For the Real Estate Drop in sales and price Naysayers HOLD ONTO YOUR HATS

[2FORCEFULL]

I've never in my life till now seen a group of so many people that worry what their home is worth.... get up, get a cup of coffee and check the comps...wtf... who care what it worth, you have a roof over your head and you are able to make the payments... just keep enjoying the life style from all the tax free money you are getting...

of corse, everyone here knows about the tax free money for keeping your house......right???

 

[stillhustlin]

Story from 2007/08 my friend bought one of the early houses for Laughlin Ranch he relisted it immediately as the market had turned but he got in so early that he had a bunch of profit. He listed it in the low 400s which was equal to the selling price of the new homes and he cut the asking price 10K every month. He was finally advised to just accept the next lowball offer he got and to not even counter it. He did that and got $350K and the buyer bought it with 100% financing. Then last summer while i was shopping I went and looked at a listing in Laughlin Ranch and it was his old house and it was for sale for 400K I didn't buy it but we got a kick out seeing it and we checked all the zillow transactions on it over the years and it had changed hands for like 180K a few years later and at some point one of the owners spent a shit ton of money putting in a custom back yard pool entertainment area. So based off the improvements and 350K sale price that thing would still be underwater 14 years later and now prices are gonna go down a little so it might be 20 years before it would break even. I will bet you your co-worker will have wished he took the $150K under ask lowball before he is done.

A lot of markets don’t appreciate well at all. When you factor in property tax, repair/maintenance, and interest expense it’s hard to pencil just off appreciation. In my opionon it really is a cash flow game if your try to use real estate for investment purposes.

 

[FishSniper]

Not only Ford but Google, Twitter, Walmart, Target, Groupon, Apple, Amazon and many more. Most started with small amounts to not panic the markets but hinted and warned that more to come. Recent article within the last week with CEOs of public companies stated that 50% of the CEOs interviewed said they are considering laying off from small to sizeable amount of employees, and a large majority said they are stalling any new hires and expansions, once that starts it will snowball. It takes time for all this crap to catch up to the Feds raising the rates. Don't worry though, the deniers will tell you all is OK and to ignore anyone stating facts or market trends.

Do you have any hobbies ?

 

[Havasu Rehab]

Man this thread is depressing. I bought a Havasu house in February. I'm also in the process of buying a new boat. I'm gonna say fuck it and go use them both until my hat gets taken from me. See you guys on the lake.

 

[DC-88]

A lot of markets don’t appreciate well at all. When you factor in property tax, repair/maintenance, and interest expense it’s hard to pencil just off appreciation. In my opionon it really is a cash flow game if your try to use real estate for investment purposes.

Population increase or decrease from the area is key, as related to construction and maintenance costs vs semi liquid investment profit on rentals . Smh I just impulse bought a corner lot in Needles for 20k downtown with curb, gutter and sidewalk on 200' of it because that alone would cost almost as much as the lot cost me...... might've been a dumb move for sure . Location and increasing population/demand is key to appreciation. South Dakota lake front goes for less than it can be built for , just like lots of other places I won't mention ....

 

[rivermobster]

Has the world ended yet??

Ill keep checking this thread to see if it has.

Thanks for keeping me in the know!

 

[c_land]

If bad shit happens (like War), inventory will tighten so much there won't be anything to buy regardless of rates or RE values. There are so many contributing factors to this that we can't point to a single leading indicator to predict what the RE market will do. Loss and gains only seem to happen in short bursts, so anyone long on RE will be fine.

As Angie mentioned, we had a casual conversation with an RE agent in Northern Idaho last week. She specializes in lakefront and pointed out several examples of homes she sold in the previous couple of years, including one she took the time to show us last year. All of them went to the STR market. None had been purchased as a primary residence or a vacation home without STR.

We got on the topic of current inventory and pricing, and she said most sellers are holding on to high listing prices, but nothing is moving. I posed a question about a theory I have, and I could see the look on her face raised the possibility I might be correct. She said she would look into it and had not considered my question before that moment.

I'll ask the great and powerful RDP the same series of questions:
If we agree home prices in some markets have doubled since 2019, why would a seller not price $100K below market value and take the winnings and run? In many cases, sellers would still net a return well in the six-figure range for an investment with only a couple of years of risk. For most, this could be the best investment of their lives. She responded that sellers still think they can command high prices.

My follow-up questions: Did your STR sellers that have only owned the homes since 2019 refinance the homes and pull out equity? [Change in the look on her face]
How much equity do the sellers have today compared to what we perceive?
How many STRs do your sellers own?
How are the STR's funding improvements, furnishings, and marketing?
What happens when people stop booking STR vacations, can the owners cashflow them?

I think our 2008 moment is the STR market. I've only a hunch and little supporting evidence. You decide if it's worth a look. I believe that the agent thought it was worth a look. If I am right, she said, I may yet get my lakefront property at a reasonable price. Just gotta wait and see.

Maybe municipalities won't enact unfavorable regulations against STRs
Maybe people will still love VRBO and AirBNB
Maybe the neighbors won't get upset when people are partying next door every night of the week.
Maybe cleaning costs won't continue to rise
Maybe maintenance costs won't continue to climb
Maybe STR owners will still be able to manage them when they can't WFH
Maybe STR owners will still be able to operate without permits and pay taxes in some cases
Maybe it will continue to be too good to be true?

While not enough to take down the entire RE market, it could make a dent. Interested in others' thoughts.

I hear you on this. I think the financialization of real estate has introduced the potential to have houses trade with volatility of other financial assets.

It seems like information flow, speculation, liquidity, policy, and credit availability will make RE prices move faster than we have been conditioned to expect.

Silicon Valley and Wall Street being involved makes it even more plausible to me. Airbnb, VRBO, Zillow, Redfin, opendoor, offerpad, invitation homes, ribbon, wework, to a lesser extent blackrock, as well as massive monetary and fiscal stimulus, didn’t exist in any previous cycle.

This was the CEO of Redfin today.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1561822155356065792

 

[Orange Juice]

Almost 40% of all residential homes are completely paid off. ( 5% increase for a decade ago).

That leaves 60% of homeowners with payments. Most of that 60% have loans with interest rates under 3%. They also have a loan value below 80% of the homes value (No PMI).

Like everything else, during inflation, costs go up, sizes (sqft) goes down.

Any location with jobs (big cities), Housing will continue to cost more.
2023, I expect single family homes to continue to cost more in nice areas. (Location, location, Location.)
.

 

[2FORCEFULL]

Man this thread is depressing. I bought a Havasu house in February. I'm also in the process of buying a new boat. I'm gonna say fuck it and go use them both until my hat gets taken from me. See you guys on the lake.

thats what you are supposed to do,.. and be happy knowing that you are able... I don't care what I buy,.. someone says I paid too much... and everybody got the same for less.... but it's always my friends brother inlaws sisters husband..... if I buy a house, I quit looking and do a differant hobbie.... sure as shit I find one better and cheeper....lol

 

[2FORCEFULL]

A lot of markets don’t appreciate well at all. When you factor in property tax, repair/maintenance, and interest expense it’s hard to pencil just off appreciation. In my opionon it really is a cash flow game if your try to use real estate for investment purposes.

thats because people borrow money to put it to work, the way It works is you "HAVE" the money sitting getting ate up by inflation that you have to do something with that makes the most return with the least amount of risk... getting a loan on investment property is like eating soup with a fork... you stay busy as fuc but don't get much done....

best way for a working man to make more tax free money is to get their home paid off...... after that the tax free money piles up to where you have to do something with it...

 

[2FORCEFULL]

a kid (30 yr old) said to me, I just found out that I have 200k equity in my home... I said why, are you moving???? he said no,... I needed to know what it was worth...what should I do????? I said first off... don't worry about what it's worth till you have it paid for and deed in your hand... for now,... just keep enjoying the tax free money each month, and enjoy the higher salary life style..... of course I had to explain the free money too him.... he's not an investment money managing expert... he's not a member here...

 

[PaPaG]

Do you have any hobbies ?

I consider my hobbies cars, also years of investing and trading in the stock market and real estate, go boating, seadoing, and hanging out on the patio deck watching the river flowing and eating great bbq...Oh, and to irritate liberal cry babies.... What about you?

 

[PaPaG]

Has the world ended yet??

Ill keep checking this thread to see if it has.

Thanks for keeping me in the know!

World is not going to end during our times walking it (I hope lol) but making and losing money in the housing market, property values and the stock market will go up and down that is for sure.

 

[steamin rice]

of corse, everyone here knows about the tax free money for keeping your house......right???

OK I'll bite. Tell us about the tax free money. I assume you are referring to the tax free capital gains on a primary residence, but you usually have another perspective on things and I would like to hear it.

I am just riding this out. I've been in my current home since 2006 with no intention of selling in the foreseeable future. Even with a market pullback, I am in a good place in terms of equity and I refinanced into a 2.75% fixed a couple of years ago.

 

[bentprops]

Lots of people saying, "This time its different." Your right it is. What took 2 years forn 2005 to 2007, took place in 2 months this time.

 

[bentprops]

Population increase or decrease from the area is key, as related to construction and maintenance costs vs semi liquid investment profit on rentals . Smh I just impulse bought a corner lot in Needles for 20k downtown with curb, gutter and sidewalk on 200' of it because that alone would cost almost as much as the lot cost me...... might've been a dumb move for sure . Location and increasing population/demand is key to appreciation. South Dakota lake front goes for less than it can be built for , just like lots of other places I won't mention ....

So much for a population increase

40% more deaths accross the board

 

[badgas]

Lots of people saying, "This time its different." Your right it is. What took 2 years forn 2005 to 2007, took place in 2 months this time.

So you are saying that the loan structure under this real estate market in now the same as 2005-2007 ?

All the bad subprime loans and millions of unqualified buyers getting multiple homes ?

I have a client who just got a refi on 30 year at 4.75% for $125,000 800+ fico ,has $2.5 million in paid off real estate, a pension and is still working. He had to document income with 3 years W2's for a $650 payment

This did NOT exhist last time, That is what i'm syaing is different.

 

[badgas]

I consider my hobbies cars, also years of investing and trading in the stock market and real estate, go boating, seadoing, and hanging out on the patio deck watching the river flowing and eating great bbq...Oh, and to irritate liberal cry babies.... What about you?

Hard to argue with this : )

 

[Havasu blue label]

He went to the wrong broker

 

[Havasu blue label]

Did you suggest a 10 year loan with a 3.75

 

[badgas]

Did you suggest a 10 year loan with a 3.75

I'm not a lender

I told him not to take loan at all : )

 

[rivermobster]

World is not going to end during our times walking it (I hope lol) but making and losing money in the housing market, property values and the stock market will go up and down that is for sure.

See, here is the thing...

You cannot loose money in any of those things you just mentioned, unless you SELL THEM for less than you actually paid for them!

On paper, I've made hundreds of thousands of dollars in RE. But did I actually make it?? Nope.

Was I able to use that money? Nope.

Do I care or worry about such things? Nope.

I would have to sell something, to get the money out of it. Yes??

I ain't selling shit!!! Except for my totaled jetta. I'd like to get a couple of bucks outa that.

 

[Havasu blue label]

Your correct it’s fake money that’s what I call it . Just got back from Vegas put your paper that’s has all that equity on it they will laugh off the table . Re is great but no money till it sells

 

[Havasu blue label]

Unless it’s paid off you get a income off it

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

See, here is the thing...

You cannot loose money in any of those things you just mentioned, unless you SELL THEM for less than you actually paid for them!

On paper, I've made hundreds of thousands of dollars in RE. But did I actually make it?? Nope.

Was I able to use that money? Nope.

Do I care or worry about such things? Nope.

I would have to sell something, to get the money out of it. Yes??

I ain't selling shit!!! Except for my totaled jetta. I'd like to get a couple of bucks outa that.

The trolls want to have it both ways. They want to tell you that you are losing money by holding RE you have already made money on, while they tell you they are making money by not buying and doing nothing

 

[Havasu blue label]

You will always make money on re but it’s on paper not at the atm unless you have a equity line

 

[Englewood]

Just another refresher for the guys in the back...WHAT YOU LIST YOUR HOUSE FOR DOESN'T MEAN SHIT!

I can list my house for $10m, then lower it to 1m, that doesn't mean I took a 90% hit. That means I was higher than giraffe pussy when I listed it.

It doesn't matter what your mailman's neighbors, ex boyfriend's dog sitter did. Price it at market and it will still sell. Facts.

That's all..As you were.

Man this thread is depressing. I bought a Havasu house in February. I'm also in the process of buying a new boat. I'm gonna say fuck it and go use them both until my hat gets taken from me. See you guys on the lake.

If you and your family are happy and can afford your lifestyle, good for you. Enjoy and even if the value drops, it's irrelevant until you sell. Congrats! Make memories and f*ck the noise.

 

[Englewood]

Im back...LOL

Just came across these infographics. I see a few trends...

1. We are still in the first inning.
2. 1/4 of the amount of loans "cashed out" as we saw in 08.
3. We are still not in a buyers market, by definition, although heading there quickly.
4. Qualification standards are massively different than they were in 08.

I am sticking by my opinion that we give COVID gains back at the most. Dems will miraculously have inflation under control soon for retention purposes.

 

[2FORCEFULL]

Just another refresher for the guys in the back...WHAT YOU LIST YOUR HOUSE FOR DOESN'T MEAN SHIT!

I can list my house for $10m, then lower it to 1m, that doesn't mean I took a 90% hit. That means I was higher than giraffe pussy when I listed it.

It doesn't matter what your mailman's neighbors, ex boyfriend's dog sitter did. Price it at market and it will still sell. Facts.

That's all..As you were.


If you and your family are happy and can afford your lifestyle, good for you. Enjoy and even if the value drops, it's irrelevant until you sell. Congrats! Make memories and f*ck the noise.

a giraffe pussy is less than 50% of the giraffe's head

 

[angiebaby]

Interesting. This chart from Freddie Mac shows a different story with more recent data. While the number of cash-out refis is still relatively low, the amount is what I would consider fairly high. Not catastrophic, but high. $80 billion was attributed to the final quarter of 2021. Not a huge surprise as everyone anticipated rate increases coming.

 

[c_land]

Almost 40% of all residential homes are completely paid off. ( 5% increase for a decade ago).

That leaves 60% of homeowners with payments. Most of that 60% have loans with interest rates under 3%. They also have a loan value below 80% of the homes value (No PMI).

Like everything else, during inflation, costs go up, sizes (sqft) goes down.

Any location with jobs (big cities), Housing will continue to cost more.
2023, I expect single family homes to continue to cost more in nice areas. (Location, location, Location.)
.

You mean like the Bay Area? Down 8% YOY.

Or Silicon Valley? I heard there are a lot of good employers and high paying jobs there. Down 7% YOY.

Everyone is trying to fight the last war in this thread. There is some serious 2008 PTSD around here.

The systemic risk of bad mortgages doesn't exist in the banking system now. Existing mortgages are affordable for most right now. The best thing about a potential downturn in RE this cycle is that families that bought should be able to stay in their homes.

The worst is that this is likely to impact the economy overall. RE/Housing is still ~15% of GDP. No refis to buy a new car or put in that pool, new home builds slowing that employee trade workers, lower volume of transactions for agents, etc.

New home sales data is out today and shows how much the new home market is slowing. Well below pre-pandemic sales volume, inventory under construction highest since 2006. Those units under construction are going to hit the market at some point, and with demand coming down builders will want to offload. We are already at 10+ months of inventory and very little of those under construction have been completed.

https://calculatedrisk.substack.com...cord-02a?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

 

[Havasu blue label]

Only watching havasu on my end

 

[MSum661]

August 23, 2022

US July New Home Sales -12.6% To 511K; Consensus was at 574K

Seasonally adjusted estimate of new houses for sale at the end of July is now at 464,000.
This represents a supply of nearly "11 months" at current sales rate.

https://www.census.gov/construction/nrs/pdf/newressales.pdf

There are plenty of new homes for sale

 

[2FORCEFULL]

You mean like the Bay Area? Down 8% YOY.

Or Silicon Valley? I heard there are a lot of good employers and high paying jobs there. Down 7% YOY.

Everyone is trying to fight the last war in this thread. There is some serious 2008 PTSD around here.

The systemic risk of bad mortgages doesn't exist in the banking system now. Existing mortgages are affordable for most right now. The best thing about a potential downturn in RE this cycle is that families that bought should be able to stay in their homes.

The worst is that this is likely to impact the economy overall. RE/Housing is still ~15% of GDP. No refis to buy a new car or put in that pool, new home builds slowing that employee trade workers, lower volume of transactions for agents, etc.

New home sales data is out today and shows how much the new home market is slowing. Well below pre-pandemic sales volume, inventory under construction highest since 2006. Those units under construction are going to hit the market at some point, and with demand coming down builders will want to offload. We are already at 10+ months of inventory and very little of those under construction have been completed.

https://calculatedrisk.substack.com...cord-02a?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

wgaf about all this if you own a home,...

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Im back...LOL

Just came across these infographics. I see a few trends...

1. We are still in the first inning.
2. 1/4 of the amount of loans "cashed out" as we saw in 08.
3. We are still not in a buyers market, by definition, although heading there quickly.
4. Qualification standards are massively different than they were in 08.

I am sticking by my opinion that we give COVID gains back at the most. Dems will miraculously have inflation under control soon for retention purposes.

View attachment 1148587

View attachment 1148588
View attachment 1148589

So are these FACTS? Or do I need to go buy another HAT?

I found the perfect hat for the folks under the black clouds. They don’t even have to hold onto it.

 

[2FORCEFULL]

OK I'll bite. Tell us about the tax free money. I assume you are referring to the tax free capital gains on a primary residence, but you usually have another perspective on things and I would like to hear it.

I am just riding this out. I've been in my current home since 2006 with no intention of selling in the foreseeable future. Even with a market pullback, I am in a good place in terms of equity and I refinanced into a 2.75% fixed a couple of years ago.

so let me tell you,... I'll use you as 6an example here... nothing personal.... but lets say this.... lets say 1 or 2 years ago you bought a house,... after down you got a mortage for 400k, payable 30yrs @ 2.79% P&I $1641 per mo...you will pay 190,933 interest in 30 yrs and $590,923 after tax dollars for your home... now the house on your street like yours comes up for sale...750k....


so you work your 40 hrs and live off your pay check...you make ends meet with a little left. so the next day at work you tell your buddy about the house....he makes the exact same as you he buys the house....lets call him Joe,
so after joe gets his loan.... he still owes 600k... @ 4.7% payment is $3144 .joe will pay 531,972 in interest .and will pay $1,131,972 after tax dollars. for the home ..


.....so same house, same job, joes payment is 1,503. more than yours.... so to live the same life style as you... joe has to get a secound job where he will bring home the 1503. ... joe also will pay 341,039 after tax dollars more than you in interest...... and 541,049 more for the home...

so, by staying in your home you save almost or more than a 1/2 million tax paid dollars.... so goes the say',n a penny saved is a penny earned

 

[2FORCEFULL]

so here's the deal.... the price of homes doesn't matter if you have one...never sell your home with out aa good reason, like job forces move. never take money out of home eq.... get it paid off as soon as possible,... it;s called financial freedome... don't check your credit score.... watch your savings account balance grow ... you can buy any thing you want if you have the cash in the bank... don't borrow money to impress others.... don't pay juice.... buy what you can pay for

 

[Havasu blue label]

Mr force do you own anything in California

 

[c_land]

wgaf about all this if you own a home,...

I am a surveyor working for a civil engineering company, my income depends on it?

 

[mbrown2]

Interesting. This chart from Freddie Mac shows a different story with more recent data. While the number of cash-out refis is still relatively low, the amount is what I would consider fairly high. Not catastrophic, but high. $80 billion was attributed to the final quarter of 2021. Not a huge surprise as everyone anticipated rate increases coming.

View attachment 1148598

What I think is a crazy stat is last column change in $$ between 2007 and 2008....how did it drop so dramatically? I know banks were pulling back or closing untapped 2nd's and Heloc's cause valuation and equity was dropping but I think that number references the number of actual amount cashed out not sitting on the books unused or maybe that is included and when they closed or pulled it back it dropped it.

 

[Havasu blue label]

Make the banks books look good

 

[MSum661]

I hear you on this. I think the financialization of real estate has introduced the potential to have houses trade with volatility of other financial assets.

It seems like information flow, speculation, liquidity, policy, and credit availability will make RE prices move faster than we have been conditioned to expect.

Silicon Valley and Wall Street being involved makes it even more plausible to me. Airbnb, VRBO, Zillow, Redfin, opendoor, offerpad, invitation homes, ribbon, wework, to a lesser extent blackrock, as well as massive monetary and fiscal stimulus, didn’t exist in any previous cycle.

This was the CEO of Redfin today.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1561822155356065792

You mean Houses could be trading like those meme stocks??? lmao. That's a pretty good analogy!

Well whatever the case you definetely bring up some great points and there is no denying the "percent" change in velocity of this pullback is unprecedented.
I think we'll all learn the "real" reason(s) why by year end 2022....but I believe I already have fairly good hunch what is.

 

[PaPaG]

See, here is the thing...

You cannot loose money in any of those things you just mentioned, unless you SELL THEM for less than you actually paid for them!

On paper, I've made hundreds of thousands of dollars in RE. But did I actually make it?? Nope.

Was I able to use that money? Nope.

Do I care or worry about such things? Nope.

I would have to sell something, to get the money out of it. Yes??

I ain't selling shit!!! Except for my totaled jetta. I'd like to get a couple of bucks outa that.

I totally disagree, I am buying and selling stocks almost every single day sometimes multiple times a day so you can lose or gain money in one of the things I mentioned. Also you not selling shit is good for you (except jetta lol) as for others many are investors, many watch the market daily and make a great amount of additional income by doing what they do. As I have said to some of the folks that don't like what is posted, everyone has an opinion just like an asshole you don't have to like it or agree with it, they can just wipe and move on lol. Well except for the Know It Alls that respond with their expert opinion on every single post in every thread (not referring too you just saying). OH and for anyone that does not think BILLIONS are being made or lost daily just take a look at Blackrock or Vanguard investments, they own roughly 25% or more of the rental market in almost every major city and actually have some sway and control housing and rental rates across the US...

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

You mean Houses could be trading like those meme stocks??? lmao. That's a pretty good analogy!

Well whatever the case you definetely bring up some great points and there is no denying the "percent" change in velocity of this pullback is unprecedented.
I think we'll all learn the "real" reason(s) why by year end 2022....but I believe I already have fairly good hunch what is.



View attachment 1148650

That is an interesting chart. I didn't realize that supply was that low in 2012-2013.

 

[MSum661]

That is an interesting chart. I didn't realize that supply was that low in 2012-2013.

That is interesting. Its possible that after the meltdown buyers started scooping up homes in 2012-2013. When prices dropped back then there was a lot of misery for anyone caught up in the run up going into 2007. I remember looking at homes for sale that were shockingly low during that time so maybe it explains the chart movement for that period of the cycle as buyers started stepping back in.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

That is interesting. Its possible that after the meltdown buyers started scooping up homes in 2012-2013. When prices dropped back then there was a lot of misery for anyone caught up in the run up going into 2007. I remember looking at homes for sale that were shockingly low during that time so maybe it explains the chart movement for that period of the cycle as buyers started stepping back in.

Yes I could see that. Is supply calculated off a standard number based on fixed inputs, or is it calculated by number of buyers at a given time and projected?

2011-2013 was the window to buy in our lifetimes to date for sure. I had lost about 10-15% on my house bought in late 09 at that point. I didn’t care, I would have spent that “profit” in rent just to live for another couple years waiting for the bottom.

That is why the premise of these threads and the years of others like it hold little water. If it is your primary residence for the medium term or longer it is meaningless, and if you are in it right as an investment and making the return you want, it is also meaningless. In the long term rents and RE aren’t going down.

 

[MSum661]

Yes I could see that. Is supply calculated off a standard number based on fixed inputs, or is it calculated by number of buyers at a given time and projected?

2011-2013 was the window to buy in our lifetimes to date for sure. I had lost about 10-15% on my house bought in late 09 at that point. I didn’t care, I would have spent that “profit” in rent just to live for another couple years waiting for the bottom.

That is why the premise of these threads and the years of others like it hold little water. If it is your primary residence for the medium term or longer it is meaningless, and if you are in it right as an investment and making the return you want, it is also meaningless. In the long term rents and RE aren’t going down.

Everyone has a different situation so comparing yourself to others is also meaningless. For example, I haven't bought a home since 2000 because I build my own homes. I live where I want, how I want, build a new home, enjoy my time there until I get bored of the area and then I do it again when I'm ready again...Because I can. But I listen to what your saying and posting and I dont give you any shit for how you go about things with property and instead I appreciate your good effort and game plan and Im happy to know your doing your best....kinda like myself! Can you get that?

Anyway, to answer your question, New and Existing Housing data is released monthly.

You can find the information and how the data is collected here: www.census.gov/construction/nrc/how_the_data_are_collected
Example, info collected on "Building Permits", "Sales" which are defined as a deposit taken or sales agreement signed, etc.
Then add by searches & updates on key economic indicators at FRED https://fred.stlouisfed.org which incorporates the U.S. Census Bureau, U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Developments 13 economic indicators.

 

[steamin rice]

so let me tell you,... I'll use you as 6an example here... nothing personal.... but lets say this.... lets say 1 or 2 years ago you bought a house,... after down you got a mortage for 400k, payable 30yrs @ 2.79% P&I $1641 per mo...you will pay 190,933 interest in 30 yrs and $590,923 after tax dollars for your home... now the house on your street like yours comes up for sale...750k....


so you work your 40 hrs and live off your pay check...you make ends meet with a little left. so the next day at work you tell your buddy about the house....he makes the exact same as you he buys the house....lets call him Joe,
so after joe gets his loan.... he still owes 600k... @ 4.7% payment is $3144 .joe will pay 531,972 in interest .and will pay $1,131,972 after tax dollars. for the home ..


.....so same house, same job, joes payment is 1,503. more than yours.... so to live the same life style as you... joe has to get a secound job where he will bring home the 1503. ... joe also will pay 341,039 after tax dollars more than you in interest...... and 541,049 more for the home...

so, by staying in your home you save almost or more than a 1/2 million tax paid dollars.... so goes the say',n a penny saved is a penny earned

Good stuff - In your numbers, you are assuming that Joe didn't also buy a house a few years ago with a $400k mortgage that has gone up in value that he sold to be in my neighborhood, right?

I was thinking that you would comment about how a mortgage is payed back by inflated dollars over the years, which is a plus in my book.

I don't disagree with any of your comments - Paying down debt is a good thing as well as saving. I've been in my house for more than 15 years and have no plans to sell. I try to find a balance of saving and having a good lifestyle, but I sure could have some more fun if I wasn't worried about saving so much.

 

[rivermobster]

I totally disagree, I am buying and selling stocks almost every single day sometimes multiple times a day

I'm sorry, could you say that again so the people in the back of the classroom can hear you???

And maybe say it slowly this time...

Especially the part where you disagree, with what I posted in bold.

 

[pronstar]

It’ll be different this time, mostly because I no longer own property in CA where renters turned into squatters with free lawyers while I had no recourse beyond $300/hour attorney fees

FML