a 50" TV down the street at 2:00 AM. It's not a crime to do that, but any reasonable person would suspect that something wasn't right, and a stop to check it out would be prudent.
Probable cause is that there is sufficient evidence that a crime was committed and that the person involved probably committed the crime. This would be after talking to the guy, checking the serial number, and a call coming in that a house a block over had just been burglarized and a 50" TV, the same model as this one, was taken.
In some cases, where I was "wrong", such as a young looking teenager without a PFD, after the kid was identified as "of age", I'd wish them a good day and continue on, unless I observed something else.
While the law permits LE to stop a vessel for any or no reason for inspection, overuse of that tactic could piss off the public, and in some cases could get a more serious offense thrown out. While no one will put up a lot of money to contest and appeal the charge if they were stopped for no reason and didn't have a Fire Extinguisher, if a guy is caught with drugs or other serious offense, the reason for the stop, or lack thereof, could get the case thrown out. There are just too many people doing unsafe things to waste the public's and my time pulling someone over for no reason.
If I absolutely, positively want to stop a particular boat, I'll find a reason to stop them. I once had intel about a boat on Lake Havasu that was suspected of ferrying drugs from Havasu Landing to the City. This was during a crackdown on I-40. Rather than risk a suppression of the evidence, I needed to make sure I had the reasonable suspicion to stop the boat. I noticed that the boat's registration numbers weren't properly spaced. There was my reason, and the stop and inspection revealed several bales of marijuana, cocaine and heroin.
But that's just me and how I trained others. How they do now it is up to them, their supervisors, and/or policies and procedures. All I know is that in over 45 years of my own boating, I've never been stopped or inspected. And if I ever am, I know that I'll have everything the law requires and then some.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
There you have it peeps.
And I am sure your badge will have precluded you from any harassment, sorry I mean enforcement, of our gazillion laws. Damn lawbreakers with their CF AZ numbers too close together. Insert roll eyes here.
And I am sure your badge will have precluded you from any harassment, sorry I mean enforcement, of our gazillion laws. Damn lawbreakers with their CF AZ numbers too close together. Insert roll eyes here.
RiverDave
In it to win it
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2007
- Messages
- 126,085
- Reaction score
- 164,066
I was gonna crack a joke that said "You know what color car gets the last amount of tickets?" 2 tone... black and white. Inferring that nobody is going to pull over the police boat, but to be honest I've been trying to be nice to BoatCop and didn't want him to take it the wrong way.
I can say this... You don't know what you got until it's gone. Parker was a better place to boat before he retired. I appreciate the years of service BoatCop (even though sometimes in text it might seem like I don't.. I do)
RD
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
Probably so. He is but only one officer though.
I know of one day they ran a citizen out that didn't want to deal with their thug tactics.
BoatCop
Retired And Loving It.
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 5,392
- Reaction score
- 9,598
And how would they know I was a cop? When I go (or went) on Havasu, Mead, Mohave, Powell, or back on the Delaware River, or Ala Moana Harbor, or any of the dozens of other places I boated, who knew I was LE? Actually no one.
And the times I have been stopped on the highway (there has been a few) I'm courteous and have only been cited once. (Gardnerville, NV by NHP) I keep my badge in my wallet, out of view and don't flash it. It doesn't (or at least didn't) make any difference when I stopped one, so I never flashed mine.
And I've arrested or cited Coast Guard members and cops. The only difference between them and anyone else, was that I made a call to their command or Agency if they badged me and/or wanted special favors. I was actually less inclined to do favors, since they knew better.
Bradsrvrtoy.
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2011
- Messages
- 295
- Reaction score
- 149
I agree boat cop kept a medium balance between enforcement and I think understood the Parker area commerce well. Lots of new LE faces out there now on the strip. seems like I am swerving around le boats more than recreational boats out there. Had an officer stopping and checking a boat drifting around the island by buckskin valley the other weekend taking up that entire CA side channel. all of us trying to go through had to come off plane and wait until they drifted past the narrow opening.
I am glad to see him still in the boards! He provides alot of information that is very valuable to us as boaters
milkmoney
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2008
- Messages
- 31,478
- Reaction score
- 20,585
Ok I have a ? Boarding a persons boat , being that it is private property, is it the same as entering a persons house , that also is private property , which when doing so, doesn't the police need a search warrant ?
If that makes any sense [emoji202]
If that makes any sense [emoji202]
I know plenty of cops and the one that got hosed the most was one who was proud to flash his badge the sheriff who stopped him at glamis said so "you see my sleeves"He was a seargant and told him "do you want me to notify yours and let him know how you spend your wekends violating the law"
This shut him up real fast and was told to park his ride(no current registration)and that if was seen again it was getting towed.We all gave him shit the rest of the weekend he was scared.
My uncle who is also a deputy this guy has rarely shown his badge and gets let go and chats with the officers.He lets them find out hes a deputy and then leads to a sorry and a conversation.A whole different approach one a rookie the other a veteran.
Ballyhoo
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 1,186
- Reaction score
- 1,920
Not the same as a house. Apples and oranges.
That is the short answer to your question.
Ziggy
SlumLord
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 40,124
- Reaction score
- 45,682
There ain't a single boater that is or would be happy being checked. Hell the captains on Deadliest Catch hate it with passion(loved the episode when WildBill cranked up the heater) but it seems we as boaters automatically give up certain rights we have on land. It seems a large percentage of us do not know our 'on a vessel' rights as well as we should.. ...or some think they do but actually don't.
The big issue really comes down to the LEO forcing feeding some sort of citation and/or arrest on less compliant operators because the guy was being a dick.
The hiring of overtime officers not usually associated within the boating community doesn't help when they are disrespectful of said operators vessel and then puff their badged chest to beat you back into submission if you say something.
I mean geez, if a regular person is asked not to step on the white seats with his black boots the normal response is 'oh sorry man' not a 'FU I'm a cop' sort of retart.
The big issue really comes down to the LEO forcing feeding some sort of citation and/or arrest on less compliant operators because the guy was being a dick.
The hiring of overtime officers not usually associated within the boating community doesn't help when they are disrespectful of said operators vessel and then puff their badged chest to beat you back into submission if you say something.
I mean geez, if a regular person is asked not to step on the white seats with his black boots the normal response is 'oh sorry man' not a 'FU I'm a cop' sort of retart.
JB in so cal
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 7,996
- Reaction score
- 9,383
Would be done at the ramp on the way IN!:skull
riverroyal
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2007
- Messages
- 14,443
- Reaction score
- 20,071
That's the same as floating right? Or is it diff when your stopped like that? Motor off on a beach I can say I loaned my throw cushion to my friend, he was going for a quick ride.
OR, does LE not bother with 'safety checks' stopped like that because anyone can be the operator, how would they know who's been drinking,,,,,,I mean not being safe:rolleyes
OR, does LE not bother with 'safety checks' stopped like that because anyone can be the operator, how would they know who's been drinking,,,,,,I mean not being safe:rolleyes
spectracular
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 22, 2015
- Messages
- 937
- Reaction score
- 854
Hey Alan,
Thanks for your responses to the questions asked so far. Would you mind giving us a list of things that the boat owners can and can't do during a stop? For instance, if we get approached, And we feel that the conditions are unsafe to stop right then and there, can we proceed to move to a nearby cove, or away from a crowded area that is let's say 1000 feet away without issue? or to turn about to put the bow into the wind to keep people dry.
I get it that it should be common courtesy and mutual respect...YMMV
Thanks for your responses to the questions asked so far. Would you mind giving us a list of things that the boat owners can and can't do during a stop? For instance, if we get approached, And we feel that the conditions are unsafe to stop right then and there, can we proceed to move to a nearby cove, or away from a crowded area that is let's say 1000 feet away without issue? or to turn about to put the bow into the wind to keep people dry.
I get it that it should be common courtesy and mutual respect...YMMV
Bradsrvrtoy.
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2011
- Messages
- 295
- Reaction score
- 149
I think Dave should start a whole thread called "ask boat cop" thread so people can ask Alan questions and he answers and its easily searchable.
PVHCA
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 9,806
- Reaction score
- 3,025
When I was in my mid/late teens I was the DD for the old guys trips to the river, one SBCS, one retired SBCS, and a helpful business owner to the CHP and the SBCS. Once I was on the 40 EB they told me to set the cruise at 100 and keep it straight. Only one time we had an issue, got red lighted just east of Ludlow, beers open all throughout the suburban except in my lap, LOL. CHP comes up on the passenger side and tells me to get my ass out of the car, I'm waiting for the dipshits to come to the rescue. After 10 minutes of getting torn a new asshole by the CHP he tells me to SLOW the FUCK down and don't listen to Ray, Manno and Gary ever again. I'm thinkin what the fuck? How's he know their names? Get back into the sub and they are all cracking up, bustin my balls for listening to them when they said break the law, I'm like WTF, ya'll tell me to do this every time, they all said ya but you didn't have to listen, Fuckers.
I've been told by close cop friends that most cops won't hassle other cops unless they are acting like complete morons.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
You think?
There you go with logic and common sense.
We don't need that here.
Safety? No, DUI money and fines are what the revenue officers are after. "Safety" is just the guise it is done under to gain public support.
Brian
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
NICE! Great to know enforcement of the laws don't apply to those LE. More evidence those in charge somehow feel above the rules.
PVHCA
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 9,806
- Reaction score
- 3,025
IMO a perk for those that put their life on the line to protect our asses every day, FLAME AWAY!!
And we are talking 30 years ago BUDDY!!
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
A perk ey? Nice Godfather.
Trust me, 30 years ago or not, that shit still goes on my friend. I am sure you are aware.
Brian
PVHCA
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 9,806
- Reaction score
- 3,025
YUP and good, CERTAIN liberties should be allowed, IMO!!
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
PVHCA
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 9,806
- Reaction score
- 3,025
Which branch is hiring Senior Citizens? LOL
BoatCop
Retired And Loving It.
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 5,392
- Reaction score
- 9,598
What logic? What common sense?
If there's any logic or common sense, it was voiced by the court in the Texas case in the decision upholding the constitutionality of warrantless stops/inspections on the water:
"Additionally, the Court recognized that unlike cars on highways, boat checkpoints are impractical because there are no established avenues of transport on the water. Schenekl argues that fixed checkpoints at docks or boating ramps would be practical, but we disagree. As the Villamonte Court noted, checkpoints at ports would be easy to avoid. The same holds true for lakes. Some boaters dock their boats at their homes rather than using public docks or boating ramps. If checkpoints were established only at public docks, lakeside residents would be forever immune from compliance with boating regulations. Even if checkpoints at docks were established, it would be an ineffective mechanism for enforcement, because a boater could comply with regulations while at the dock but be in noncompliance out on the lake."
And I'll say it again. When Mohave County can stop and inspect over 120 boats and only write a dozen tickets or so, how is that just collecting revenue? If they were so interested in just the fine money, there would be a lot more citations issued, and those 102 warnings would be cites.
I think last year we wrote maybe 20 cites on the Strip. Out of hundreds of stops.
Maybe you would be able to comprehend this concept if I make it big enough:
POLICE DEPARTMENTS GET ZERO DOLLARS FROM COURT FINES FOR OUI, DUI, TRAFFIC TICKETS OR BOATING TICKETS.
Maybe 10% goes to the County or City General Fund, with the rest going to the Local Court and the State Court system.
THE FINES GENERATED BY THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY HAS NO BEARING ON THEIR BUDGET OR FUNDING LEVEL.
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
I'm younger than you , bitch!!
wsuwrhr
The Masheenest
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2007
- Messages
- 35,634
- Reaction score
- 23,838
sigh.
There are relatively finite launching ramps for the general public.
Where does the money from fines go, ultimately? Semantics, sir. None of you peeps worked for free.
There are relatively finite launching ramps for the general public.
Where does the money from fines go, ultimately? Semantics, sir. None of you peeps worked for free.
