lake havasu atorney for boat related ticket

[Cibolasam]

I don’t know if it’s been mentioned but with any ticket I’ve received I file a “Motion for Discovery “. You can research it online. It makes the officer give you any and all information he has and that he will use against you in court, if he doesn’t provide you with this, you ask for your case to be dismissed for lack of prosecutorial evidence. If he does provide the information and you do go to court make sure he only uses the information he provided to you. I have used this twice and told a couple of friends about it and all the cases were dropped. Good luck.


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[BoatCop]

Wait , in last sentence you said he committed the crime ? Aren’t you supposed to wait AFTER the trial to say that ?

I'm retired. Not my case. I don't care.

 

[Waffles]

Our old toon had a sun pad behind the rear seat up high, level with the seat backs, with that you could easily roll off the back onto the drive with a little blip of the throttle, nothing at all like a rear lounger set up with railings all around it.

Came to say this. My old suntracker had a sunpad like that. No way in hell would I let anyone lounge back there underway

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[Justfishing]

I would contact the prosecutor and explain it. Real simple explanation of the law and how the boat is designed. It is the prosecutor job to apply the law correctly and drop charges if it is clear a law has not been broken.

 

[Dirtbag]

making an assumption that you were heading in or out of the channel and not at speed?

5-341. Negligent operation of watercraft or water skis; restriction in operation of watercraft; violation; classification

A. No person shall operate a watercraft in a careless, reckless or negligent manner.

B. A person shall not operate a watercraft while allowing a person to ride on the gunwales, the transom or the decked over bow of a watercraft propelled by machinery operating in excess of wakeless speed except if:

 

[BoatCop]

I would contact the prosecutor and explain it. Real simple explanation of the law and how the boat is designed. It is the prosecutor job to apply the law correctly and drop charges if it is clear a law has not been broken.

Contact the prosecutor and they'll tell you to "tell it to the judge", or to "have your attorney contact me".

 

[Ballyhoo]

The part in your reply that I underlined - I don’t think it’s a seat, but instead a sun pad - see post regarding boatcop above.

This is the most likely reason a cite was issued. Its not made or designed to be a seat. Its a sun pad.

 

[Ballyhoo]

I would contact the prosecutor and explain it. Real simple explanation of the law and how the boat is designed. It is the prosecutor job to apply the law correctly and drop charges if it is clear a law has not been broken.

Prosecutors aren’t going to talk to a defendant in a pending criminal case.

 

[PlanB]

This is the most likely reason a cite was issued. Its not made or designed to be a seat. Its a sun pad.

The Swingback from Bennington is absolutely designed as a seat. The backrest “swings” for and aft to allow seating in both directions. With the rail it is designed to be legal for use while underway like the pictures on their site show.

 

[Ballyhoo]

Check subsection #1 of the referenced code. That pad has to be designed and constructed for the purpose of carrying passengers AT ALL SPEEDS.

I think that is what the fight will be over. The cop will say that its not a seat, its a pad with a back rest located outside of the actual seating area. At speeds above XX mph it doesn’t provide a safe location for a passenger. The cop will likely have examples of prior accidents to offer the court.

It would not hurt to find out the builders official position on the pad as a safe area to ride on at all speeds.

Good luck with the process.

 

[DILLIGAF]

I'm retired. Not my case. I don't care.

I like it. Lol

 

[gmnhra]

Update
So, I folded like a cheap beach chair....
After driving 4 hours to get to court at 9 am...wait till 9:30 for judge and clerks to grace the courtroom and then sit thru eviction cases, restraining orders, marijuana possession (different thread but damn $1500 fines for possession), there were four other "transom riding" cases. first guy plead guilty...$350 fine. I figured a full day of no consulting, another full day if I pleaded not guilty for the next hearing....Fuck it, I pled no contest...$350 fine...4 hour drive home...drink now in hand..
I chalk it up as a contribution to boating karma for actual stupid crap I did in my younger days...

Sorry, I wish I had the energy to have fought this because it was B.S.

 

[Clearmax]

Wow that sucks

 

[Uncle Dave]

Take it easy.... I'm pre-law....

View attachment 766383

I though you were pre med?

UD

 

[Rvrluvr]

Pussy

Exactly why they get away with this shit!

 

[DLow]

I think you owe everyone that posted on this thread a beer. Including me. I did learn a couple things from this thread though. Thanks to those that contributed with factual information (boatcop, 530), especially those that did so after reading ALL of the posts (not Ballyhoo ).

 

[CJ_Donahue]

I would have paid the full fine by mail rather than driving 8 hours. Driving all the way to Havasu and not playing with my boat would suck.

 

[ElAzul]

I though you were pre med?

UD

He's both it's all about who you know

 

[LHC Kirby]

Disappointed in your decision, and lack of information..... did cop show up ? Were you prepared to fight it ?

 

[gmnhra]

Disappointed in your decision, and lack of information..... did cop show up ? Were you prepared to fight it ?

this hearing was the arraignment only. mandatory appearance. no way to plead by phone, email, etc. Just the Judge...no citing officer
you get three choices...guilty, not guilty, no contest...there is no chance to present any arguements
if you plead not guilty, they schedule you for a pre trial conference about a month out, and then the actual hearing where you could present your case is sometime after that.

Was just not a hill to die on for me...

 

[FishSniper]

this hearing was the arraignment only. mandatory appearance. no way to plead by phone, email, etc. Just the Judge...no citing officer
you get three choices...guilty, not guilty, no contest...there is no chance to present any arguements
if you plead not guilty, they schedule you for a pre trial conference about a month out, and then the actual hearing where you could present your case is sometime after that.

Was just not a hill to die on for me...

So you post a thread on here looking for an attorney get the response the ticket would likeky be dismissed are given tips on how to fight it without an attorney then go there and plead no contest ? Why bother posting in the first place.

 

[LakeBeard]

Update
So, I folded like a cheap beach chair....
After driving 4 hours to get to court at 9 am...wait till 9:30 for judge and clerks to grace the courtroom and then sit thru eviction cases, restraining orders, marijuana possession (different thread but damn $1500 fines for possession), there were four other "transom riding" cases. first guy plead guilty...$350 fine. I figured a full day of no consulting, another full day if I pleaded not guilty for the next hearing....Fuck it, I pled no contest...$350 fine...4 hour drive home...drink now in hand..
I chalk it up as a contribution to boating karma for actual stupid crap I did in my younger days...

Sorry, I wish I had the energy to have fought this because it was B.S.

I would have done the exact same thing...

 

[gmnhra]

So you post a thread on here looking for an attorney get the response the ticket would likeky be dismissed are given tips on how to fight it without an attorney then go there and plead no contest ? Why bother posting in the first place.

Interesting position...
Here is my position
Why post in the first place?
RDP has always been a good source for information. As with all information, there are some good informed responses and there are responses that are not relevant to the specific circumstances. As with any decision, I considered the information, weighed the risk/benefit in "fighting" and made an informed decision. Information is king and using that information to make my decision may have resulted in a different decision for you. Like the threads on "who do I use to detail my boat?". You will get fifty answers. Just because I did not choose your recommendation does not make the post a waste of time.

As for DLow response...Happy to buy anyone a beer....look for old guy at Turtle...Outer Harbor...or elsewhere on a Bennington pontoon with NO ONE sitting on the rear lounger.....

 

[Singleton]

Interesting position...
Here is my position
Why post in the first place?
RDP has always been a good source for information. As with all information, there are some good informed responses and there are responses that are not relevant to the specific circumstances. As with any decision, I considered the information, weighed the risk/benefit in "fighting" and made an informed decision. Information is king and using that information to make my decision may have resulted in a different decision for you. Like the threads on "who do I use to detail my boat?". You will get fifty answers. Just because I did not choose your recommendation does not make the post a waste of time.

As for DLow response...Happy to buy anyone a beer....look for old guy at Turtle...Outer Harbor...or elsewhere on a Bennington pontoon with NO ONE sitting on the rear lounger.....

Sounds like you made the cheapest decision.
If you fought it, your total cost out of pocket (when you add travel expenses) would of been higher then the ticket.

 

[Ricks raft]

So you post a thread on here looking for an attorney get the response the ticket would likeky be dismissed are given tips on how to fight it without an attorney then go there and plead no contest ? Why bother posting in the first place.

Apparently after consideration, he changed his mind...
I don't mind the posting. it still informs us of the BS going on so we can be prepaired.
In the old days you could be anywhere on the boat "inside the railing" and not have a problem. Years ago i was stopped in a toon for sitting on the sun pad, showed the officer the railing was higher than the cushion (only by a couple inches, no different than a front railing) and let me go.
I was also stopped in my howard with people on the sun pad with the low railing behind it, at no wake speed and was told could only be there while docking or anchoring. So...

 

[Ziggy]

If the other transom riding case had not been ahead of you what were you thinking of doing? Do you think you may have fought it?

 

[HALLETT BOY]

After I got my noise violation on Lake Mojave , I went to court in Searchlight , Nevada , yea ! I brought documentation, pictures etc etc . I was last , after speeders , drunks , druggies and wife beaters . Before they called my name , DA came over and said they would like to drop charges , but I still pay fine . I said no , let’s see how it plays out . Ranger and DA talked together for about 15 minutes , judge heard my case and Rangers perfectly rehearsed testimony. Long story short , I lost . But after I lost , I gave a 5 minute speech to judge and the court about what I perceived as nothing but harassment and all out abuse of power , made me feel better . The ranger , then came over to shake my hand and say no hard feelings , I looked right at her and said : we’re not friends, you scratched my boat and caused me a huge waste of time , she didn’t look happy . The judge , DA and ranger were all pals , no way in hell was I gonna win .

 

[gmnhra]

If the other transom riding case had not been ahead of you what were you thinking of doing? Do you think you may have fought it?

Good question....knowing that the fine was $350 helped my decision...
Based on the min/max sentencing criteria alone and in the absence of the previous guys fine amount, I think I would have fought it...

Other than the grief I am getting from RDP experts I am glad to put it in the rear view...

 

[outboardrick]

After I got my noise violation on Lake Mojave , I went to court in Searchlight , Nevada , yea ! I brought documentation, pictures etc etc . I was last , after speeders , drunks , druggies and wife beaters . Before they called my name , DA came over and said they would like to drop charges , but I still pay fine . I said no , let’s see how it plays out . Ranger and DA talked together for about 15 minutes , judge heard my case and Rangers perfectly rehearsed testimony. Long story short , I lost . But after I lost , I gave a 5 minute speech to judge and the court about what I perceived as nothing but harassment and all out abuse of power , made me feel better . The ranger , then came over to shake my hand and say no hard feelings , I looked right at her and said : we’re not friends, you scratched my boat and caused me a huge waste of time , she didn’t look happy . The judge , DA and ranger were all pals , no way in hell was I gonna win .

But if no one ever fights it will all just get worse. They count on people not fighting and just going along with whatever they dictate... Good Job for fighting!!

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

this hearing was the arraignment only. mandatory appearance. no way to plead by phone, email, etc. Just the Judge...no citing officer
you get three choices...guilty, not guilty, no contest...there is no chance to present any arguements
if you plead not guilty, they schedule you for a pre trial conference about a month out, and then the actual hearing where you could present your case is sometime after that.

Was just not a hill to die on for me...

I get it, its a cost benefit decision, as a business owner you have to do the math. Sucks and I am sure the city generates alot of revenue from non-residents that have the same issue.

 

[530RL]

Any chance I can borrow your boat and anyone want to go for a ride on the back lounger?

 

[Ziggy]

I get it, its a cost benefit decision, as a business owner you have to do the math. Sucks and I am sure the city generates alot of revenue from non-residents that have the same issue.

You know they do. Time is way more valuable than a few hundred dollars for most and I'd bet many of these type of citations could be beat if challenged. Gmnhra did what he needed, probably what 90% or more of us would have.

 

[dribble]

So you post a thread on here looking for an attorney get the response the ticket would likeky be dismissed are given tips on how to fight it without an attorney then go there and plead no contest ? Why bother posting in the first place.

It's called cutting your losses. The posting of the thread was to gather useful information. Paying a lawyer $300.00 an hour and making two eight hour round trips to go to court to try and beat a $350.00 ticket makes no sense.

 

[Bigbore500r]

That sucks, seemed like you would win that one. I get it though, time is money....but you were already there! Wanted to see how this one played out

 

[FishSniper]

It's called cutting your losses. The posting of the thread was to gather useful information. Paying a lawyer $300.00 an hour and making two eight hour round trips to go to court to try and beat a $350.00 ticket makes no sense.

Never once said anything about hiring a lawyer that would be a waste of money. So basically now he's lost a large seating area on his boat while underway and the county collected 350 bucks and will continue to do so.

 

[FishSniper]

Interesting position...
Here is my position
Why post in the first place?
RDP has always been a good source for information. As with all information, there are some good informed responses and there are responses that are not relevant to the specific circumstances. As with any decision, I considered the information, weighed the risk/benefit in "fighting" and made an informed decision. Information is king and using that information to make my decision may have resulted in a different decision for you. Like the threads on "who do I use to detail my boat?". You will get fifty answers. Just because I did not choose your recommendation does not make the post a waste of time.

As for DLow response...Happy to buy anyone a beer....look for old guy at Turtle...Outer Harbor...or elsewhere on a Bennington pontoon with NO ONE sitting on the rear lounger.....

To each their own. Did you contact the manufacture and get their opinion ? I wouldn't be real happy if a large seating area suddenly was not useable while underway especially if they were advertising it as useable seating while underway.

 

[BoatCop]

And whether you want to believe it or not. A citation, such as this one, is not for harassment. There have been hundreds of deaths and probably thousands of serious injuries from people falling off the back of boats into the prop and/or drowning. Even at so called "wakeless speed". I've personally investigated or was otherwise involved in several of both kinds myself. Most were young ladies all oiled up with tan lotion sliding off the back. Now some of the noise deals are BS, even I never wrote noise cites (except some with no mufflers at all). But when it comes to safety issues, we tend to take those real serious. The shit I could tell you from doing it for 40 years, would make you sell your boat and move to the Yukon. Most of the water cops out there are just plain tired of the same thing year after year.

 

[Orange Juice]

I would get a lawyer and sue Bennington. I’m sure you’ll find many lawyers ready to take them on.

 

[mobldj]

better call saul

 

[lbhsbz]

I would get a lawyer and sue Bennington. I’m sure you’ll find many lawyers ready to take them on.

On what grounds?

 

[grumpy88]

Since the cops feel that it is a sun pad with a backrest does that make it illegal to use underway even with the backrest folded the opisite direction with passengers on it ?

 

[rvrrun]

Since the cops feel that it is a sun pad with a backrest does that make it illegal to use underway even with the backrest folded the opisite direction with passengers on it ?

You'd need a single digit IQ to slide off that way, so I would think they'd see it as a standard forward facing seat.

 

[grumpy88]

You'd need a single digit IQ to slide off that way, so I would think they'd see it as a standard forward facing seat.

I am not disagreeing but I would not of thought what he was doing was illegal either .

 

[rvrrun]

I am not disagreeing but I would not of thought what he was doing was illegal either .

I would think a back rest would negate the need for railing and would be intended for use under way.

We've been shopping for a toon and have seen a few with rear facing lounges that are enclosed like a regular toon (ie, not a railing but solid metal) and I'll bet someone could find fault with that as well.