How Did You Become "Conservative"?

[dribble]

I knew after growing up with two liberal Democrats as parents that I was a conservative in November 1980. That was the day I went to the polls and marked my ballot for Reagan. I’ve not voted for a Democrat in a major election since.

 

[Rajobigguy]

Born in 1956 and raised in the country. Learned at an early age the reward of hard work, how to build and fix stuff, work on cars, etc. Nothing worthwhile comes easy. You are rewarded for the work you put in and the effort made. Was taught to treat others fairly and with respect until they do something to lose it. Be polite, respect your elders, mind your manners, and act like a man.

I've always been called an "old soul". I hung out with older people and acted more mature than my age. The old adage, "If you aren't a liberal when you're young you have no heart. If you're not a conservative when you're old you have no brain" come to mind.

This would be almost word for word my reply.

 

[LazyLavey]

1971, I was 16 and had a girlfriend whose big sister was a straight up hippy........ and she never wore a bra

Big sister puts a Mcovern bumper sticker on my car... and I'm all in..

I get home and I swear I'd never seen my stepdad (good old boy from Texas) that pissed... Thought he was gonna kick my ass

It's amazing the influence teenage boobies can have on you....

 

[Tank]

Pretty much sums up the left.


Fuckin' LOVE Thomas Sowell.

 

[hallett3]

Grew up in republican house hold. Dad and mom worked hard to raise us. Was raised nothing is for free. Work for it. My two brothers and sister and I have same values. My wife and her brother are conservative Republicans. Wife’s 3 other sisters are hard core Democrats/liberals along with their husbands. One of my wife’s brother in-law likes taking politics. Last outing didn’t go well. Big blow out regarding troops getting killed. Honestly I wanted to punch him out what he said about Biden’s failures on that issue. I told my wife if you were liberal like that I know we would not be married. It’s getting harder to visit my wife’s family because they live in a fantasyland bubble.

 

[poncho]

Politics were not real big in my house. Asked my Dad when I was 13-14 whats the diff on a Republican and Democrat. To this day still the best description I have ever heard.
Dad said you know how your up at 4:30 doing chores before school and the drunken neighbor down the way rolls out of bed at 10:00 and putters around his farm for a few hours mostly complaining.
The town leaders have decided that it's not fair that we have so much and they have so little. This year everything is going in one pile and gets distributed equally.
That pissed me off and I instantly understood where I would be the rest of my life.

 

[Cdog]

My family has all been engineers and real estate brokers and developers. Entrepreneurs and engineers tend to be logical thinkers/lean conservative. While I'm more of a libertarian, I conceded it's more of an ethos than a political party so Conservative is more or less where I fit. I'm fiscally conservative but libertarian socially.

For instance I think abortion is sad and disgusting. However, abortion eliminates future liberals, leeches and poor people. So I'm pragmatic...

While I respect religion, I cant stand it's control over the Republican Party.

To answer the question. I've been this way since I started thinking about politics. I was the kid that mowed lawns, washed cars & painted house address #'s on curbs for cash in the neighborhood. I remember what a pain in the ass it was buying paint because of low life taggers, thinking to myself who would waste their time on tagging when you can make some money with that paint. I had work experience in HS and left school at lunch my jr. & Sr years.

Based on reading the memoirs of the founding fathers their intent of creating the constitution and amendments was to limit government to become what it is today.

I guess I've never had a heart.

But Reagan's 64 speech encompasses my definition of the promise of Conservatism. I discovered this sometime in my early teens and was inspired by it. Sadly the current crop of "conservatives and republicans" are failures. Might as well call them democrats. We're now voting for a combination of who's gonna fuck us the least and who's lies we think will affect us the least. The last stage of the boxes of freedom.

Watch, learn and listen

 

[92562]

Grew up in a conservative house and owned my first gun at age 8. Was in a Boy Scout troop that had very conservative leaders. I had several liberal friends in college that had no idea I was conservative. I am still "friends" with some of them on facepage but with everything going on right now, they are starting to dislike me more and more. My wife and I managed to raise 2 very conservative kids, daughter graduates NAU in December, 24 year old son will graduate USNA in '23. Most of their friends are also conservative.

 

[PlanB]

My father was involved in politics from the local to the state level (worked for two Republican California governors) and was a lifelong Republican. My grandparents on both sides were conservative Democrats. The clincher for me was Carter and the Iran hostage crisis. I was 12 years old when that incident happened and then Reagan came along. Reagan's message and then action's as POTUS of strength versus the weakness of Carter cemented my affiliation with the Republicans.

 

[84miller]

My parents raised me by giving me the basics. A place to live, food and clothes of their choice. Nothing else, as they stated, "if you don't work for it, you will not appreciate it". End of story, I started working at 15 and have never stopped until retirement. I registered as a Republican at 18 because it mirrored my core values.

 

[Flyinbowtie]

Great topic.
In the answers is how we teach the gulible and those who are being swayed by the propaganda the way to the truth.
Dad was a union machinist, and considered himself a conservative democrat. Carter was his last straw, and I turned 18 and was already a Conservative.
He went to switch parties the day I registered.
I got my first tax paying job, sweeping floors in a machine shop, at 12. I wanted a Schwinn Continental 10 speed bike, cost was 94.99. Dad says fine, let me know when you have the money, we will go get it. Work is what you need.
Back then, the first check was called the lesson about the difference between "net" and "gross" pay.
I was furious. I had grossed almost 19 dollars, and my check was for $14.25. I still have a copy of it someplace. This was in around 1970.
I worked my ass off and went to school long before school work permits were a thing, and would have ignored that had it been a thing.
College was a very enlightening experience, even in 1978 the Socialists were laying the foundation for the mind scrubbing that has led us to where we are, then, the cherry on top was 26 years in the cop shop, were we were treated to daily examples of the abject failure of the government in the "social services" and education systems, where the only answer was always more money, more programs, more freebies, and the result was always more failure.
When you see the failure happening at every level, and what it does to the human spirit, Conservatism is the only logical course of action in a Republic.
Which is why the socialists are working so hard to destroy ours.

 

[Tom Slick]

I was born with common sense. You either got it, or ya don’t.

 

[rrrr]

My Dad put me to work in his shop when I was eleven, paid me 50¢ an hour. I filed my first tax return when I was twelve, did it by myself and have done so for the last 52 years.

In 1985 when oil collapsed and the savings and loan crisis hit Texas, I lost my job. Went to the unemployment office, got in a line that was twenty deep, and stood there for two minutes. I looked around at the hundred or so people in the lines, thought to myself "Fuck this", and spent the next 18 months doing whatever work I could find.

I credit my parents for instilling in me a value system that rewarded hard work, that honesty and character mean everything, and that I controlled my destiny.

 

[j21black]

Grew up in a Democrat house hold - In a heavily Democrat county - State wasn't just where we lived.

Grand Father and Grand Mother were die hard Dems - Got Christmas cards from the White House when a Dem was in office.

1997 I voted for Clinton in the first election I was able to vote in - By 2001 I was voting Republican.

Dad was an elected Democrat for a few year in the late 00's - Still votes that way. My Step Mom is an off her rocker lib. If she tries to talk politics with me my Dad usually tells her to shut up. Last time she went all out I dared her to walk through Detroit at night and then we could talk about all of the great things Dems did for that city when she returned. It was a good time to show up for Thanksgiving every year wearing a Trump shirt. Dad rarely brings up the subject with me. Not sure if he knows better or would just rather ignore it. I know he told my brother to remember how my Grandfather would vote before before the last presidential election. Brother didn't say much, but he should have at least spit out it isn't JFK's party anymore.

My little brother voted Dem up until a few years ago. Now that party makes him sick on a national level. I'm sure he still votes Dem locally for the few he knows and has relationships with which I can understand. I moved long ago so don't have that issue.

Step Dad has been an elected Democrat for nearly 40 years and he started voting Republican Nationally I would guess around 2008 or 2012, and has continued to do so. In January he actually changed parties and is now an elected Republican.

I guess when I started collecting a pay check and seeing how things affected me personally, I made decisions that we in the best interest of me and my in home family.

 

[rrrr]

View attachment 1056579

Pretty much sums up the left.


Fuckin' LOVE Thomas Sowell.

Sowell is a great man. I discovered him in the 80s, and his views on personal responsibility and race are dead on.

 

[HubbaHubbaLife]

I grew up in a house that really wasn't politically oriented. Not much political talk at all. I never really paid any attention. As I got older and started paying a little attention I felt I was "independent" where I agreed on some views on both sides of the isle (still do somewhat). But the more you pay attention to politics the more the conservative or libertarian mindset makes sense. I changed my registration to R first time ever after Obama. However, I think I'm more Libertarian than true Republican.

But the biggest number one factor of why I finally changed my status to R was I wanted to get away from the Democratic party and the behavior they displayed as quickly and as far as possible. The shit they do, the shit they say, the way they behave and things they want and allow is beyond disguising, it's detrimental to this country.

Well said!

 

[HTTP404]

On ABC channel 7 News they had two commentators. Bill Press and Bruce Herschensohn. I used to listen to their pieces and quickly realized the Bill Press guy was a baffoon. That is how I realized which 'side' I was on.

 

[JUSTWANNARACE]

 

[HubbaHubbaLife]

Inheritance taxation

 

[farmo83]

I work for a big oil company, I have to be conservative or I'd be advocating myself out of a job.

As has been said by others I grew up in a household that taught the value of hard work and I had awesome role models to emulate. My grandpa was a "Southern Democrat." He claimed he hadn't voted Republican since Hoover, however ask him his view on any issue and he was a Republican. My undgrad is in Finance and my MBA is specialized in Finance as well so I'm extremely pro markets. I don't understand how anyone with a basic understanding of economics can advocate for being a progressive, socialist agenda. I've long said we need more business minded folks in office (not just Trump).

I'm 38 and in my somewhat brief time on this earth, I've found that most younger folks start out very idealistic in nature and lean to the left. Then as they start making money they start to tilt back to the right.

And yes I am a massive advocate of Thomas Sowell! The man is the most underrated economist of our time.

 

[Tank]

I work for a big oil company, I have to be conservative or I'd be advocating myself out of a job.

As has been said by others I grew up in a household that taught the value of hard work and I had awesome role models to emulate. My grandpa was a "Southern Democrat." He claimed he hadn't voted Republican since Hoover, however ask him his view on any issue and he was a Republican. My undgrad is in Finance and my MBA is specialized in Finance as well so I'm extremely pro markets. I don't understand how anyone with a basic understanding of economics can advocate for being a progressive, socialist agenda. I've long said we need more business minded folks in office (not just Trump).

I'm 38 and in my somewhat brief time on this earth, I've found that most younger folks start out very idealistic in nature and lean to the left. Then as they start making money they start to tilt back to the right.

And yes I am a massive advocate of Thomas Sowell! The man is the most underrated economist of our time.

There's a really good short documentary on Sowell. If you have an hour I highly recommend watching it. Brilliant and fascinating guy.

 

[DaytonaBabe]

How Did You Become "Conservative"?​

Well, I wasn't born as an idiot, so it was pretty natural....

 

[TPC]

Something for nothing always ends up with nothing for something.

My wife and I have always been self reliant.
A Democrat has no perception of that.

 

[TeamGreene]

So the synopsis is, good parenting is key to raising well adjusted, productive members of society. Not that we needed to be told.

 

[samsah33]

Went to school and learned about finance, economics, taxes, redistribution, etc...

Then I began dealing with the government. When was your day ever made better after dealing with the government?

 

[Englewood]

Senior year of high school the government teacher asks who is a democrat. I raise my hand, said "I'm a democrat". I just knew slick willy was getting BJ's under his desk and that sounded fun. The teacher then says "there is one thing im sure of, and that is you are NOT a democrat"

That's where it all started...Never cared about gov before that. Plus, I have a functioning brain so I cant be a democrat.

 

[Mandelon]

 

[boatdoc55]

View attachment 1056579

Pretty much sums up the left.


Fuckin' LOVE Thomas Sowell.

Something our EX resident liberals I hope are reading. What do you think squeezy, how bout you rod???

 

[Tooms22]

I grew up in a very lefty home. I'll be 62 next week. My mom is a PhD English professor as well as both of my Stepfathers. One growing up, and my Mom's current husband. My Mom is the worst of them, proud Atheist Socialist Anyway... I always say if I write a book the title will be "I Learned all My Conservative Values from my Socialist Mother". It blows my mind, but she taught me to work hard, nothing is free, you're responsible for all that happens to you, people are more important than animals etc. etc. With all that I was still a hippy dippy dipshit when I started working full-time at 18. I started at Shepherd Machinery (Now Quinn) in Whittier in Nov 1977. It was probably a couple of years later that I was asked to put a political sticker on my Company Car (got it when I was 20) for some legislation. Pissed me off. But then I realized, it was their car, and they can put what they want up. Then I got a clue and understood what they were supporting helped their business. And that would mean more jobs for more people. And then I thought, "why wouldn't the owner just sell everything and kick back?" And the answer was opportunity, the opportunity to do something bigger and better, and all that would create more jobs for more people. The lights went on and I have never turned back.

College professors will never understand this. Their income comes from others, through taxes or private donations, so they believe everything can be handled this way, aka, Communism. The light will never go on for them.

I read this pattern ^ one time and it really stuck with me. Liberals often teach their kids conservative values and but then don't preach the same politically. I truly believe it's a "I want to look like a good person by promoting liberal ideals" even if they don't truly believe it.

 

[Tooms22]

For instance I think abortion is sad and disgusting. However, abortion eliminates future liberals, leeches and poor people. So I'm pragmatic...

I was raised conservative and so abortion was bad.

I have fully transitioned in the last 5 years to your stance on the issue.

Now I say it to my liberal friends, "I support abortion... because it's mostly poor, stupid, and liberal people. And we all know that we don't need any more of those!"

Their faces are the best. Start smiling at the first portion and then jaw drop/eyes big and they don't know whether to view me as an ally or an asshole. I fully enjoy the social interaction.

 

[boatdoc55]

Grew up in republican house hold. Dad and mom worked hard to raise us. Was raised nothing is for free. Work for it. My two brothers and sister and I have same values. My wife and her brother are conservative Republicans. Wife’s 3 other sisters are hard core Democrats/liberals along with their husbands. One of my wife’s brother in-law likes taking politics. Last outing didn’t go well. Big blow out regarding troops getting killed. Honestly I wanted to punch him out what he said about Biden’s failures on that issue. I told my wife if you were liberal like that I know we would not be married. It’s getting harder to visit my wife’s family because they live in a fantasyland bubble.

I told my wife after our last stay at her Sister's and BIL's house, I WILL NOT BE GOING BACK EVER!!!! BIL couldn't understand why I needed guns and why I thought Biden was an illegal President. But yet, they are the first one's to drive all over town for the cheapest gas and complain about taxes. As the saying goes, "There are none so blind than he who refuses to see."

 

[Cdog]

I was raised conservative and so abortion was bad.

I have fully transitioned in the last 5 years to your stance on the issue.

Now I say it to my liberal friends, "I support abortion... because it's mostly poor, stupid, and liberal people. And we all know that we don't need any more of those!"

Their faces are the best. Start smiling at the first portion and then jaw drop/eyes big and they don't know whether to view me as an ally or an asshole. I fully enjoy the social interaction.

Haha! Love it!!

 

[RCDave]

Thos has to be the best thread ever on RDP

 

[jetboatperformance]

Simple , had my political "head in the sand" for years , Josh used to watch Simpsons and married with Children and then O Reilly factor came on and He made sense ... boom "instant conservatism , Law and order , God Guts and guns

 

[Dalton]

I was actually a democrat most my life, and a Obama supporter for the most part. The Dossier opened my mind to how politics work, I was for the most part done with the democratic party after that. Depending on who they elected I would have maybe even gone back, but with Biden that's a hard no. Maybe in the future ill be a democrat again, but I don't see the party coming back from essentially going off the deep end like they have, its a lot different than it used to be.

 

[EmpirE231]

Born in a semi third world country, Beirut Lebanon during the civil war... Made / fought our way here. Grew up poor / didn't know any different. My dad worked his ass off everyday in construction trades, never took a government handout... made sure we all went to school. Got my first real job senior year in high school, hustling my ass off.... and saw how much the govt took from every check! That was pretty much it.

believer in the American dream via hard work... not handouts.

 

[rrrr]

I want to expand on my comments, particularly about my Dad. When you read this, in the background of everything I have done, my parents were there. This is really a great example of TLDR, but I hope you'll take the time to read it. I'm not writing this for LAM, but to share how they made my life a good ride.

My Mom was an incredible person, and her nurturing and love were essential to my upbringing. My Dad provided education and opportunity, and his confidence in me made it possible for me to grasp new trades and become proficient in their application. He also taught me about how to lead my employees and run a business.

At the age of 19, he and my grandfather started a commercial and industrial sheet metal business in 1953. They were betting that government work at Los Alamos, Sandia Base in Albuquerque, and ICBM missile and support facilities across New Mexico and the southwest was a huge opportunity.

By 1968-1970, Dad had 125 employees. He did jobs all over the country, from a 20 story office building in Portland, a million square foot film processing facility near Denver, the 2000 megawatt Four Corners power plant, multiple laboratory buildings at Los Alamos, to a large multistory science and laboratory building at OSU in Columbus.

The work force was unionized, and he constantly fought with them about me working in the shop. There's no doubt I was fortunate to have that education, and his business success allowed me to have new cars, skiing all winter at multiple Colorado resorts, hunting trips, and more.

But I was also required to work. When I was a junior in high school, he set up a company that I used to perform subcontracting work. In my senior year, with the help of two laborers, I fabbed up almost a hundred structural joists out of welded 16 gauge cold rolled steel for a downtown hotel facade. I also bought ductwork from Dad and replaced the exhaust hood and ducts in a McDonalds, working at night for a couple of weeks. This was the start of my adult career, and Mom and Dad were there to support me.

I was 19 when he sold the sheet metal business in 1978, and we moved to Houston. The area was.booming, and Dad went to work for a huge mechanical contractor. I started a commercial drywall company, and by the time I was 22, I had built out about 500,000 SF of tenant office space in four story office parks that were being constructed all over Houston.

In 1982, Dad started a mechanical contracting company, and I went back to him for five years. I obtained a journeyman plumbing license, and was certified for 6G position SMAW and MIG pipe and structural welding.

Then I went to work for Brown & Root, one of the largest construction firms in the world, as a QC inspector. I was there for several years, then moved to Dallas to work for a GC that only built data centers. By this time, I had obtained a journeyman electrical license.

In 1997, I became a partner in the firm. I performed HVAC and electrical engineering design using CAD, and a local engineering firm did oversight and stamped my drawings. By that time, the company had become just one of three GC entities which were allowed to perform construction at the Infomart in Dallas. The Infomart was considered as one of the most important locations for the exploding expansion of worldwide fiber optic systems and routes, and still is.

My partners retired in 2007, and I bought out their interest in the company. Annual revenues approached $40 million. But trouble was ahead. I have fought knee injuries and arthritis since junior high school. By 2008, I had undergone almost twenty knee surgeries, and in that year I had my first TKA, joint replacement. In the next three years, that knee required another TKA, and my other knee.was done in 2011. Both shoulders required other surgeries. I was having difficulties running the business because of it.

In 2009, I entered into a contract to build a data center in downtown Dallas. After I had done about $500K of initial work and purchased $1.3 million of equipment for the project, the company folded and I was stuck holding the bag. By this time, the economy was in freefall. I had paid my subcontractors, and.suppliers for the equipment, tried to keep things afloat, but I couldn't.

Because of the health issues, I couldn't work. Arthritis was chewing me up. I was diagnosed with thyroid cancer, and it was removed. Between that and knee problems, I had been been wrecked. At 52, the peak of earnings power, I had to accept it.

My long term disability policy and social security disability payments made up about 65% of my annual salary, and even though the disability payments have increased about 50% since then because of the policy terms, it's been a bit rough. We own our house, my shop, and two rental properties outright.

With real estate appreciation and the stock market, we will be OK in retirement, but it would have been much better if my health was good. I had cervical fusion surgery last March, and I'm still struggling with healing.

But everything I've done began with my parents. My Dad gave me an education that was far more valuable than anything I might have learned with a college degree. My Mom was incredible. On Sunday, it will be ten years since she left us, a hole in my life that still hurts.

Dad is still here, but he's going to be 88 in April. Those of you that have lost their parents know how time is getting short.

Overall, I have been so very fortunate to have their support. They shaped my life, and conservative principles allowed me to have a very happy life, one that has been pretty damn good, even with the upheaval of the last decade. My wife has also been a rock. I have to depend on her for a lot of things because of my health, and our 33 years together has been really wonderful.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[DC-88]

Exactly this but a 1040-ES! Same age started my biz. By age 25 tired of mailing the IRS a really nice house every 3-4 months.

Right? Plus don't forget the endless DE-88 checks to the useless EDD when we are already the ones employing people. It could literally be done away with and replaced with a link to Craigslist " help wanted". My Cali S corp is honestly easier to run than our little Az const. LLC among other things because of that stupid AZ TPT tax, its license, and the inefficient way they go about collecting it.
The first guy I ever voted for was the first George Bush because my Dad told me to, not because I knew anything about him. I do remember back in 3rd grade we had a mock election and my Dad had told me he was voting for Gerald Ford ( Dad was self employed ). When we tallied the votes in class it was like 25-3 for Jimmy Carter and I remember getting heckled in class, and then Carter won the election by a good margin. So a few months later I tried to get my Mom to buy me the "Billy Carter tow truck" Revelle model at Thrifty and she refused, said he was a piece of shit . Maybe that's where it really started for me .

 

[KevinR]

I thought this way for a while as well. I have to be fair and give Dennis Prager credit for changing my mind on this one. Independent politically is weak. You have no power whatsoever. Sadly, we have a two party system. You're either in, or you're out. Until that changes you have to pick a side.

Man that’s the truth right there!

 

[Happy Smitty]

I’m third generation general contractor. Nuff said.

Ha ha me too. I totally get it. Work hard for the money and work even harder to keep people from ripping you off.

 

[stephenkatsea]

The apparent political beliefs of So Cal amaze me, Not in a good way. I'm really interested in their political desires. WTF may those be?

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

You can’t “become conservative” when you’ve perennially existed as one.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

The apparent political beliefs of So Cal amaze me, Not in a good way. I'm really interested in their political desires. WTF may those be?

That everyone is guaranteed equal results regardless of status, effort, education, and victim hood - Except white people.

 

[Roosky01]

Thos has to be the best thread ever on RDP

I am a bit surprised at the participation in this thread and all of your own personal stories have been an absolute pleasure to read!

I have two daughters ages 9 and 11. I guarantee you that I will do everything in my power to lead them to a life of self reliance and independace and meet the outside forces that seek the opposite head on. It's a damn shame that we have to work so hard at it now compared to the previous generations. There are so many outside forces present now that totally contradict our belief structure that I'm not sure you could even count them...and it all starts with politics unfortunately.

Again, thanks to all of you for sharing your experiences.

 

[Ducksquasher]

My oldest daughter is named Reagan...nuff said!

 

[spectra3279]

Got tired of seeing more and more of my measly minimum wage job (back in the eighties) earnings going to taxes

 

[TeamGreene]

I think that if more people (Dems) had to sign the bottom of paychecks instead of the back there would be a lot more conservatives.

 

[COCA COLA COWBOY]

Pops voted Dem, because they were who the unions voted for. Mom was independent, but mostly conservative...Her Dad was a foreman/supervisor for aerospace machining. I'm the youngest of three,born in 77.
My sister, 8 years older, herd of kids, 3 fathers, all losers. She did drugs and drank...Last I heard, 3 of her 5 kids were productive types...don't know about her or the other 2 kids. Haven't seen or heard from her in years.
My brother, 5 years my senior, is a libtard freak! His wife the same. Both are almost 50, have their masters degrees...and student loans. They have made it clear we won't be seeing them until we are vaxxed. I feel bad for my kids...but my brother can kiss my ass.

I dropped out of college, did some shady stuff before and after. Somewhere along the trip I got married, started a family...I grew up. I got a real job, and started contracting. Made what I thought was decent money, started to build a life I was proud of. Then something happened: I realized I paid enough in taxes to support 3 families of illegals.
What I have isn't a whole lot, but I busted my ass to get it. I'll be damned if I'm going to hand it over to fools who want to give it to the lazy.

Becoming self employed has turned more liberals into conservative than anything. At the end of the day, I could care less about social views, but you mess with my dollar and them's fighting words.

 

[Shlbyntro]

Becoming self employed has turned more liberals into conservative than anything. At the end of the day, I could care less about social views, but you mess with my dollar and them's fighting words.

Really makes you wonder why our current government is working so hard to kill "gig" work, subcontracting, and redefining what can be considered self employment.... you know, to protect us from all the evil companies that are taking advantage of us.

 

[nowski]

Becoming self employed has turned more liberals into conservative than anything. At the end of the day, I could care less about social views, but you mess with my dollar and them's fighting words.

Social view or social pressure??? Get the jab or get fired is a huge concern to many right now, fighting words you bet but many will be losing that fight. Few are in a position to fight the good fight most are not. Give me liberty or give me death (prosperity or poverty) has taken on a whole new meaning in the world we live in today...