I Found A Wet Spot

[Go-Fly]

I found a spot on my new property that is always wet. Its 13 degrees out and I still have water coming up. A week or so there was 2ft of snow here and still you could see bare ground. There is a light layer of ice on top that goes away during the day. I live on the side of a volcano so, I'm thinking geothermal. There is active geothermal wells and springs 21 miles away but, nothing in my area until now. I'm thinking ground coil heat pump? Could I put water coils under my driveway and sidewalks and have them frost free? My wife rolled her eyes and said "you're not going to dig up the yard are you?" Psssst...look who you are talking to. The yard is the least of your worries.

 

[BasilHayden]

This post has possibilities!

 

[HOOTER SLED-]

Moist

 

[monkeyswrench]

I, for one, was expecting something waaaay different.

Now that my mind is out of the gutter...you could punch a well and divert the hot water into an evap coil within your home, then put the water back into a secondary well, or divert it to a pond. Cheap heat to maintain your home. I have a friend with an HVAC company that did it to maintain the slab Temps in his new build...the ground water temp was a constant, so using the slab as a heat sink made it easier to maintain a comfortable temperature in the house.

 

[rivermobster]

This post has possibilities!

X1000

 

[coolchange]

I’d check with that @welldigger00 guy about drilling into geo thermal water situations.

 

[Go-Fly]

I was told the first thing to do is get a thermometer and stick it where the sun doesn't shine. I found this very insulting at first. If I can get a clear road, I can haul in a excavator and dig a test hole. I'm starting to regret the title of this thread. I need to drop a probe down my wet hole and see how warm it is. What could go wrong with a line like that. The state will loan me a recorder so I can keep track of how hot my hole gets. No better.

 

[welldigger00]

So you’ve got a little ground water poking up. How much do you want to invest in this? If your goal is a little free irrigation, it won’t take more than a little concrete and some plumbing for a spring box, and many a little 110v jet pump. If your goal is geothermal, heat loop well, then hang on to your wallet. The money you spend you’ll need to be thinking about how man years your ROI will be for infrastructure cost. The water may be a little warm right there, but transmitting it to any long distance will take any heat and dump it into the ground. Just my opinion, but what do I know?

 

[Go-Fly]

So you’ve got a little ground water poking up. How much do you want to invest in this? If your goal is a little free irrigation, it won’t take more than a little concrete and some plumbing for a spring box, and many a little 110v jet pump. If your goal is geothermal, heat loop well, then hang on to your wallet. The money you spend you’ll need to be thinking about how man years your ROI will be for infrastructure cost. The water may be a little warm right there, but transmitting it to any long distance will take any heat and dump it into the ground. Just my opinion, but what do I know?

Sounds like you know more then the average. No idea what I have here. Looking around there are more spots that are melting the snow. So do I have water coming up like I thought or is it just snow melt from the surface. The next step is testing and find out what we really have here. If I could install a ground source heat pump 10 ft underground, I could do heat and domestic hot water. As far as return on investment, that's easy. Its $0. More then likely the house will burn down in the next forest fire. I cant even get insurance on this house because it's in a extreme fire zone. The only thing left after a 1400 degree fire storm will be the concrete foundation and my luck that butt ugly chair the wife bought. There is a 6" well that we get our drinking water from. It will do 48gpm at 50psi all day long. So watering the lawn is not a problem. Bottom line is, this sounds fun and Go-Fly gets to buy a dozer to build a road back to it. How could that not be a win win?

 

[stokerwhore]

if you are on septic is it a damaged leach field?

 

[Go-Fly]

if you are on septic is it a damaged leach field?

Because the leach field was so far away from the septic tank, I had it scoped. No problems. 4 100ft runs with interlocking chambers. The hot spots are behind the house and the leach field is down hill by the road. Good thought in extreme cold environment and I didn't have the line from the tank to the spreader box checked.

 

[welldigger00]

Sounds like you know more then the average. No idea what I have here. Looking around there are more spots that are melting the snow. So do I have water coming up like I thought or is it just snow melt from the surface. The next step is testing and find out what we really have here. If I could install a ground source heat pump 10 ft underground, I could do heat and domestic hot water. As far as return on investment, that's easy. Its $0. More then likely the house will burn down in the next forest fire. I cant even get insurance on this house because it's in an extreme fire zone. The only thing left after a 1400 degree fire storm will be the concrete foundation and my luck that butt ugly chair the wife bought. There is a 6" well that we get our drinking water from. It will do 48gpm at 50psi all day long. So watering the lawn is not a problem. Bottom line is, this sounds fun and Go-Fly gets to buy a dozer to build a road back to it. How could that not be a win win?

As far as a cool project goes, be careful of what you’re getting yourself into. Buying machinery to investigate something may be fun, but might not be the best way to spend your money. If you’re trying to get the most of a resource, I’d consult a professional. Like another post earlier this week, I’d had have someone that is familiar with the area come out and give a real assessment. If you want results, be logical. If you want entertainment, stick with what you know how to do do already. Just saying. Again, what do I know?

 

[Go-Fly]

As far as a cool project goes, be careful of what you’re getting yourself into. Buying machinery to investigate something may be fun, but might not be the best way to spend your money. If you’re trying to get the most of a resource, I’d consult a professional. Like another post earlier this week, I’d had have someone that is familiar with the area come out and give a real assessment. If you want results, be logical. If you want entertainment, stick with what you know how to do do already. Just saying. Again, what do I know?

I am so going to disappoint you when I start rolling yellow steel.

 

[n2otoofast4u]

There are a pile of springs and little natural wells in that area down there! I’d bet it’s not super warm, but more just consistent supply that above freezing and keeping things slushy. The big property across from Crater Lake Resort, just south of Ft Klamath, has a giant spring. It’s “warm” but not volcanic warm, but it flows 24/7/365

 

[Go-Fly]

There are a pile of springs and little natural wells in that area down there! I’d bet it’s not super warm, but more just consistent supply that above freezing and keeping things slushy. The big property across from Crater Lake Resort, just south of Ft Klamath, has a giant spring. It’s “warm” but not volcanic warm, but it flows 24/7/365

I'm not far from there. I'll take warm. I think this is 24/7 because of the landscape around it. In Arizona I had a solar heat pump on my shop. Used zero off the grid from 10am to around 3or4. At first I keep the shop at 70*. But when it got to be 125* out, you'd almost pass out going from cold to super hot. I'm having a large storage building put up this spring. Going to put solar panels on all the roof surface. With the amount of sun we have here, there should be no problem running a ground water heat pump for the AC on a sunny day and the ground source for the heat side. Fall back will be both sides on the GW system.

 

[dave29]

We have a geothermal spring on our property that pumps 50 gallons per minute. It comes out of the side of out front hill, goes down the side of the hill into a 36" pipe that is a half pipe. At the top where the spring exits the crack, the water is about 98 degrees. The pipe extends about 400 feet down to the river and dumps out. The water looks clear however..........every 6 months I have a guy come out the property with a backhoe and remove hardened sediment. It's a PITA and costs me $700 every 6 months. There is no use for the water because it would fill a 2" pipe with sediment in about one month. First thing you need is a water guy to test the water and see what's in it.

 

[welldigger00]

I am so going to disappoint you when I start rolling yellow steel.

No need to worry about disappointing me, I honestly couldn’t give a shit what you do

 

[monkeyswrench]

How about a backhoe and some hardscaping? Build a little natural hotspring pool to soak in. Of course, depends on temps and having the water tested.

House sounds very cool. I think I'd be clearing some trees, and building an automated fire system. You have massive amounts of water available, I'd try to do a large meadow on the lower level of property, with those giant Rainbirds they use on farms

 

[n2otoofast4u]

I'm not far from there. I'll take warm. I think this is 24/7 because of the landscape around it. In Arizona I had a solar heat pump on my shop. Used zero off the grid from 10am to around 3or4. At first I keep the shop at 70*. But when it got to be 125* out, you'd almost pass out going from cold to super hot. I'm having a large storage building put up this spring. Going to put solar panels on all the roof surface. With the amount of sun we have here, there should be no problem running a ground water heat pump for the AC on a sunny day and the ground source for the heat side. Fall back will be both sides on the GW system.

Yep!

My buddy in Kfalls just built a new place and put solar on the roof. I’m impressed with how much generation he gets even in the winter! I’d not been around solar much, as we don’t really use it here in the PNW because of the weather, but watching what his has made me a believer!

 

[Go-Fly]

We have a geothermal spring on our property that pumps 50 gallons per minute. It comes out of the side of out front hill, goes down the side of the hill into a 36" pipe that is a half pipe. At the top where the spring exits the crack, the water is about 98 degrees. The pipe extends about 400 feet down to the river and dumps out. The water looks clear however..........every 6 months I have a guy come out the property with a backhoe and remove hardened sediment. It's a PITA and costs me $700 every 6 months. There is no use for the water because it would fill a 2" pipe with sediment in about one month. First thing you need is a water guy to test the water and see what's in it.

I don't plan on using the water from this location. I don't think there is enough of it and like you, I can see the minerals that it is bringing up. My plan is to bury a closed loop system underground for heat exchanging. There is a big advantage having a warm spot to start with then just the ambient temperature of the the ground. When I get time I'll post some pics of how they do it and the equipment that is used in the house. I plan to also heat my garage and shop with the same system so it going to be very large.

 

[dave29]

I don't plan on using the water from this location. I don't think there is enough of it and like you, I can see the minerals that it is bringing up. My plan is to bury a closed loop system underground for heat exchanging. There is a big advantage having a warm spot to start with then just the ambient temperature of the the ground. When I get time I'll post some pics of how they do it and the equipment that is used in the house. I plan to also heat my garage and shop with the same system so it going to be very large.

I'll be following.

 

[Shlbyntro]

I don't plan on using the water from this location. I don't think there is enough of it and like you, I can see the minerals that it is bringing up. My plan is to bury a closed loop system underground for heat exchanging. There is a big advantage having a warm spot to start with then just the ambient temperature of the the ground. When I get time I'll post some pics of how they do it and the equipment that is used in the house. I plan to also heat my garage and shop with the same system so it going to be very large.

At this point you might as well install a geothermal ac system and take the tax credits. One of my good customers is a geothermal installer. We were just talking the other day and he told me that if doing a complete install, it is financially a better choice to go geothermal vs a traditional system with the current tax credits and that's before taking into account that a geothermal system has 2-3x the life expectancy of a traditional system.

 

[evantwheeler]

I have a feeling Go-Fly has already designed, patented and built the equipment, has the iron on the ground to start digging once its dry enough to not make a mess, and is just playing with us.

 

[RaceTec]

I have a feeling Go-Fly has already designed, patented and built the equipment, has the iron on the ground to start digging once its dry enough to not make a mess, and is just playing with us.

Completely agree! He already has a plan in place, he seems to be the smartest guy I have never met!

 

[Go-Fly]

At this point you might as well install a geothermal ac system and take the tax credits. One of my good customers is a geothermal installer. We were just talking the other day and he told me that if doing a complete install, it is financially a better choice to go geothermal vs a traditional system with the current tax credits and that's before taking into account that a geothermal system has 2-3x the life expectancy of a traditional system.

I have a feeling Go-Fly has already designed, patented and built the equipment, has the iron on the ground to start digging once its dry enough to not make a mess, and is just playing with us.

Completely agree! He already has a plan in place, he seems to be the smartest guy I have never met!

I've done a lot of things in my life from building bio labs to inventing safety seals on bottles that are in your fridge but, I have never installed a geothermal heat pump system. There is a lot to learn here. I could hire it done but, I like to learn by doing. Met with an engineer today about opening thing up. We are going to drill first and check to see if this is a permanent thing or a migration. Who would of thought there was such a thing. Through soil samples they can tell. I still get to build a road with ground pounding equipment and knock down big trees like toothpicks so, my face looks like this.

 

[Shlbyntro]

I've done a lot of things in my life from building bio labs to inventing safety seals on bottles that are in your fridge but, I have never installed a geothermal heat pump system. There is a lot to learn here. I could hire it done but, I like to learn by doing. Met with an engineer today about opening thing up. We are going to drill first and check to see if this is a permanent thing or a migration. Who would of thought there was such a thing. Through soil samples they can tell. I still get to build a road with ground pounding equipment and knock down big trees like toothpicks so, my face looks like this.

the beauty of the geothermal systems is they don't actually require a active geological area. Instead of a condenser you're drilling several 4" holes in the ground, filling them with water, and running your charge pipe into the holes to do the heat exchanging. beyond the holes being used instead of a condenser the system pretty much still works like a regular ac system and can do heat and cold

 

[JB in so cal]

Degenerate Central. 2000 + views, 25 posts....

 

[Go-Fly]

the beauty of the geothermal systems is they don't actually require a active geological area. Instead of a condenser you're drilling several 4" holes in the ground, filling them with water, and running your charge pipe into the holes to do the heat exchanging. beyond the holes being used instead of a condenser the system pretty much still works like a regular ac system and can do heat and cold

How about a horizontal glycol coil system? How do you keep the water in the vertical holes?

 

[Shlbyntro]

How about a horizontal glycol coil system? How do you keep the water in the vertical holes?

They're lined. I actually think after the holes are drilled, he hammers in hollow piles. There some sort of formula he uses to determine how many holes need to be drilled for each project he works on.

I believe the issue with horizontal piping is it makes the system more susceptible to outside air temps where as the 50ft holes or however deep they are get into a spot where the ground temps are pretty much stable year round.

 

[Go-Fly]

They're lined. I actually think after the holes are drilled, he hammers in hollow piles. There some sort of formula he uses to determine how many holes need to be drilled for each project he works on.

I believe the issue with horizontal piping is it makes the system more susceptible to outside air temps where as the 50ft holes or however deep they are get into a spot where the ground temps are pretty much stable year round.

Interesting stuff. I cant imagine running my heat pump when its -10 outside.

 

[n2otoofast4u]

the beauty of the geothermal systems is they don't actually require a active geological area. Instead of a condenser you're drilling several 4" holes in the ground, filling them with water, and running your charge pipe into the holes to do the heat exchanging. beyond the holes being used instead of a condenser the system pretty much still works like a regular ac system and can do heat and cold

You’re going the wrong way.

 

[Justfishing]

Snow is an insulator. Any warmth in the ground may be enough to melt the snow. Snow melt may just be running to that area and collecting. What is the current frost depth

 

[Kachina26]

I've done a lot of things in my life from building bio labs to inventing safety seals on bottles that are in your fridge but, I have never installed a geothermal heat pump system. There is a lot to learn here. I could hire it done but, I like to learn by doing. Met with an engineer today about opening thing up. We are going to drill first and check to see if this is a permanent thing or a migration. Who would of thought there was such a thing. Through soil samples they can tell. I still get to build a road with ground pounding equipment and knock down big trees like toothpicks so, my face looks like this.

Which bottles?

 

[Taboma]

Which bottles?

I'm really hoping it's not the ones that cause me to curse and threaten to hunt down the bastard who designed them

 

[Kachina26]

I'm really hoping it's not the ones that cause me to curse and threaten to hunt down the bastard who designed them

Why do you think I'm asking? I think we may have found our guy...

 

[Taboma]

Why do you think I'm asking? I think we may have found our guy...

OK, so our clues are Snow and Wet Spot up by Crater Lake --- now we know what to look for

 

[Go-Fly]

I'm really hoping it's not the ones that cause me to curse and threaten to hunt down the bastard who designed them

Why do you think I'm asking? I think we may have found our guy...

Um......yeah, that was the other guy. I have his name.

 

[Go-Fly]

Snow is an insulator. Any warmth in the ground may be enough to melt the snow. Snow melt may just be running to that area and collecting. What is the current frost depth

The frost line is 18 to 24 inches. Where I'm at, it may be a little more. They are calling for more snow at the end of the week through Christmas.

 

[ChumpChange]

Degenerate Central. 2000 + views, 25 posts....

Beyond our pay grade. Like to read about it but can’t even comprehend a question to ask.

 

[wash11]

This thread checks a bunch of boxes for me. Wonderment, possibilities, yellow iron and pissing Dave Ramsey off. I think Go-Fly and I might be related.

 

[SLT Kota]

Am I the only one that wants to put Go-Fly, 530, rrrr, Bones Fab, and monkeyswrench in a shop together to see what they would come up with? I don't know what it would be but I know I want one.

 

[callbob]

Me too but I know I couldn’t afford it whatever “it” is.

 

[4Waters]

Am I the only one that wants to put Go-Fly, 530, rrrr, Bones Fab, and monkeyswrench in a shop together to see what they would come up with? I don't know what it would be but I know I want one.

530 couldn't find his ass with both hands

 

[Bails]

Am I the only one that wants to put Go-Fly, 530, rrrr, Bones Fab, and monkeyswrench in a shop together to see what they would come up with? I don't know what it would be but I know I want one.

don't forget the mini winnie guy, Trev-something