Hey sparkies...

[rivermobster]

Other than the price...

What's the difference between these two?

Leviton 50 Amp 125/250 V NEMA 14-50R EV Charging Single Outlet/Receptacle, Black (1-Pack) 1450R R01-1450R-000 - The Home Depot

Complement the beauty and elegance of your living space by choosing this impressive Leviton EV Charging Receptacle Outlet HeavyDuty.

www.homedepot.com

Legrand Pass and Seymour 50Amp 125/250-Volt NEMA 14-50R Weather Resistant Flush Mount Single Power Outlet for RV and EV Chargers 3894WR - The Home Depot

NEMA Flush Mount Black Power Outlet from Pass & Seymour is perfect to use with copper or aluminum wiring. UL listed product.

www.homedepot.com

 

[Rayson1971]

Other than weather resistant, nothing.

 

[hallett21]

The cute little car.

I’m in the truck so I can’t see all the specs. The Nema spec is what matters. Weather Resistant is helpful for receptacle longevity.

 

[Rupp250]

I'm not a sparky but I do quite a few DIY stuff. I watch this guy's videos for a lot of lithium type information and just so happened he just posted a video on the 14-50 outlets.

 

[Sharky]

I'm not a baller. I only have a lowly Chevy Bolt. Mine might pull 32 amps. I stepped up and got the good one.

Hubbell 9450A

Don't get the POS Leviton from HD.

 

[TimeBandit]

The EV guys all say spend the bucks and get the quality one. don't go for the cheapy at home Depot or Amazon.

Reports of cheapies melting down or ruining your EV charger plug.

 

[rivermobster]

I'm not a sparky but I do quite a few DIY stuff. I watch this guy's videos for a lot of lithium type information and just so happened he just posted a video on the 14-50 outlets.

Good vid. Thanks.

 

[Sharky]

Hey RM-

Shoot me a DM. You pay the shipping and I'll give you this one. It's a Hubbell 9450A.

Had a spare. Was going to put a second outlet outside but never did.

 

[rivermobster]

Hey RM-

Shoot me a DM. You pay the shipping and I'll give you this one. It's a Hubbell 9450A.

Had a spare. Was going to put a second outlet outside but never did.

View attachment 1481590

PM shot. Thanks!

 

[Echo Lodge]

Heads up, the Hubbell has a larger diameter face compared to the Leviton. You need to buy the correct size face plate.

 

[Taboma]

Heads up, the Hubbell has a larger diameter face compared to the Leviton. You need to buy the correct size face plate.

Not only that but they're deeper as well.

 

[rivermobster]

Not only that but they're deeper as well.

Do they make new construction boxes specifically for this? Or do I need to fab something up?

 

[rrrr]

Not only that but they're deeper as well.

I believe they are more substantial to handle elevated heat from the constant load EV charger current. The Hubbell is rated at 75°C instead of the usual 60°C.

Leviton says theirs is designed to handle repeated plug insertions for corded chargers and the connection lugs have higher clamping force, with a tightening spec of 75 in/lbs.

 

[Taboma]

Do they make new construction boxes specifically for this? Or do I need to fab something up?

No need to fabricate, they make 4-11/16" deep j-boxes, which is what these receptacles are designed to mount on. It depends mostly on the application, flush in drywall, surface mount indoors, hinged cover surface mount weather proof for outdoors, There's boxes designed for each of those applications.
For surface mount indoors, like a garage I'd probably go with a 4-11/16" deep box with a raised industrial cover. That would provide plenty of depth and room for the larger #6 conductors.

 

[Echo Lodge]

My install.

 

[MPHSystems]

Do they make new construction boxes specifically for this? Or do I need to fab something up?

Use a 4sFB deep with appropriate mud ring and you will be fine. Harder to find but a 5s will give you all the room in the world. I’d have to do the math but you might even be legal with a deep nail on box


really good question.

 

[BaileyP]

Had a Electrician Install the Leviton for a Customer and it melted down luckily it didn't catch fire. Even though it's rated for 50a Customer had charger set too high pulling too much. Brand new house , Toll Brothers and they ran Aluminum Wire on the Rough in / Pre Wire then blanked it off for Owner to deal with.

Steer Clear of the Leviton !

 

[Echo Lodge]

Had a Electrician Install the Leviton for a Customer and it melted down luckily it didn't catch fire. Even though it's rated for 50a Customer had charger set too high pulling too much. Brand new house , Toll Brothers and they ran Aluminum Wire on the Rough in / Pre Wire then blanked it off for Owner to deal with.

Steer Clear of the Leviton !

I have wifi enabled smoke detectors throughout the house. I even have one in the attic. If one goes off they all go off and you get a notification on your phone.

X-Sense Smart Smoke Detectors... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B1QX23QC?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

Smoke sector above the charger

 

[hallett21]

Had a Electrician Install the Leviton for a Customer and it melted down luckily it didn't catch fire. Even though it's rated for 50a Customer had charger set too high pulling too much. Brand new house , Toll Brothers and they ran Aluminum Wire on the Rough in / Pre Wire then blanked it off for Owner to deal with.

Steer Clear of the Leviton !

lol I’ve installed quite a few 50amp Leviton’s on EV chargers. No fires.

There are certainly more stout devices but let’s not spread mis information.

Improper installation is not the manufactures fault.

 

[Taboma]

I have wifi enabled smoke detectors throughout the house. I even have one in the attic. If one goes off they all go off and you get a notification on your phone.

X-Sense Smart Smoke Detectors... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B1QX23QC?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share

Smoke sector above the charger

View attachment 1481859

Well, that's, how shall I say it gently, quite an interesting use of material choices ya got there

 

[rivermobster]

lol I’ve installed quite a few 50amp Leviton’s on EV chargers. No fires.

There are certainly more stout devices but let’s not spread mis information.

Improper installation is not the manufactures fault.

A 30amp draw needs a minimum of a 10 gauge wire, at 12v.

Not sure why it would be any different at 120v, but there should definitely at least 10 gauge wire, and maybe even 8 if the run is long.

Then, you'd need Quality breakers as well to handle that load.

I can see where most people would just add a new 50amp outlet and call it good. Freaking recipe for disaster.

Ugh.

 

[Echo Lodge]

Well, that's, how shall I say it gently, quite an interesting use of material choices ya got there

I prefer creative rather than interesting! If it can power a motorhome at 50 amps I should be good at 32 amps?

 

[Joe mama]

I have installed a shit load of the 14-50R HD cheapo’s and only recall 2 that shit the bed. The bad ones contacts lost their strength and were getting warm. Both were Tesla and the car alerted the owners of the problem. The Hubble is stout and so is the price tag, the little green car 1450 is good (time will tell)with a $40 price tag at HD.

 

[Taboma]

I prefer creative rather than interesting! If it can power a motorhome at 50 amps I should be good at 32 amps?

View attachment 1481947

Yes, you're right, "Creative" use of materials found on one's own shelves is always gratifying and I never doubted it wouldn't work just fine.

 

[rivermobster]

So now that I have my Super Yazoo outlet, thanks to @Sharky ...

If I want to limit this outlet to 40 amps...

Would I need to add 2 x 20 amp breakers?

Or...

2 x 40 amp breakers?

Will stranded 10 gauge wire be ok? Or should I go with 8 gauge?

It be a 4 to 6 ft run at best.

Thanks in advance.

 

[hallett21]

So now that I have my Super Yazoo outlet, thanks to @Sharky ...

If I want to limit this outlet to 40 amps...

Would I need to add 2 x 20 amp breakers?

Or...

2 x 40 amp breakers?

Will stranded 10 gauge wire be ok? Or should I go with 8 gauge?

It be a 4 to 6 ft run at best.

Thanks in advance.

Wire size dictates breaker size.

Sounds like what you’re asking/saying is that you would like to draw a max of 40 amps. You’ll need #6 awg wire and a 50amp breaker.

You need to size your circuit 125% of the expected load for long run times such as an EV charger. Your 40amp load needs 50amp protection and wire in laymen terms.

Edit.

Breaker is a 2 pole 240v. Which will occupy 2 spaces. Unless you get a 40,20,20,40 double tandem breaker. Or a version of that.

 

[rivermobster]

Trip to McFadendale...

6 gauge wire...

Oversize faceplate...

Dual gang box...

50amp breaker....

Everything looks correct??

Thanks in advance for the help.

 

[hallett21]

Trip to McFadendale...

6 gauge wire...

Oversize faceplate...

Dual gang box...

50amp breaker....

Everything looks correct??

Thanks in advance for the help.

View attachment 1486455

Your box is meant for romex. What are you gonna use for conduit?

 

[hallett21]

I’d just grab some 3/4” flex conduit two flex connectors (flex to box), a metal 4s box (2 gang metal box with 3/4" knock outs) and a 2 gang 1/2" or 5/8" mud ring.

Edit. Or go buy 6/3 romex from Home Depot with 1 romex connector for the panel side.

 

[Taboma]

I’d just grab some 3/4” flex conduit two flex connectors (flex to box), a metal 4s box (2 gang metal box with 3/4" knock outs) and a 2 gang 1/2" or 5/8" mud ring.

Edit. Or go buy 6/3 romex from Home Depot with 1 romex connector for the panel side.

4S sure seems small to me for # 6's and a deep Hubble 50A --- but then I'm an old school industrial sparky, sorry to interrupt, back to you sir

 

[hallett21]

4S sure seems small to me for # 6's and a deep Hubble 50A --- but then I'm an old school industrial sparky, sorry to interrupt, back to you sir

lol Trying to remember if you can get a 5 at the depot or lowes. @rivermobster in a perfect world like @Taboma said try and get a 5s box. It’s the one that’s 4 11/16ths or something like that

 

[hallett21]

4S sure seems small to me for # 6's and a deep Hubble 50A --- but then I'm an old school industrial sparky, sorry to interrupt, back to you sir

Give me a tiger grip, a uni bit and some leverage and I’ll show you a miracle lol

 

[rivermobster]

Your box is meant for romex. What are you gonna use for conduit?

Well...

Since this is all gonna be IN wall, and the panel is right next to where this plug is going to be, I wasn't to worried about it?

Figured I'd just run the wires straight into the panel (same as all the existing Romex is) and protect it all with plywood and nail plates.

Bad idea?

Nothing else is protected, so...

Lemme know. Thanks.

 

[hallett21]

Well...

Since this is all gonna be IN wall, and the panel is right next to where this plug is going to be, I wasn't to worried about it?

Figured I'd just run the wires straight into the panel (same as all the existing Romex is) and protect it all with plywood and nail plates.

Bad idea?

Nothing else is protected, so...

View attachment 1486462

Lemme know. Thanks.

The romex is protected by the rubber coating and the connector when it goes into the panel.

What you’re suggesting would be a code violation. You either need the wire you have inside of conduit or 6/3 romex.

I’m just saying what’s right, we can argue the legitimacy of romex protection as well lol.

Edit.

You’re 90% of the way there. You need a $4 box and about 20 bucks worth of conduit and connectors.

 

[rivermobster]

The romex is protected by the rubber coating and the connector when it goes into the panel.

What you’re suggesting would be a code violation. You either need the wire you have inside of conduit or 6/3 romex.

I’m just saying what’s right, we can argue the legitimacy of romex protection as well lol.

Edit.

You’re 90% of the way there. You need a $4 box and about 20 bucks worth of conduit and connectors.

I'm not concerned about a couple more bucks. At this point, this whole garage project is already Way over budget!

Here is the other issue...

There is room to run the new wires into the blue connector. But where would you I run the new conduit?

I get the "code violation" issue. I'm more concerned with the practical issue.

This will all be behind new drywall.

Your thoughts?

Edit: I just noticed the additional knock out. Doh!

 

[hallett21]

I'm not concerned about a couple more bucks. At this point, this whole garage project is already Way over budget!

Here is the other issue...

There is room to run the new wires into the blue connector. But where would you I run the new conduit?



View attachment 1486465

I get the "code violation" issue. I'm more concerned with the practical issue.

This will all be behind new drywall.

Your thoughts?

Edit: I just noticed the additional knock out. Doh!

You’d pop that knockout and your cooking.

From a practical standpoint point you don’t want those wires touching the sharp edges of the panel. Also wires vibrate/expand/contract, and who knows who could accidentally hit a wire with a screw or sawzall down the line. Which is why it needs to be in conduit/protected.

And yes 1/16” of rubber around romex makes all worries go away according to the code book lol.

 

[rivermobster]

You’d pop that knockout and your cooking.

From a practical standpoint point you don’t want those wires touching the sharp edges of the panel. Also wires vibrate/expand/contract, and who knows who could accidentally hit a wire with a screw or sawzall down the line. Which is why it needs to be in conduit/protected.

And yes 1/16” of rubber around romex makes all worries go away according to the code book lol.

Right?? Stoooooopid!!! Lol

That's why I was going to run em into the blue fitting/connector. To avoid any panel edges.

I'm gonna address this tomorrow. Thanks for input.

 

[Backlash]

@rivermobster you've got competition!!

No, this is NOT MINE!! I saw this shit on a quick Instagram video and couldn't help but screenshot it!! The panel was actually smoking in the video!

The above panel was reportedly installed by the homeowner and it was discovered by a contractor who kept overloading a circuit. When the contractor went to look at the panel, this is what he saw. To top it all off, this panel and solid work was installed in a bathroom directly above a toilet!

RM, take your time and do it right my friend.

 

[rivermobster]

@rivermobster you've got competition!!

View attachment 1486514



No, this is NOT MINE!! I saw this shit on a quick Instagram video and couldn't help but screenshot it!! The panel was actually smoking in the video!

The above panel was reportedly installed by the homeowner and it was discovered by a contractor who kept overloading a circuit. When the contractor went to look at the panel, this is what he saw. To top it all off, this panel and solid work was installed in a bathroom directly above a toilet!

RM, take your time and do it right my friend.

That's awesome. LoL!

 

[rrrr]

@rivermobster you've got competition!!

View attachment 1486514



No, this is NOT MINE!! I saw this shit on a quick Instagram video and couldn't help but screenshot it!! The panel was actually smoking in the video!

The above panel was reportedly installed by the homeowner and it was discovered by a contractor who kept overloading a circuit. When the contractor went to look at the panel, this is what he saw. To top it all off, this panel and solid work was installed in a bathroom directly above a toilet!

RM, take your time and do it right my friend.

Holy shit!

 

[CarolynandBob]

@rivermobster you've got competition!!

View attachment 1486514

No, this is NOT MINE!! I saw this shit on a quick Instagram video and couldn't help but screenshot it!! The panel was actually smoking in the video!

The above panel was reportedly installed by the homeowner and it was discovered by a contractor who kept overloading a circuit. When the contractor went to look at the panel, this is what he saw. To top it all off, this panel and solid work was installed in a bathroom directly above a toilet!

The more you look the worse it gets. Damn.

 

[Taboma]

I'm not concerned about a couple more bucks. At this point, this whole garage project is already Way over budget!

Here is the other issue...

There is room to run the new wires into the blue connector. But where would you I run the new conduit?



View attachment 1486465

I get the "code violation" issue. I'm more concerned with the practical issue.

This will all be behind new drywall.

Your thoughts?

Edit: I just noticed the additional knock out. Doh!

Please don't run those conductors without flexible conduit or using the proper NM-B (romex), this is a heavy duty application and requires proper materials and installation.
Also using that #6 thhn you purchased will offer easier receptacle termination as the finer conductor strands will conform in the box better than the thicker strands of #6 NM-B cable (Romex).

 

[rivermobster]

Please don't run those conductors without flexible conduit or using the proper NM-B (romex), this is a heavy duty application and requires proper materials and installation.
Also using that #6 thhn you purchased will offer easier receptacle termination as the finer conductor strands will conform in the box better than the thicker strands of #6 NM-B cable (Romex).

It's raining. No electrical work will be done today.

I'll put some flex over the wiring I have.

6 gauge Romex is expensive! Was almost 100 bucks for 15ft!

And as discussed...

A piece of rubber ain't gonna do jack shit.

I'm thinking metal flex conduit with be way better than over priced Romex.

 

[HNL2LHC]

@rivermobster you've got competition!!

View attachment 1486514



No, this is NOT MINE!! I saw this shit on a quick Instagram video and couldn't help but screenshot it!! The panel was actually smoking in the video!

The above panel was reportedly installed by the homeowner and it was discovered by a contractor who kept overloading a circuit. When the contractor went to look at the panel, this is what he saw. To top it all off, this panel and solid work was installed in a bathroom directly above a toilet!

RM, take your time and do it right my friend.

I don’t see an issue as there is still room to add tandem breakers……

Just looked closer…

I guess this guy didn’t have any room in his safe for all his copper to keep the tweekers away so he is storming it in the breaker panel

 

[rivermobster]

I don’t see an issue as there is still room to add tandem breakers……

Just looked closer…

View attachment 1486635


I guess this guy didn’t have any room in his safe for all his copper to keep the tweekers away so he is storming it in the breaker panel

That was the first thing I noticed.

Classic!!!

 

[Backlash]

There is SOOOO much wrong with that panel. One of my favorites is the drywall screw with wire preventing the 30amp breaker from tripping. LMAO!!

 

[HNL2LHC]

There is SOOOO much wrong with that panel. One of my favorites is the drywall screw with wire preventing the 30amp breaker from tripping. LMAO!!

LOL Didn’t see that but I might have to check my glasses but only looks like a 20 to me. If that is the case it should be good.

 

[Taboma]

It's raining. No electrical work will be done today.

I'll put some flex over the wiring I have.

6 gauge Romex is expensive! Was almost 100 bucks for 15ft!

And as discussed...

A piece of rubber ain't gonna do jack shit.

I'm thinking metal flex conduit with be way better than over priced Romex.

Young hallett21 was being a bit sarcastic with his "Rubber" comment on the #6 NM-B cable.
That outer sheathing is PVC/Nylon and is fairly tough material. Yet still it's only as good as the installation for which it's intended so long as it's installed in walls or physical abuse, with proper connectors and support. I think using the flex is an excellent idea and quality install.

 

[rivermobster]

Young hallett21 was being a bit sarcastic with his "Rubber" comment on the #6 NM-B cable.
That outer sheathing is PVC/Nylon and is fairly tough material. Yet still it's only as good as the installation for which it's intended so long as it's installed in walls or physical abuse, with proper connectors and support. I think using the flex is an excellent idea and quality install.

Sarcastic? Yes.

Accurate? Yes.

That sheathing ain't gonna protect jack shit! Lol

A drywall screw will go right through it. You know that as well as I do.

Even though this 4ft circut, will be behind drywall, I'm gonna use the flex, just so I don't have to deal with the peanut gallery!

Glad you approve.

Website work today. I'll jump back on this after the rain.

 

[Taboma]

Sarcastic? Yes.

Accurate? Yes.

That sheathing ain't gonna protect jack shit! Lol

A drywall screw will go right through it. You know that as well as I do.

Even though this 4ft circut, will be behind drywall, I'm gonna use the flex, just so I don't have to deal with the peanut gallery!

Glad you approve.

Website work today. I'll jump back on this after the rain.

Even aluminum flex can be penetrated by drywall screws and nails. This is why it's important to drill and install romex center stud, and also why they make and mandate nail plates for those that aren't.
The system as designed works fine if the codes and standards of good workmanship are followed and why I'm often hesitant to provide advise on an internet forum where the abilities of those asking aren't known.
Quite often a little information can prove dangerous.
Your case is a perfect example, you had some information, but not enough to fill in the knowledge gaps of what you didn't, or don't know.