Water filter Vs Softner?

[sirbob]

So my wife has been asking me to install a water filter in the house so she can drink the water and use it for coffee etc. Of course her seeing me use it every day for making coffee and drinking it doesn't give her the comfort she wants in knowing its good enough - something about all the stuff thats in it that I don't even know about...

We do have very calcified water and I have considered installing a water softener - I don't know if she will feel that solves the problem or not but I thought would start to look into it.

Does anybody use Callagan or another regular service to get soft water for the house?

Any info on the good / bad?

How about cost of service?

 

[RiverDave]

So my wife has been asking me to install a water filter in the house so she can drink the water and use it for coffee etc. Of course her seeing me use it every day for making coffee and drinking it doesn't give her the comfort she wants in knowing its good enough - something about all the stuff thats in it that I don't even know about...

We do have very calcified water and I have considered installing a water softener - I don't know if she will feel that solves the problem or not but I thought would start to look into it.

Does anybody use Callagan or another regular service to get soft water for the house?

Any info on the good / bad?

How about cost of service?

For drinking water you definitely want to get a good RO system.. It will change your life if you don't have one. It's basically the best tasting bottled water you can get on demand.

If you have a high calcium content in your water supply than you will want to put a water softener in regardless. They are pretty low maintenance (you dump a bag of salt in once a month or so), but your washer / dish washer / toilet valves / etc.. will last three times as long. Your faucets will stop getting the white calcium build up around them. The only major difference (depending on how soft you make the water) is soap doesn't rinse off as easily in the shower, and some girls have described it as "slimy." Your skin will be softer though after a week etc.. We didn't have one for the first four years living in Havasu, now I can't imagine my life without it.

RD

 

[scouter]

We are on a well, so we have a whole house filter, a water softener and RO.

I would not want to be without any of them......

 

[Headless hula]

A filter isn't going to remove calcium. It's dissolved in the water.

 

[Headless hula]

Get your water tested to see what size softener you need.
Softeners are sized by "grain" capacity I think.
Depending on how hard your water is, will determine the size or capacity of the equipment needed. Just like everything else in life, proper equipment size is key to a successful experience.

 

[2Driver]

RO

 

[Hullbilly]

We are on a well, so we have a whole house filter, a water softener and RO.

I would not want to be without any of them......

Well here too, we have a string filter, iron filter, softener, carbon filter and a RO setup for the fridge and kitchen sink. The guy we bought the house from owned a plumbing/water company so he went to town on the house. Best water I've ever experienced.

 

[jeteater1]

On a well here too.
I have a whole house filter at my well with a paper filter.
Well pumps it up to a 1000 gallon holding tank then comes from there to a booster pump into a whole house filter with carbon filter .
I installed a Scale Blaster , with in 3 months it took all of the white calcium off my faucets .
The first 3 months i had to keep cleaning the aerators .
Oh and the frig. has a filter that would last 2 months now last 6.
I did not want to do the regular soft water thing cuzz of all the water it wastes .

 

[TCHB]

In Havasu we have a softner system and RO for drinking water. Works great!

 

[bk2drvr]

For drinking water you definitely want to get a good RO system.. It will change your life if you don't have one. It's basically the best tasting bottled water you can get on demand.

If you have a high calcium content in your water supply than you will want to put a water softener in regardless. They are pretty low maintenance (you dump a bag of salt in once a month or so), but your washer / dish washer / toilet valves / etc.. will last three times as long. Your faucets will stop getting the white calcium build up around them. The only major difference (depending on how soft you make the water) is soap doesn't rinse off as easily in the shower, and some girls have described it as "slimy." Your skin will be softer though after a week etc.. We didn't have one for the first four years living in Havasu, now I can't imagine my life without it.

RD

I have a water softener and I'm going to be installing an RO system in my place at the river soon. Does your RO line attach before or after the water softener? I've heard conflicting info on this. I believe most people are attaching after the softener from what I've heard.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

I just put in a 5 stage RO system a few months ago at home and in Havasu. It is just an undersink unit and it was $200. The water went from ~450 PPM to under 30 PPM. This is in South OC.

In Havasu my water went from 750 PPM with slight discoloration, to under 50 PPM and clear.

Under 50 PPM is supposedly "pure" drinking grade water.

The water and ice we get in Havasu from the water and ice places around town is 0 PPM.

I got it from Apec water, it is their ROES 50 system. If you call Apec Water and order direct you can get the faucet it comes with in any finish for no charge if you don't want a chrome faucet.

 

[Flying_Lavey]

I'd go with RO. It removes between 90 to 99% of all minerals and contaminates from the water. Including calcium. I'd also use one of those electronic descalers as well as it will help remove scale and mineral deposits already built up in the system as well as keeping them from building up.

 

[UHHH SUCKA]

For drinking water you definitely want to get a good RO system.. It will change your life if you don't have one. It's basically the best tasting bottled water you can get on demand.

If you have a high calcium content in your water supply than you will want to put a water softener in regardless. They are pretty low maintenance (you dump a bag of salt in once a month or so), but your washer / dish washer / toilet valves / etc.. will last three times as long. Your faucets will stop getting the white calcium build up around them. The only major difference (depending on how soft you make the water) is soap doesn't rinse off as easily in the shower, and some girls have described it as "slimy." Your skin will be softer though after a week etc.. We didn't have one for the first four years living in Havasu, now I can't imagine my life without it.

RD

This is exactly what I did after about 6 years of dealing with calcium build up around the faucets and a few water leaks. Bath tub pretty much cleans itself now and your skin will feel much softer. Picked up a nice system that was a little bigger than what I need for my house from Sears for about $500 and installed it myself.

 

[SoCalDave]

First off the electronic gadgets are just that, gadgets. They will appear to work at first but they are not a magical cure for removing water hardness.

Like most other here I installed a whole house system consisting of:
1. Whole house filter system consisting of sediment/rust pre-filter and then a taste/odor carbon filter.
2. Water softener purchased from Lowes.
3. RO system for drinking water and fridge purchased from Lowes.

Installed everything myself and the water quality is like night and day.

 

[Deja_Vu]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the moment.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

 

[Flying_Lavey]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the moment.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

I like the salt free water softener.

 

[jeteater1]

First off the electronic gadgets are just that, gadgets. They will appear to work at first but they are not a magical cure for removing water hardness.

Like most other here I installed a whole house system consisting of:
1. Whole house filter system consisting of sediment/rust pre-filter and then a taste/odor carbon filter.
2. Water softener purchased from Lowes.
3. RO system for drinking water and fridge purchased from Lowes.

Installed everything myself and the water quality is like night and day.

Say what you will about gadgets, Been working for 5 years for me.
I just couldn't have 4 gallons for every one dumping in my septic tank.

 

[sirbob]

Thanks everybody for the comments - great info!

It doesn't sounds like anybody uses a service company to do the water softener?

I kind thought that the Callahan man was the only route on that set up? Does that even exist any more?

Never having looked into it before I had no idea you could DYI on that sort of thing.

This may sound dumb but how do you know when your filter needs changing (or is it salt?that needs adding?)

 

[buck35]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the momin a home depot unit nnt.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

How do the salt free units work to grab and the and flush out the unwanteds? Got a home demo back in the 80s and seemed too good to be true? New house I put in a home depot unit on everything but a pot filler over the stove. My wife and I agree that soft water is lousy for coffee and cooking

 

[RiverDave]

I have a water softener and I'm going to be installing an RO system in my place at the river soon. Does your RO line attach before or after the water softener? I've heard conflicting info on this. I believe most people are attaching after the softener from what I've heard.

Mine is before.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Thanks everybody for the comments - great info!

It doesn't sounds like anybody uses a service company to do the water softener?

I kind thought that the Callahan man was the only route on that set up? Does that even exist any more?

Never having looked into it before I had no idea you could DYI on hat sort of thing.

This may sound dumb but how do you know when your filter needs changing (or is it salt?that needs adding?)

With a softener, you go buy more salt pellets when the brine tank is empty. That is it. Keep in mind a softener is not a filter.

With the RO filter system I would just buy a tester like this and when the PPM starts to go up, change your filters. They say stage 1,2 and 3 are good for 6-12 months and stage 4-5 are good for around 2 years.

If you do a whole house filter system, I would just test the water monthly until you see a difference to maximize filter life.

Here is the tester:
HM Digital TDS-EZ Water Quality TDS Tester, 0-9990 ppm Measurement Range , 1 ppm Resolution, +/- 3% Readout Accuracy https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002C0A7ZY/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_fwEuyb0KC4SAC

 

[Tinkerer]

I bought a commercial ice machine filter that feeds the fridge water dispenser. I have that feed by the hard water line. I have a 5 micron filter in front of my water softener.
Friends rave about my water. I am on a well.

 

[72Hondo]

Hmmm, I'm looking for more calcium and magnesium in my water. My water is too soft to begin with.

Buy a cheap tester of GH & KH to see where you are at.

 

[rvrrun]

With a softener, you go buy more salt pellets when the brine tank is empty. That is it. Keep in mind a softener is not a filter.

With the RO filter system I would just buy a tester like this and when the PPM starts to go up, change your filters. They say stage 1,2 and 3 are good for 6-12 months and stage 4-5 are good for around 2 years.

If you do a whole house filter system, I would just test the water monthly until you see a difference to maximize filter life.

Here is the tester:
HM Digital TDS-EZ Water Quality TDS Tester, 0-9990 ppm Measurement Range , 1 ppm Resolution, +/- 3% Readout Accuracy https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002C0A7ZY/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_fwEuyb0KC4SAC

For $16, that seems like a no brainier to keep from wasting money on filters prematurely.

We started off with RO, I read that the only benefit of it over a non-RO filter system (pretty much identical except for the tank and waste water), was that RO removes arsenic. This is a problem with ground water, but we are on municipal. I don't know if that is true, but I'm throwing it out there. That being said, we switched back again to RO because my wife says she can taste the difference. I, presumably, have a far less refined palette.

 

[Classic Daycruiser]

This just out today.

EPA Concludes Fracking a Threat to U.S. Water Supplies

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ep...ater-supplies/ar-AAlzhRo?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=iehp

Pick your own source to verify.

 

[Rivermama]

For drinking water you definitely want to get a good RO system.. It will change your life if you don't have one. It's basically the best tasting bottled water you can get on demand.

If you have a high calcium content in your water supply than you will want to put a water softener in regardless. They are pretty low maintenance (you dump a bag of salt in once a month or so), but your washer / dish washer / toilet valves / etc.. will last three times as long. Your faucets will stop getting the white calcium build up around them. The only major difference (depending on how soft you make the water) is soap doesn't rinse off as easily in the shower, and some girls have described it as "slimy." Your skin will be softer though after a week etc.. We didn't have one for the first four years living in Havasu, now I can't imagine my life without it.

RD

HELLO,MY NAME IS RICHARD I OWN ADVANCED WATER SOLUTIONS IN CA.
ACCORDING TO THE WATER QUALITY ASSOCIATION THERE IS THREE TYPES OF WATER: UTILITY GRADE, WORKING GRADE, AND FOOD GRADE.
UTILITY GRADE IS WHAT COMES FROM THE STREET.

WORKING GRADE IS WHAT YOU GET FROM A SOFTENER. IT TAKES OUT MAGNESIUM,CALCIUM, SULFUR, AND IRON. IT IS GOOD FOR THE WHOLE HOUSE.

R/O WILL GIVE YOU FOOD GRADE WATER.

THE R/O SHOULD BE INSTALLED AFTER THE SOFTENER.

 

[RiverDave]

Richard, being that a soft water system does add a bit of salt to the water in the process. Why would you want RO after the softener instead of before?

 

[Rivermama]

Richard, being that a soft water system does add a bit of salt to the water in the process. Why would you want RO after the softener instead of before?

Hi Dave,

It's a common misconception that salt is added to the water. Just as dishwasher detergent is added to a dishwasher to clean the dishes, then rinsed away, sodium chloride is added to the softener to clean the resin beads within the system that filter the water. The system goes into bypass mode so that the sodium chloride cleans the resin bed, then is rinsed and that water is flushed down the drain. None of that water enters the house. You don't need food grade water throughout the house, that's why the RO is after the softener.

 

[troostr]

RO is definitely the cats ass! My house and shop are tied to the 150gpm unit that takes care of my dairy, and it is amazing the difference! From my wife and daughter's conditioner use, dishwasher, clothes, to washing vehicles! Washing cars is awesome! Wash it, wait until it's almost all air dried and wipe off a few drops here and there. My dads house is to far to plumb into it, so we got him a whole house unit for his house and shop that does about 500 gpd. It's a 6 stage RO, basically a mini version of what's on the dairy, but fills a big pressure tank like domestic well would, cycles as called for.
My dairy system has a built in monitor, and is typically at 25tds, with a 7.0-7.2 ph and almost zero conductivity.

 

[RiverDave]

Hi Dave,

It's a common misconception that salt is added to the water. Just as dishwasher detergent is added to a dishwasher to clean the dishes, then rinsed away, sodium chloride is added to the softener to clean the resin beads within the system that filter the water. The system goes into bypass mode so that the sodium chloride cleans the resin bed, then is rinsed and that water is flushed down the drain. None of that water enters the house. You don't need food grade water throughout the house, that's why the RO is after the softener.

Lol. oh! we got a miscommunication going on. I have a little RO system that just feeds my fridge and a small faucet on the kitchen sink. Are you saying the supply line TO that RO system should be after the softener? or it should be before? Understanding that the RO system itself is not a big one that is supplying the whole house.

 

[Rivermama]

You only need the R/O system in the kitchen for food grade water. At the beginning of the thread it was asked I'd the R/O should be before or after the softener. You don't need R/O water through out the house. Sorry for the confusion

 

[sirbob]

So if a guy was going to go to Lowes to get an RO system to mount under the kitchen sink for a Christmas present for the wife that wants it...

What brand should I look at at and what will it cost - assuming I'm not looking for the cheapest one but something that's good quality and will last.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Freedrinkingwater.com. -Apec water.

Apec water is in City of Industry. You'll have it next day.

http://www.freedrinkingwater.com/roes-50.htm

Check reviews on Amazon. Ask them for the faucet color that matches your sink. They also have a fridge line hook up kit if you want to run the filtered water to your fridge.

 

[bk2drvr]

You only need the R/O system in the kitchen for food grade water. At the beginning of the thread it was asked I'd the R/O should be before or after the softener. You don't need R/O water through out the house. Sorry for the confusion.

I don't think Dave was asking if RO water should be throughout the whole house. It sounds like Daves RO system is fed by the hard water supply side prior to his softener.

My understanding is the membrane filter (the most expensive one of the 4/5 filters) will last longer if supplied with soft water. True?

 

[sirbob]

X

 

[Ziggy]

So if a guy was going to go to Lowes to get an RO system to mount under the kitchen sink for a Christmas present for the wife that wants it...

What brand should I look at at and what will it cost - assuming I'm not looking for the cheapest one but something that's good quality and will last.

Just ask one of the guys there, they'll steer you to the right one for your needs. Its not an overly difficult task either.
.
I bought my RO system and water softener from Lowes.

 

[Ziggy]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the moment.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

I looked at the Nuvo system long and hard before going with tried and trued salt softener. Nuvo uses a citrus base to soften the water..couldn't get myself to buy in 100% on the system/process.
Nuvo

 

[Tinkerer]

One thing to remember is that RO water needs to go through plastic piping. RO water will pull the copper out of copper pipe that is usually run to the fridge.

 

[Rivermama]

You only need the R/O system in the kitchen for food grade water. At the beginning of the thread it was asked I'd the R/O should be before or after the softener. You don't need R/O water through out the house. Sorry for the confusion.

I don't think Dave was asking if RO water should be throughout the whole house. It sounds like Daves RO system is fed by the hard water supply side prior to his softener.

My understanding is the membrane filter (the most expensive one of the 4/5 filters) will last longer if supplied with soft water. True?

YES YOU ARE CORRECT. BUT THE WHOLE HOUSE SHOULD BE CONNECTED TO THE SOFTNER PRIOR TO THE R/O.

 

[Rivermama]

Richard, being that a soft water system does add a bit of salt to the water in the process. Why would you want RO after the softener instead of before?

ACCORDING TO THE WATER QUALITY ASSOCIATION THEIR IS MORE SALT IN A SLICE OF BREAD THAN A GALLON OF SOFTENER WATER. LIKE I SAID BEFORE A SOFTENER GIVES YOU WORKING GRADE WATER. (FOR WASHING YOUR CLOTHES, YOUR DISHES AND SHOWERING) A R/O GIVES YOU FOOD GRADE WATER FOR DRINKING AND COOKING.(JUST LIKE BOTTLE WATER THAT YOU BUY AT THE STORE). THE SOFTENER SHOULD BE INSTALLED WHERE THE WATER FIRST COMES INTO THE HOUSE BEFORE THE WATER HEATER SO THAT IT SOFTENS ALL THE WATER COMING INTO THE HOUSE. THE R/O SHOULD BE INSTALLED IN THE KICHEN.

 

[Rivermama]

First off the electronic gadgets are just that, gadgets. They will appear to work at first but they are not a magical cure for removing water hardness.

Like most other here I installed a whole house system consisting of:
1. Whole house filter system consisting of sediment/rust pre-filter and then a taste/odor carbon filter.
2. Water softener purchased from Lowes.
3. RO system for drinking water and fridge purchased from Lowes.

Installed everything myself and the water quality is like night and day.

YOU ARE RIGHT, ALL OF THE ELECTRONIC GADGETS HAVE NOT BEEN PROVEN TO WORK. A GOOD SOFTENER AND A R/O IS ALL THAT YOU NEED.

 

[Rivermama]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the moment.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

NO SALT FREE SYSTEM CAN SAY THAT IT GIVES YOU SOFT WATER. THEY WILL SAY SOFT LIKE OR SILKY SOFT WATER BUT IT CAN NOT SAY THAT IT WILL SOFTEN YOUR WATER BECAUSE IT DOES NOT. YOU NEED ION EXCHANGE TO GET SOFT WATER.

 

[Rivermama]

Lol. oh! we got a miscommunication going on. I have a little RO system that just feeds my fridge and a small faucet on the kitchen sink. Are you saying the supply line TO that RO system should be after the softener? or it should be before? Understanding that the RO system itself is not a big one that is supplying the whole house.

YOUR R/O IS WHERE IT SHOULD BE. IN THE KITCHEN GIVING YOU FOOD GRADE WATER.

 

[RiverDave]

Actually I believe my RO system is connected before the softener.. A lot of the houses (newer) in Havasu are pre plumbed for both the softener and RO in the garage.

This is how mine is setup





I'm not a plumber but i'm pretty sure the feed to the softener is on the left so my RO would be before the softener..

I will say that if I taste the water coming out of the faucets I can taste salt.. so i'm wondering if something is wrong? It's glaringly apparent it is soft water from when the system is bipassed (rinsing off soap in the shower etc).

In an interesting point to the conversation.. I had never seen one of these before moving to AZ? they say it stops water hammer. I had never seen one in california though?

(above the RO tank hanging from the ceiling)

 

[SoCalDave]

Actually I believe my RO system is connected before the softener.. A lot of the houses (newer) in Havasu are pre plumbed for both the softener and RO in the garage.

This is how mine is setup

View attachment 527730

View attachment 527731

I'm not a plumber but i'm pretty sure the feed to the softener is on the left so my RO would be before the softener..

I will say that if I taste the water coming out of the faucets I can taste salt.. so i'm wondering if something is wrong? It's glaringly apparent it is soft water from when the system is bipassed (rinsing off soap in the shower etc).

In an interesting point to the conversation.. I had never seen one of these before moving to AZ? they say it stops water hammer. I had never seen one in california though?

(above the RO tank hanging from the ceiling)
View attachment 527732

Dave it appears your incoming water is on the right side where the ball valve is. The left side would be soft water.
Yes the expansion tank is commonly used to keep water hammer from happening within your pipes.

 

[Ziggy]

Dave it appears your incoming water is on the right side where the ball valve is. The left side would be soft water.
Yes the expansion tank is commonly used to keep water hammer from happening within your pipes.

Expansion tank also relieves pressure when the house and attics are 200* in the summer. In Havasu that's their main purpose. Pipe Hammering is much more common with copper plumbing. Don't see those Exp tanks so often in moderate climate areas such as So Cal.

And yes, his R/O supply line is after the softener.
.
.
.
edit: I'm also surprised to see the softener tank hard plumbed. You should have flex lines there because one good earth shaker or accidental bump and those pipes can get broken.

 

[Flying_Lavey]

NO SALT FREE SYSTEM CAN SAY THAT IT GIVES YOU SOFT WATER. THEY WILL SAY SOFT LIKE OR SILKY SOFT WATER BUT IT CAN NOT SAY THAT IT WILL SOFTEN YOUR WATER BECAUSE IT DOES NOT. YOU NEED ION EXCHANGE TO GET SOFT WATER.

By definition, yes. But a water softener just exchanges (hence the term ion exchange) any ion contaminates with neutrally charged acceptable contaminates, like sodium and potasium in their stable forms of Sodium chloride and potasium chloride (I think we all know what happens when straight sodium or potasium are mixed with water).

Also, this is why a water softener without a filtration system after is not good for thankless water heaters. The minerals can and do plug up the heat exchangers causing reduced performance and system life.

 

[Rivermama]

Dave it appears your incoming water is on the right side where the ball valve is. The left side would be soft water.
Yes the expansion tank is commonly used to keep water hammer from happening within your pipes.

YOUR RIGHT, I WAS GOING TO SAY THE SAME THING.

 

[nordictom]

Just thought I would bump this thread to the top................

Our water softener died a few weeks ago. Looking to the RD brain trust for recommendations on a new softener. A lot of the softeners are advertised with a grain amount, which one is everyone using. BTW, we are in the middle of town, if that makes a difference.

NT

 

[johnnyC]

I was shopping around for a salt free whole house water softener/filter and ran across these Aquasana Rhino units.

50% off at the moment.

$1481 with the water softener and the pro intall kit after discount


http://www.aquasana.com/whole-house-water-filters/1000k-gallon-rhino?discountcode=adlucent&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=CSEGO&gclid=CLLa1LvH9NACFQ90fgodJNUD9w&kwid=productads-adid^65376717385-device^c-plaid^123280100905-sku^EQ@ADL41000-adType^PLA

I had one it didn't work, ended up throwing it away, it is snake oil use a reg water softener and a rev osmosis unit, if you are concerned about salt use potassium chloride instead of salt