Whats really behind AZ teacher strike

[Hullbilly]

What other job are they gonna get with a liberal arts degree in underwater basket weaving?

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The modern leo....

 

[squeezer]

We are a Country of equal opportunity, not a country of equal results. snip'

Come on 530... You are way too smart to believe this is true.

There are good schools and bad schools in every district. Funny how the good schools always seem to be in the more affluent neighborhoods. Must be random, nothing else explains it.

 

[ArizonaKevin]

Come on 530... You are way too smart to believe this is true.

There are good schools and bad schools in every district. Funny how the good schools always seem to be in the more affluent neighborhoods. Must be random, nothing else explains it.

I believe 530's point is to give kids in low income areas a chance to go to the better school in the higher income area. Instead of locking in a kid at a shitty school, give them the power to go to whatever school best fits their needs.

 

[squeezer]

I believe 530's point is to give kids in low income areas a chance to go to the better school in the higher income area. Instead of locking in a kid at a shitty school, give them the power to go to whatever school best fits their needs.

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...



And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

 

[boatdoc55]

How about getting rid of about half of the administration in every district in the Country and then the GOOD teachers can get their raise they deserve and nothing to high priced baby sitters just looking to collect a paycheck and pensions.

 

[530RL]

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...



And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

Because that is impossible and by trying to do so, you simply end up with dragging everyone down where the disinterested in education monopolize the resources of those whom are interested.

It is like making all products within a class homogeneous and equal in results, or trying to assure no shitty restaurants, or no shitty people, or every NCAA school wins the tournament. It is impossible as regardless of what economic, political or social system one embraces, there will always be winners and losers. There will always be a bell curve by nature. The goal from my standpoint is to make sure everyone has a shot at getting to the place on the bell curve they choose to get to either by raw talent, effort or a combination of both. Otherwise one is stuck with the lowest common denominator in their geographic area, hence the difference between parental participation and higher results in wealthier geographic areas where there is more interest in educational outcomes.

As long as kids are hamstrung by geographic barriers, they will be limited by the average level of parental interest in education in that geographic area.

 

[ArizonaKevin]

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...



And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

Long term, a school voucher system will force all schools to be better. The bad schools have to up their game in order to retain more kids and more funding.

Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.

 

[squeezer]

Because that is impossible and by trying to do so, you simply end up with dragging everyone down where the disinterested in education monopolize the resources of those whom are interested.

It is like making all products within a class homogeneous and equal in results, or trying to assure no shitty restaurants, or no shitty people, or every NCAA school wins the tournament. It is impossible as regardless of what economic, political or social system one embraces, there will always be winners and losers. There will always be a bell curve by nature. The goal from my standpoint is to make sure everyone has a shot at getting to the place on the bell curve they choose to get to either by raw talent, effort or a combination of both. Otherwise one is stuck with the lowest common denominator in their geographic area, hence the difference between parental participation and higher results in wealthier geographic areas where there is more interest in educational outcomes.

As long as kids are hamstrung by geographic barriers, they will be limited by the average level of parental interest in education in that geographic area.

Really... ???? It wasn't impossible 40 years ago.

And you somehow think that available means equal and easy... It does not. Schools with an industrial arts shop turned out students who could use a tape measure and run a saw without cutting fingers off (Most of the time...) More importantly it gave everybody a tiny glimpse into areas and activities that were not normally accessible.

How many well equipped wood shops would the F35 program have paid for?

 

[ArizonaKevin]

Really... ???? It wasn't impossible 40 years ago.

And you somehow think that available means equal and easy... It does not. Schools with an industrial arts shop turned out students who could use a tape measure and run a saw without cutting fingers off (Most of the time...) More importantly it gave everybody a tiny glimpse into areas and activities that were not normally accessible.

How many well equipped wood shops would the F35 program have paid for?

Going off of your point about shop classes, I went to one of the top rated High Schools in AZ and received a great education. However, had I been given the choice with a voucher system, I would have gone to the school 3 miles in the other direction from my parents house that had an auto shop class.

 

[Uncle Dave]

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...

And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

Great idea.

I know how we can fund it as well.

We can stop giving people that have kids a tax break and make them pay a surcharge for each kid instead for the schooling they will receive!

This way people that decide they don't want to have kids for one reason or other, (like say they don't think they can afford it) don't have to pay for cost of others that do.


UD

 

[530RL]

Really... ???? It wasn't impossible 40 years ago.

And you somehow think that available means equal and easy... It does not. Schools with an industrial arts shop turned out students who could use a tape measure and run a saw without cutting fingers off (Most of the time...) More importantly it gave everybody a tiny glimpse into areas and activities that were not normally accessible.

How many well equipped wood shops would the F35 program have paid for?

As bad as it is, the overall educational outcomes are better today in America than they were 40 years ago when using objective measures. Higher literacy and graduation rates, higher levels of learning, higher proficiency in basic language, math and sciences.

Outcomes are better today than 40 years ago. The problem is that relative to many parts in the rest of the world we are falling behind and our standards should be measured to our competition no matter where it is, not just in America.

 

[Motor Boater]

Uuummmm. You guys do realize in AZ they have open enrollments and you can elect to send your kid to any school you want right? Half the kids at my boys school don’t live within the boundaries. I have friends that live across the street from a school but they enroll their kids at our school because they like it better.

 

[regor]

As bad as it is, the overall educational outcomes are better today in America than they were 40 years ago when using objective measures. Higher literacy and graduation rates, higher levels of learning, higher proficiency in basic language, math and sciences.

Outcomes are better today than 40 years ago. The problem is that relative to many parts in the rest of the world we are falling behind and our standards should be measured to our competition no matter where it is, not just in America.

Sixty-five percent of the eighth graders in American public schools in 2017 were not proficient in reading and 67 percent were not proficient in mathematics, according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress test results released by the U.S. Department of Education.

 

[530RL]

Uuummmm. You guys do realize in AZ they have open enrollments and you can elect to send your kid to any school you want right? Half the kids at my boys school don’t live within the boundaries. I have friends that live across the street from a school but they enroll their kids at our school because they like it better.

15-816.01 requires schools to allow students to apply for admission to any public school, based on available classroom space. However, a school district may give enrollment preference to, and reserve capacity for, pupils who are children of persons who are employed by or at a school in the school district.

Many of the highest ranking schools in Arizona have no space. Further, the best charter schools, although public and subject to open enrollment, have a shortage of seats and waiting lists also.

Yes, Arizona is doing a lot more to make choice available, but it is still a far cry from a voucher that would allow kids to go wherever they want and force schools to deliver a better product to get students, just as all of us have to do in our business every day.

 

[warlock250]

Well I get to pay twice a d then some to get my kids a good education. I still have to pay Az taxes and pay for the private School education not indoctrination. All of my Kids are kicking Ass. I pay the price for it but it is worth it.

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[squeezer]

Well I get to pay twice a d then some to get my kids a good education. I still have to pay Az taxes and pay for the private School education not indoctrination. All of my Kids are kicking Ass. I pay the price for it but it is worth it.

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OK I have a solution to that for you. Lets make any tuition you pay to an accredited institution a full on tax credit. We pay for it by dropping the tax exempt status of all religious organizations.

 

[spectra3279]

One of the biggest problems I see has been the lottery. Until then the education fund was kept in its own separate account. Once the lottery came in, the education fund was moved to the general fund so they could tap the lottery money.

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[was thatguy]

Because that is impossible and by trying to do so, you simply end up with dragging everyone down where the disinterested in education monopolize the resources of those whom are interested.

It is like making all products within a class homogeneous and equal in results, or trying to assure no shitty restaurants, or no shitty people, or every NCAA school wins the tournament. It is impossible as regardless of what economic, political or social system one embraces, there will always be winners and losers. There will always be a bell curve by nature. The goal from my standpoint is to make sure everyone has a shot at getting to the place on the bell curve they choose to get to either by raw talent, effort or a combination of both. Otherwise one is stuck with the lowest common denominator in their geographic area, hence the difference between parental participation and higher results in wealthier geographic areas where there is more interest in educational outcomes.

As long as kids are hamstrung by geographic barriers, they will be limited by the average level of parental interest in education in that geographic area.

I have to say that I agree with just about everything you've said on the school topic.
Not surprising given your charter school admin experience.

 

[was thatguy]

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...



And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

Well, some schools are just hoping for better metal detectors and a decline in gang activity.
In reality, your speaking of a socialist utopia again.

 

[squeezer]

Well, some schools are just hoping for better metal detectors and a decline in gang activity.
In reality, your speaking of a socialist utopia again.

No I'm not... I am talking about having good schools. Good schools take a stronger financial commitment than we are making now.

We have a massive defense budget that I don't hear you screaming is Socialism...

 

[regor]

Well, some schools are just hoping for better metal detectors and a decline in gang activity.
In reality, your speaking of a socialist utopia again.

Squeegee loves him some UTOOOOOOOPIA!!!!!!!!!!!!

In Venezuela, five years of severance pay now buys a coffee...........

 

[was thatguy]

No I'm not... I am talking about having good schools. Good schools take a stronger financial commitment than we are making now.

We have a massive defense budget that I don't hear you screaming is Socialism...

What I’m saying is that you may not have a grasp on the student body paradigm at some schools.
530 is right.

Some schools that are basically in a domestic war zone simply will not benifit by throwing money at it.

It’s very easy for a smaller % of students that have no interest in the benefits (beyond vandalizing and stealing more expensive stuff, and terrorizing students that do have an interest) of an education to disrupt the entire school.
Higher qualified teachers also want NO PART of a “war zone” school.

 

[530RL]

No I'm not... I am talking about having good schools. Good schools take a stronger financial commitment than we are making now.

We have a massive defense budget that I don't hear you screaming is Socialism...

I have no problem spending more on education and quite frankly moving it from defense to education. But I do have a problem with throwing money at, using the analogy, a bad restaurant.

Let's tape the money right to the back of the children and let the parents send them to the best option. No different than spending ones money on the best nutrition as opposed to forcing one to go to a bad restaturant. And if some parents don't care what their kids eat, we can't raise all of them for those parents.

 

[Sandlord]

I have no problem spending more on education and quite frankly moving it from defense to education. But I do have a problem with throwing money at, using the analogy, a bad restaurant.

Let's tape the money right to the back of the children and let the parents send them to the best option. No different than spending ones money on the best nutrition as opposed to forcing one to go to a bad restaturant. And if some parents don't care what their kids eat, we can't raise all of them for those parents.

problem is, the Governor wants to get the money somewhere else:
http://www.arizonatrailriders.org/governor-ducey-sweep-entire-ohv-sticker-fund/

 

[Hullbilly]

No I'm not... I am talking about having good schools. Good schools take a stronger financial commitment than we are making now.

We have a massive defense budget that I don't hear you screaming is Socialism...

How much more of your paycheck are you willing to hand over to provide for those that refuse to pull their own weight?

I frankly get sick if I actually review an E&L statement.

 

[Hullbilly]

I have no problem spending more on education and quite frankly moving it from defense to education. But I do have a problem with throwing money at, using the analogy, a bad restaurant.

Let's tape the money right to the back of the children and let the parents send them to the best option. No different than spending ones money on the best nutrition as opposed to forcing one to go to a bad restaturant. And if some parents don't care what their kids eat, we can't raise all of them for those parents.

Damn, you are on fire tonight! Lol I knew the old 530 was there somewhere!

Yore still a Flakekin!

 

[Hullbilly]

Really... ???? It wasn't impossible 40 years ago.

And you somehow think that available means equal and easy... It does not. Schools with an industrial arts shop turned out students who could use a tape measure and run a saw without cutting fingers off (Most of the time...) More importantly it gave everybody a tiny glimpse into areas and activities that were not normally accessible.

How many well equipped wood shops would the F35 program have paid for?

40 years ago this country was not near 50% of its residents on welfare, not flooded with fatherless or broken home children....Not over ran and bogged down by illiterate non english speaking cockroaches.

Wallow in the hog slop you and your ilk have created. Now that the by products are becoming uncover-up-able and unsustainable y’all still have not learned your lesson and think this can be fixed by throwing money at it....money earned by responsible tax payers.

 

[was thatguy]

Damn, you are on fire tonight! Lol I knew the old 530 was there somewhere!

Yore still a Flakekin!

I’ve learned so much from 530 and Racey it isn’t even funny.
It’s really only been since Pre- primary that he got ugly.
(And just to get it out of the way, yes, I have ALWAYS been an asshole)

 

[Hullbilly]

I’ve learned so much from 530 and Racey it isn’t even funny.
It’s really only been since Pre- primary that he got ugly.
(And just to get it out of the way, yes, I have ALWAYS been an asshole)

He’s got some badass whips too!

 

[warlock250]

OK I have a solution to that for you. Lets make any tuition you pay to an accredited institution a full on tax credit. We pay for it by dropping the tax exempt status of all religious organizations.

They could allow me to deduct the amount I pay I Tax towards school. But that won't happen so I found a better way I just have people I know direct there tax money to my kids. Even better I guess. [emoji16]

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[Motor Boater]

Today we were told school will resume tomorrow. Then we started hearing rumors that wasn’t going to happen. Now we are receiving text messages from teachers to meet at rubios Baja grill for an update from the teachers because the “the legislature is backhanding us”. There is supposed to be a council meeting starting now as well they are pushing people to attend. What a shit show.

 

[Sandlord]

On Monday, Ducey and Republican state lawmakers unveiled their budget plan to give teachers a raise and increase school funding. He has declared they can do it with "no tax increase."

But the governor's budget does rely on revenue from a new, roughly $18 car-registration fee that all motorists will have to pay starting next year.

Ducey signed a bill, House Bill 2166, to create the fee last week. It is estimated to be $18.06 but could top $24 per vehicle; drivers would pay it when they renew their vehicle registration annually.

 

[Hullbilly]

So how many days of school can the kids miss before they have to repeat the grade?

We do it for the kidssssss

 

[Hullbilly]

On Monday, Ducey and Republican state lawmakers unveiled their budget plan to give teachers a raise and increase school funding. He has declared they can do it with "no tax increase."

But the governor's budget does rely on revenue from a new, roughly $18 car-registration fee that all motorists will have to pay starting next year.

Ducey signed a bill, House Bill 2166, to create the fee last week. It is estimated to be $18.06 but could top $24 per vehicle; drivers would pay it when they renew their vehicle registration annually.

lol no tax increase! fucking idiots, unbelievable....hows about kicking illegals and their kids off welfare programs? That should more than fund a raise and buy bog screens for every classroom in New California

 

[regor]

Not AZ, but this is what teacher's should be addressing..................the scum within!

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2018/05/second_teachers_union_president_target_of_new_vide.html

 

[Hullbilly]

You expect the pussies to bite the hand that feeds them? Its easier to walk out

 

[regor]

You expect the pussies to bite the hand that feeds them? Its easier to walk out

Nah, just badgering the blind.

 

[Bobby V]

Nah, just badgering the blind.

Happy National Teachers Day Roger. They deserve it.

Go Heralds..

 

[regor]

Happy National Teachers Day Roger. They deserve it.

Go Heralds..

 

[500bbc]

How about we just improve the shitty schools...???


Every school should be a good school.
Every school should have well paid competent teachers.
Every school should have clean well equipped class rooms
Every school should have:

Music
Band
Art
Home Ec
Sports teams
PE
Shop Class
etc etc...



And yes all our tax dollars should be pooled so all kids have the chance to join in these activities.

Fuck all that stupid fucking liberal garbage you filthy sperm burping bastard.

It's simple, like you,

Every Child should have great parents, it doesn't take a village of you fucking leftwing idiots.

 

[Stainless]

City of Ft Worth, TX has bought ad space on 5 or so billboards in Phoenix trying to lure AZ teachers to Ft Worth with higher wages and benefits.

 

[Bobby V]

City of Ft Worth, TX has bought ad space on 5 or so billboards in Phoenix trying to lure AZ teachers to Ft Worth with higher wages and benefits.

With TX and AZ being right to work for less states, how much more can they offer a AZ teacher.

 

[Stainless]

With TX and AZ being a right to work for less states, how much more can they offer a AZ teacher.

A little bit [emoji23]

 

[JBS]

With TX and AZ being right to work for less states, how much more can they offer a AZ teacher.

Billboard is offering 52,000 that is 10,000 more than my wife just accepted a position at.

 

[milkmoney]

Billboard is offering 52,000 that is 10,000 more than my wife just accepted a position at.

When u moving pops [emoji106] [emoji4] [emoji202]

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[JBS]

When u moving pops [emoji106] [emoji4] [emoji202]

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Not happening

 

[Stainless]

Billboard is offering 52,000 that is 10,000 more than my wife just accepted a position at.

Seeing on the news this is flaring up again, do you think those billboards have anything to do with it?
Btw, regardless of the pay my hats off to people that teach and I do wish AZ would move up from the bottom in pay.
Education is the best investment we can make into this country’s future!

 

[Old Texan]

Teachers can't teach anymore. They have to spend their days preparing kids to test. Sadly the tests don't educate them properly and we have the issues we face with the mess government intervention brings us.......

Standing outside looking in and having lived in several states, I see similar issues everywhere. Let the states take their systems back and allow school districts to control this from the grassroots level. The feds set ridiculous standards that harm more than help....