Maine Mass Shooting

[was thatguy]

I certainly do not have details, but if mentally ill people can continue to purchase firearms long term it will be one size fits all.
These events are exactly what people like Newsom live for, an opportunity to restrict firearm purchases for all.

Right now a background check looks at criminal records. Having mental health professionals add a name that is undergoing treatment seems easy enough. There would need to be transparency as the affected patient would need to be made aware of his/her name being added. Perfect no, but we cannot continue to let mentally ill people purchase firearms legally and commit crimes.

Until the day that someone decides that you belong on the list.
Or the company provided 2nd year counselor that some average dude sees for the covered 5 visits because his wife left or he just needs a little help with his life, decides that said dude needs reported as being “in treatment” and his rights taken away.
I understand your reasoning, but it’s a dangerous game deciding who among should be labeled…you are using what seems like sane logic to cure an insane illogical problem.
Meanwhile, like 38 people have been shot and killed in Chicago IN THE LAST 26 DAYS, with 185 or so more shot and wounded. That’s just for October.
Where is the outrage? Where is the knee jerk solutions and “mental health” judgments?
They’ll plant 700 people and wound 5 times that many this year and not a single thing will be done.
I’d wager a case of Makers Mark that not a single one of those fuckers were shot with a legally purchased firearm.

At the end of the day, in this country where guns outnumber people, restricting new gun purchases as a valid solution to reduce murder by gun is ludicrous, and in fact plays exactly into the gun control narrative.
It’s just another way of blaming the gun.
All it will do is delay a spree shooters plan by hours or maybe a day.

The first thing that is focused on is “where’d he get that gun?? If only that gun store would have known he was crazy none of this would have happened!”
Sorry, but that is what they want you to focus on.
I ain’t falling for it.

 

[was thatguy]

Please note I said legally purchased. I see no way to stop illegal gun buys.

Legally purchased?
No, you mean purchases from an FFL dealer.
In my state any gun owner can legally sell a gun to anybody and not even ask their name. Not one thing “illegal” about it.
In CA a hand to hand purchase or transfer without a FFL intermediary would be illegal…but that’s a state law.
I prefer not to live in police states, and I prefer my doctor patient privilege not to be on some 3 letter agencies data base for the sole purpose of restricting my rights, let alone any fucking retailers computer.

 

[17 10 Flat]

Until the day that someone decides that you belong on the list.
Or the company provided 2nd year counselor that some average dude sees for the covered 5 visits because his wife left or he just needs a little help with his life, decides that said dude needs reported as being “in treatment” and his rights taken away.
I understand your reasoning, but it’s a dangerous game deciding who among should be labeled…you are using what seems like sane logic to cure an insane illogical problem.
Meanwhile, like 38 people have been shot and killed in Chicago IN THE LAST 26 DAYS, with 185 or so more shot and wounded. That’s just for October.
Where is the outrage? Where is the knee jerk solutions and “mental health” judgments?
They’ll plant 700 people and wound 5 times that many this year and not a single thing will be done.
I’d wager a case of Makers Mark that not a single one of those fuckers were shot with a legally purchased firearm.

At the end of the day, in this country where guns outnumber people, restricting new gun purchases as a valid solution to reduce murder by gun is ludicrous, and in fact plays exactly into the gun control narrative.
It’s just another way of blaming the gun.
All it will do is delay a spree shooters plan by hours or maybe a day.

The first thing that is focused on is “where’d he get that gun?? If only that gun store would have known he was crazy none of this would have happened!”
Sorry, but that is what they want you to focus on.
I ain’t falling for it.

I do not imply my thoughts on this is the end all do all. But legally purchased firearms versa illegaly obtained seem to attract more attention, as you described in the Chicago shootings.

 

[17 10 Flat]

Legally purchased?
No, you mean purchases from an FFL dealer.
In my state any gun owner can legally sell a gun to anybody and not even ask their name. Not one thing “illegal” about it.
In CA a hand to hand purchase or transfer without a FFL intermediary would be illegal…but that’s a state law.
I prefer not to live in police states, and I prefer my doctor patient privilege not to be on some 3 letter agencies data base for the sole purpose of restricting my rights, let alone any fucking retailers computer.

Does this mean periodic mass murders by mentally ill people is the price we pay for living in our republic?

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Please note I said legally purchased. I see no way to stop illegal gun buys.

If they were legally purchased what exactly are you advocating?

 

[was thatguy]

I do not imply my thoughts on this is the end all do all. But legally purchased firearms seem to attract more attention, as you described in the Chicago shootings.

Yep
That is the narrative. Don’t fall for it.
It doesn’t attract more attention, it’s the drum the media beats to affect the promotion of more gun control laws.
A shooter could have 20 guns in his house and the only one you’ll hear about was his over the counter purchase.

There’s like 400 million or whatever guns in this country that we can account for.
No database will save anyone from Joe psycho.

Does this mean periodic mass murders by mentally ill people is the price we pay for living in our republic?

It’s a risk, yes.
There’s a lot of crazy bastards out there.

Hell, a cop right here on this site once labeled me a 5150 and he’s never even met me.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Does this mean periodic mass murders by mentally ill people is the price we pay for living in our republic?

Yes. Freedom has its price.

 

[EmpirE231]

We need to ban crazy people

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

We need to ban crazy people

No we should take away their guns… they won’t find some other way to harm people after they have been put on a list and their legally purchased guns taken away. And then they say you are crazy and take away your guns

 

[Eliminator21vdrive]

Mental institutions cost too much........

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Mental institutions cost too much........

Yes. We need that money to save Ukraine.

 

[Singleton]

I do not imply my thoughts on this is the end all do all. But legally purchased firearms versa illegaly obtained seem to attract more attention, as you described in the Chicago shootings.

IL has some of the strictest gun laws around. Go north to WI or east to Indiana and the laws are very different.
Read a study, almost 90% of the gun confiscated in IL were purchased in Indiana (Has some of the weakest laws around).

I am all for keeping guns away from mentally unstable folks. The problem is who decides. In select states as soon as you’re reported as being seen (does not matter reason why), your guns are taken away and getting them back is almost impossible. Other states, PD can run to the judge, state your unstable and your guns go away, without any ability to present evidence of the contrary. Yes, something needs to change, but the answer on how is not an easy one.

 

[was thatguy]

Mental institutions cost too much........

RDP is free…

 

[bonesfab]

We need to ban crazy people

At least put them back in rubber rooms where they can't hurt any one.

 

[BTR]

The issue is he self checked himself into a mental facility. No police involved so no report and no guns confiscated. Bit of a flaw in the system.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

The issue is he self checked himself into a mental facility. No police involved so no report and no guns confiscated. Bit of a flaw in the system.

I read the guy has a history of domestic violence and other arrests.

 

[COCA COLA COWBOY]

Funny how this happens when CA is right in the middle of the assault weapons law reversed.

I’m shocked. I’m mean timing couldn’t be more perfect.

I was thinking the same thing...almost happens every time the 2nd amendment comes back us. I hate to say it because I'm starting to fall into the theorists, but the CIA always comes into the back of my mind after reading some our history.

 

[was thatguy]

The issue is he self checked himself into a mental facility. No police involved so no report and no guns confiscated. Bit of a flaw in the system.

So checking oneself in should trigger notification to law enforcement?
Hmmm
Note to self…never ever seek professional help for any personal problem.
That isn’t a flaw, it’s a safeguard.
You guys are all focused on the gun, or rather taking that gun out of those hands.
It won’t change anything.
Invading my privacy and stripping away my (your) rights to confidentiality in some half assed attempt prevent motivated joe from spraying the bowling alley just doesn’t make any sense to me.

 

[COCA COLA COWBOY]

At the end of the day, he could have killed just as many people with a vehicle, a chemical cocktail, a well lit fire, etc. Bad people do bad things and they will use any item to accomplish their task. Tragedy happens because of bad people, not because of guns.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

So checking oneself in should trigger notification to law enforcement?
Hmmm
Note to self…never ever seek professional help for any personal problem.
That isn’t a flaw, it’s a safeguard.
You guys are all focused on the gun, or rather taking that gun out of those hands.
It won’t change anything.
Invading my privacy and stripping away my (your) rights to confidentiality in some half assed attempt prevent motivated joe from spraying the bowling alley just doesn’t make any sense to me.

On top of that the thought here seems to be to regulate legal gun purchases.

So then those intent on committing criminal acts just obtain guns via criminal means… like the criminals do.

 

[COCA COLA COWBOY]

We need to ban crazy people

That's a lot of people...I haven't looked at the numbers, but there are a lot of registered democrats.

 

[4Waters]

I am a 2nd amendment supporter, but HIPAA laws need to be updated. Mental heath issues need to in a data base.

That's a slippery slope, phobias are a mental thing so if the government marks your phobia as a risk then once they find out about it they will come take your guns. Who decides what mental illness will be on that list? The answer is the government and they will add what ever they want to achieve their goal to disarm the citizens.

In this case the doctor that treated him should have advised the state so they could check to see if any guns were registered to him. If there is nothing set up for the doctor to do that then it is another breakdown in the system.

 

[was thatguy]

On top of that the thought here seems to be to regulate legal gun purchases.

So then those intent on committing criminal acts just obtain guns via criminal means… like the criminals do.

Basically.
And that’s what the news tells them us think.
If only the gun store clerk had private info on the medical history of that customer 22 people would be alive.
Or that law enforcement would have gone and taken all of his guns away it would have never happened.
What in fact even constitutes an “illegal” gun purchase?
Outside of California what exactly defines illegal purchases?
The entire discussion seems to assume that buying and selling used guns is illegal? Like a gun store is the only legal means? Lol!
It’s ridiculous to think.
This entire mind set just goes to show the progress made by the anti 2nd movement.

 

[Long Way Home]

People keep telling me that I'm crazy, I disagree. People do not understand mental issues and the majority of insurance will not cover mental illness problems and it’s very difficult with somebody with the mental illness to go to the doctor because they feel they are fine and it’s the rest of the world that has gone insane . The United States Supreme Court has sad you cannot force medicine on someone , they are free to make their own choices, it is very difficult if you have a loved one that has mental issues as there’s not much you can do because insurance doesn’t cover it , you pay out of pocket and that’s only if you can get the love one to see a Doctor Who will then recommend a psychiatrist and it usually takes 2 psychiatrist documenting the patient is unstable and a threat to themselves or society to get any help and most of this again is out of pocket .
How do you tell someone they are crazy , Do crazy people know they're crazy??????

 

[17 10 Flat]

Does this mean, we as a constitutional republic with as set of amendments one of which is the second amendment the right to bear arms. Which I support. Have to live with people killing in mass at times because the other side of the coin is repeal of the second amendment. No guns but knives and bricks may become more popular. Then we could be on our way even faster to being like China.

 

[angiebaby]

In this case the doctor that treated him should have advised the state so they could check to see if any guns were registered to him. If there is nothing set up for the doctor to do that then it is another breakdown in the system.

Maine, like most states, does not have a firearm registry.

 

[17 10 Flat]

Basically.
And that’s what the news tells them us think.
If only the gun store clerk had private info on the medical history of that customer 22 people would be alive.
Or that law enforcement would have gone and taken all of his guns away it would have never happened.
What in fact even constitutes an “illegal” gun purchase?
Outside of California what exactly defines illegal purchases?
The entire discussion seems to assume that buying and selling used guns is illegal? Like a gun store is the only legal means? Lol!
It’s ridiculous to think.
This entire mind set just goes to show the progress made by the anti 2nd movement.

In my area of Florida there is a huge commercial flea market, Little gun booth. Verify age. Select gun, pay money walk out. Done.

 

[BTR]

So checking oneself in should trigger notification to law enforcement?
Hmmm
Note to self…never ever seek professional help for any personal problem.
That isn’t a flaw, it’s a safeguard.
You guys are all focused on the gun, or rather taking that gun out of those hands.
It won’t change anything.
Invading my privacy and stripping away my (your) rights to confidentiality in some half assed attempt prevent motivated joe from spraying the bowling alley just doesn’t make any sense to me.

Not at all just explaining why he did not get his guns taken away.

 

[EmpirE231]

Did they get the guy?

 

[rivermobster]

In my area of Florida there is a huge commercial flea market, Little gun booth. Verify age. Select gun, pay money walk out. Done.

Bought my first shotgun at Bain & Davis exactly like that. I think I was maybe 16?

Amazingly enough...

I've never killed anyone!

 

[4Waters]

Did they get the guy?

Nope

 

[Ducksquasher]

Bought my first shotgun at Bain & Davis exactly like that. I think I was maybe 16?

Amazingly enough...

I've never killed anyone!

Bain and Davis...that's a flashback right there! Used to hit Bain/Davis and Jeffs Sporting Goods on the same trip with my Dad as a kid.

 

[rivermobster]

Bain and Davis...that's a flashback right there! Used to hit Bain/Davis and Jeffs Sporting Goods on the same trip with my Dad as a kid.

You and me both.

 

[17 10 Flat]

Bought my first shotgun at Bain & Davis exactly like that. I think I was maybe 16?

Amazingly enough...

I've never killed anyone!

I have read you are not right in the head cause you don't own a iPhone.....

 

[rivermobster]

I have read you are not right in the head cause you don't own a iPhone.....

Now see? This is exactly what Tommy was talking about...

You drink the Koolaid and You think everyone else is fucked up??





Gotta be careful what you ask for sometimes.

 

[Willie B]

… My 30-40 Marlin bought from a friend in Mammoth… 50 bucks …beautiful rifle…stolen…
…32 hammerless pistol borrowed from a friend… Stolen…
…My 12 ga shotgun bought from Big Five…Still have it… Never been fired …all the shotgun shells were stolen???..,
… If the 30-30 Marlin is ever used in committing a crime… Who are they first going to talk to…me…as I reported it stolen…

 

[petie6464]

Geeze, so many sick people. .

 

[17 10 Flat]

Now see? This is exactly what Tommy was talking about...

You drink the Koolaid and You think everyone else is fucked up??





Gotta be careful what you ask for sometimes.

My Koolaid has copious amounts of vodka included..

 

[BabyRay]

Maine, like most states, does not have a firearm registry.

Thankfully!

 

[coolchange]

People keep telling me that I'm crazy, I disagree. People do not understand mental issues and the majority of insurance will not cover mental illness problems and it’s very difficult with somebody with the mental illness to go to the doctor because they feel they are fine and it’s the rest of the world that has gone insane . The United States Supreme Court has sad you cannot force medicine on someone , they are free to make their own choices, it is very difficult if you have a loved one that has mental issues as there’s not much you can do because insurance doesn’t cover it , you pay out of pocket and that’s only if you can get the love one to see a Doctor Who will then recommend a psychiatrist and it usually takes 2 psychiatrist documenting the patient is unstable and a threat to themselves or society to get any help and most of this again is out of pocket How do you tell someone they are crazy , Do crazy people know they're crazy??????

Catch 22

 

[Long Way Home]

Bought my first shotgun at Bain & Davis exactly like that. I think I was maybe 16?

Amazingly enough...

I've never killed anyone!

'Hi Curly. Killed anyone today? The day ain't over yet...' - City Slickers

Mitch Robbins: Hi Curly. Killed anyone today? Curly: The day ain't over yet...

clip.cafe

 

[MK1MOD0]

This guy seems like the perfect Manchurian candidate.
White .....
Male.......
Military....
AR-15.....


Sad and sick.

 

[17 10 Flat]

Since the alleged shooter was not Trans or dark skinned this will get lots and lots of media coverage.

 

[SKIDMARC]

Yes. Freedom has its price.

Wow, that's easy to say until something like this effects you personally. I wonder would you say that to one of the victims family members? I love guns, own many, but what you are saying is ridiculous.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Wow, that's easy to say until something like this effects you personally. I wonder would you say that to one of the victims family members? I love guns, own many, but what you are saying is ridiculous.

Spare us. The reality is that saying that is the exact opposite. It is easiest to take away freedoms. It is hardest to maintain freedoms, and that comes at a cost. If a crazy person tries to kill me or my family with a gun, an explosive, a rental truck or anything else, I should also have the freedom to kill him with a gun I legally purchase and carry.

Do you think the victim's family members are giving up their guns this morning? Would you give up your guns if a family member was killed by a gun? I sure as hell would not. The gun is not the issue.

The remaining freedoms we have is the only thing keeping this place together.

Remember the posts here - "Wait until your grandma gets Covid and you will see why everyone needs to be vaccinated and wear a mask!"

Those aged well. In Australia where they gave up their guns.. how did that turn out for them? We've seen some of the videos.

 

[MK1MOD0]

Wow, that's easy to say until something like this effects you personally. I wonder would you say that to one of the victims family members? I love guns, own many, but what you are saying is ridiculous.

Not ridiculous. Never give up your rights for the perceived notion of safety. Theses nut cases will kill using any means necessary.....Be it firearms, vehicles , or explosives. Just look around the world and see theses horrific incidents, and how they are carried out.

 

[Dan Lorenze]

If more people were armed this never would have happened.

You're right.. It's only way to fix this.. Fight fire with fire. No laws will change these shootings..

 

[angiebaby]

Wow, that's easy to say until something like this effects you personally. I wonder would you say that to one of the victims family members? I love guns, own many, but what you are saying is ridiculous.

What would you say to them? We're going to do our best to make sure every one of these scary black guns are rounded up from law-abiding Americans to make up for your family member? Or would you say that we are going to make sure every single person who has ever sought mental health assistance will have their guns confiscated?

I see no way to prevent these tragedies without conducting a house-to-house search to confiscate all firearms from law-abiding people, which will result in a lot of deaths and perhaps a civil war. I'm not willing to have that happen to prevent these tragedies. I also would not be willing to give up any of my firearms . . . if I had any.

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

You're right.. It's only way to fix this.. Fight fire with fire. No laws with change these shootings..

Its funny. That is exactly how we as a nation solve problems everywhere else in the world. However you want to phrase it.. peace through strength, speak softly and carry a big stick etc. But in the homeland we are made to rely on others for protection, and be victimized by criminals and crazy people.

 

[PlanB]

Since the alleged shooter was not Trans or dark skinned this will get lots and lots of media coverage.

The White House led with it this morning in the press briefing.