Entegra vs Tiffin Phaeton or Allegro Bus

[702sandman]

Has anyone owned both by chance ? Just wanted to get input on quality , how they drive differently or the same , Maintenance? Etc

 

[Singleton]

I think @ONE-A-DAY had an Entegra

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

They are all high end, we have a Entegra Anthem 42. I have been a Spartan chassis guy, always preferred the ride over Freightliners. Tiffin does their own thing on chassis, never driven one. The bus gets you the big trans and big engine over the Phaeton for a big jump in price. We shopped for Tiffins and stumbled across the Anthem, the desk / office in it is what sold us, never found anything else out there like it with that feature.

They are all owned by Thor now which is troublesome. We might change to Tiffin soon since we live in Alabama now and Red Bay where the factory is only about an hour away, they apparently have great customer service and you can show up at anytime if things are not right with your rig.

Going to go to Sturgis with ours in August and then likely put up for sale, may even go 5th wheel since we dont do any off road stuff anymore and dont need to tow a trailer.

 

[fmo24]

The allegro bus is above and beyond the others. Fit finish and features. The phaeton is mid level coach. Comparable to Fleetwood discovery which we have. American coach is allegro bus level. Lots more features such as air leveling, larger tires and rims, heavier suspension. Our next coach will be an American Coach Eagle if things go as planned.

 

[702sandman]

They are all high end, we have a Entegra Anthem 42. I have been a Spartan chassis guy, always preferred the ride over Freightliners. Tiffin does their own thing on chassis, never driven one. The bus gets you the big trans and big engine over the Phaeton for a big jump in price. We shopped for Tiffins and stumbled across the Anthem, the desk / office in it is what sold us, never found anything else out there like it with that feature.

They are all owned by Thor now which is troublesome. We might change to Tiffin soon since we live in Alabama now and Red Bay where the factory is only about an hour away, they apparently have great customer service and you can show up at anytime if things are not right with your rig.

Going to go to Sturgis with ours in August and then likely put up for sale, may even go 5th wheel since we dont do any off road stuff anymore and dont need to tow a trailer.
View attachment 1121822

We really like the Anthem 42RBQ layout. I’ve had fleetwoods since 2004 and they are a good all around motorhome for a good price but it’s time now to step up to that next level and I see a ton of Phaetons on the road and a lot of entegras also. So Im Starting my search between those 3. The wife says it has to have the bath and half. I need 3 ac’s and prefer the couches and couch dinette set up he best. We always have people in ours now so we want maximum seating room. How has your entegra held up so far Walt ? Any let downs ? Or issues ?

 

[Done-it-again]

My father has an allegro bus 42. This was when I was driving it back from Atlanta for him.

It’s been a great coach, night and day from the Monaco diplomat that he had. But it’s hard to compare as the Monaco wasn’t a tag. The tag makes driving that much better in all conditions.

If looking at new Allegro’s there has been issues since Thor took them over. I would look at pre thor years. They next level above the Allegro Bus is Zephyr

 

[Done-it-again]

As with any RV they have issues. Tiffan did have “wet” bay problems when water got to the slide and damaged the floors.

As Walt has said, Red bay is great and if the factory won’t get it it done cause out of warranty they have all the subs that do the work their too. From new custom cabinets, re paint, slides repair, body work, electronics, etc.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

We really like the Anthem 42RBQ layout. I’ve had fleetwoods since 2004 and they are a good all around motorhome for a good price but it’s time now to step up to that next level and I see a ton of Phaetons on the road and a lot of entegras also. So Im Starting my search between those 3. The wife says it has to have the bath and half. I need 3 ac’s and prefer the couches and couch dinette set up he best. We always have people in ours now so we want maximum seating room. How has your entegra held up so far Walt ? Any let downs ? Or issues ?


View attachment 1121907

We are very happy with it, it’s a 42 RBQ, we were thinking of putting it up for sale. We don’t use it as much now that we live on a lake, spend a lot of time in our backyard these days so I think we will downsize. It’s a big coach but really only for two people, ours has the desk and office set up instead of a pull out couch, it’s perfect for me to work, I have a desktop Mac, a printer and scanner in the cabinets ober the desk, file cabinet etc., but if you have kids or guests that stay over it won’t work well since it really only sleeps two.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

 

[702sandman]

View attachment 1121923 View attachment 1121924

looks beautiful. Perfect set up for the 2 of you. I haven’t seen that layout yet

 

[the lynch mob]

We own a 2018 Newmar Dutch star. FullTimed for almost 5 yrs. Newmar has backed their product and fixed things way out of warranty period for free. I would consider Entegra too. Tiffin I don’t feel are what they once were now that Bob Tiffin is gone. He was their best asset.

 

[RCDave]

Allegro Bus! Side radiator, Huck bolted frame. Spartan Chassis. Big block Cummins diesel

 

[JLG614]

A friend of mine had a badass tiffin Zephyr. Beautiful coach, he really liked it but recently sold it and went with a new entegra, not sure which model he bought. He loves the entegra but I've heard they have electrical issues. Not surprising because everything in the newer coaches are run off of screens. Another friend of ours bought a brand new Newmar Ventana. That coach is beautiful and has only had minor issues. If i was stepping up to those high end coaches i would definitely be looking at newmar, I think they are a step above everyone. And they are owned by Winnebago which i would say is better than thor

 

[Riverhound]

Looked at all of them before we bought our Country Coach. Loved the Phateon but it only comes in a rear radiator configuration which is a major pain in the a$$ from a maintenance perspective. Allegro Bus was a significant step up in $$$ with better fit and finish, bigger/better drivetrain, etc. Talked with the owners of both models and didn't get any major negative feedback, outside of normal annoyances. Entegra was really nice as well but didn't get an opportunity to speak with any owners so I don't have any constructive feedback.

IRV2 website was a good resource for us during our search with lots of good info.

Although there are some tag axle Phaetons, they're generally going to be a 2 axle unit. Allegro Bus and Entegra are going to be tag axle units which are going to be more stable to drive. I would personally stay away from rear radiator units.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

The big issue over the last few years was DEF heads. Coaches were stranded all over the country for months while the new heads were backordered during Covid, not sure if that has passed. If I was to do it again I would by a pre-DEF Fleetwood Revolution 42K tag. Same spartan chassis as the American Revolution, they are actualy built side by side, same floor plans, just higher end finishes and bigger engines in the American Revolution and a few hundred k more. We had a 40E bath and half with the CAT 400 and it was a great coach, convinced me to always go Spartan chassis. 42K has a big desk set up in it, great for remote work, the only other coach I have found that has that set up.

Other option would be a pre-DEF Country Coach, things are built like a tank.

 

[spark2678]

We have a 2011 American Coach that we purchased about 3 months ago and love it so far. Few issues and kinks to work out when we bought it but we have had (3) previous RV's and they have all had their issues.

 

[EmpirE231]

First you gotta decide if you want big block power... If so... that cancels out the phaeton. I believe the phaetons in certain years were available with bigger power, but they are rare and no side radiator. Entegra is a brand, but the model most comparable to a tiffin allegro bus is the anthem. Both very nice and very similar coaches... just need to find the colors / floor plans that you like. At that level, I would also look at newmar dutch stars, also check out American coach.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I will be listing our 2014 Anthem 42 QRB 1.5 bath at $230k shortly. Gonna go with a toyhauler to haul the Harleys, dont need the big rig now since we dont tow a trailer to the desert anymore, and its just my wife and I. That and the nearest indoor storage that will fit 45 feet is almost 2 hours away, making things a real PITA.

 

[wallnutz]

If you go with Entegra buy an older one. Two good friends of mine both have ‘22s and they have been complete shit. All kinds of electrical problems, one of them almost burned when the batteries over charged due to bad wiring. They both have been in the shop longer than they have been at home.
if I was looking at new Newmar would be on top of my list, then Tiffin. Even though Tiffin was bought by Thor they still have their core guys running it.

 

[fmo24]

First you gotta decide if you want big block power... If so... that cancels out the phaeton. I believe the phaetons in certain years were available with bigger power, but they are rare and no side radiator. Entegra is a brand, but the model most comparable to a tiffin allegro bus is the anthem. Both very nice and very similar coaches... just need to find the colors / floor plans that you like. At that level, I would also look at newmar dutch stars, also check out American coach.

There is big block and bigger block. Most Tiffins come with 9 liter Cummins 400-450 horse. Have to order a bus with the 15 liter 600 horse. That’s why I like the upper end American Coach. Most if not all have the 600 horse 15 liter. My discovery LXE has the 9 liter but 380 hp 1250 tq. Tows our F150 with a golf cart fine. 600 hp would be nice but none of them are race cars. You can flash the 380 hp to 400 or 450 but no gain in tq so I have not really given serious consideration to re flashing mine

 

[Singleton]

If you go with Entegra buy an older one. Two good friends of mine both have ‘22s and they have been complete shit. All kinds of electrical problems, one of them almost burned when the batteries over charged due to bad wiring. They both have been in the shop longer than they have been at home.
if I was looking at new Newmar would be on top of my list, then Tiffin. Even though Tiffin was bought by Thor they still have their core guys running it.

2020 to 2022 RV are no bueno. Companies were cutting corners to meet demand.
I think 2023 models will be safe again, since demand is falling

 

[greg shirley]

Agree with the newer Entegras. Looked at a Cornerstone and liked it till we saw all the recalls on the DOT website. Stayed away. Settled for an Eagle which is great. Cant beat a Foretravel IMO

 

[Mcob25rg]

22 Tiffin, waited 7 months for it, TONS of issues - some big, some small. Wouldn’t do it again. ZERO QUALITY CONTROL

 

[EmpirE231]

There is big block and bigger block. Most Tiffins come with 9 liter Cummins 400-450 horse. Have to order a bus with the 15 liter 600 horse. That’s why I like the upper end American Coach. Most if not all have the 600 horse 15 liter. My discovery LXE has the 9 liter but 380 hp 1250 tq. Tows our F150 with a golf cart fine. 600 hp would be nice but none of them are race cars. You can flash the 380 hp to 400 or 450 but no gain in tq so I have not really given serious consideration to re flashing mine

I thought the 380hp Cummins did 1050tq.

I was mainly referring to the Cummins 450 which is at 1250lbs torque. Game changer when towing heavy compared to some of the smaller motors found in discovery’s / phaetons etc.

 

[702sandman]

First you gotta decide if you want big block power... If so... that cancels out the phaeton. I believe the phaetons in certain years were available with bigger power, but they are rare and no side radiator. Entegra is a brand, but the model most comparable to a tiffin allegro bus is the anthem. Both very nice and very similar coaches... just need to find the colors / floor plans that you like. At that level, I would also look at newmar dutch stars, also check out American coach.

What is the big block ? I’ve only ever had the caterpillar 330 or 350 Hp ? And what I seem to like so far the most is the Anthem 42RBQ 2015 model that has a 450 isl Cummings, is that a big block ? also is that a def unit or pre def ? I’m looking at one in Cali this weekend. I really really like the newer 21/22 allegro bus but I don’t want to spend 400K. I’m looking at coaches under 250k

 

[Dan Lorenze]

22 Tiffin, waited 7 months for it, TONS of issues - some big, some small. Wouldn’t do it again. ZERO QUALITY CONTROL

My buddy bought a new Tiffin last year, it’s an Allegro Red,he had a ton of issues with it, he had to drive it back to Alabama to get all the issues worked out. He said he had to wait in a big line to get everything fixed. Lots of quality control issues..

 

[Mcob25rg]

I’m going in October. Taking car so wife/we can leave and come back. Thinking it’s going to take 2-3 weeks waiting to get it close to OK. I want to go myself - already frustrated as he%@, I know she’ll be crazy if it really takes that long. Tiffin said ”bring it back, we’ll make it right”. That’s 1,500 miles round trip ( $5.25 x 150=$850 ), food, and time to get the “free warranty “ work done, not to mention you’re in no man’s land the whole time.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

What is the big block ? I’ve only ever had the caterpillar 330 or 350 Hp ? And what I seem to like so far the most is the Anthem 42RBQ 2015 model that has a 450 isl Cummings, is that a big block ? also is that a def unit or pre def ? I’m looking at one in Cali this weekend. I really really like the newer 21/22 allegro bus but I don’t want to spend 400K. I’m looking at coaches under 250k

Our 14 is DEF, think it started in 12, and as mentioned I wouldn’t buy any DP new these days. Would like to sell ours, decided to list it today. Some pics a few posts up.

 

[702sandman]

Our 14 is DEF, think it started in 12, and as mentioned I wouldn’t buy any DP new these days. Would like to sell ours, decided to list it today. Some pics a few posts up.

I would be all over yours Walt but the desk doesn’t work for us.

 

[ONE-A-DAY]

I would be all over yours Walt but the desk doesn’t work for us.

That’s the drawback of it, no pull out bed in the living area. We improvised and put a queen sized air bed on the floor if our kids come and stay for a few days. This design also encourages them to leave after a few days

 

[spark2678]

Mines the AC tag up top, has a 450, weighs in at 45Klbs. Towing a triple axle 24' haulmark stacker at around 15K lbs loaded I can only go up the steeper grades at 35-40mph. Most standard smaller grades I can do 45-50. They are still not rocketships. I had a Discovery with a 330cat and although the rig handles the stacker night and day better, basically I traded more weight for more HP so didn't gain much.

 

[702sandman]

My 06 fleetwood with a 330 cat would out pull my buddies revolution with a 400 Cummins with identical trailers. His was like 10-12k heavier. I’ve always heard the cats pull better than the Cummins

 

[BRONCOBOY]

I'm going thru the same process, time to upgrade. from what I understand in 2015 they have a new DEF head which also measures the quality of the DEF in the system. These seam to be have the most issues with DEF head failures and I'm not sure they have the replacement DEF heads improved yet. Really like the looks and improvements in the 2015 Entegra Anthem, lots of bang for the buck. waiting but right now its hard to let my Beaver go.

 

[EmpirE231]

What is the big block ? I’ve only ever had the caterpillar 330 or 350 Hp ? And what I seem to like so far the most is the Anthem 42RBQ 2015 model that has a 450 isl Cummings, is that a big block ? also is that a def unit or pre def ? I’m looking at one in Cali this weekend. I really really like the newer 21/22 allegro bus but I don’t want to spend 400K. I’m looking at coaches under 250k

Yep the ISL 450 is considered bug block power. 450hp/1250tq. Vs something like the 330 cat C7 with 860ish tq if I remember correctly.

You can get it both, DEF / pre DEF. at the end of the day DEF sucks... but is what it is if you want anything 2010 and newer. DEF heads were more prone to going out in models 2015 and newer, as those have more sensors and BS to go wrong. My current rig is a 2011 and granted, I somehow got lucky with a DEF head failure... they are supposed to be rare on these model years....

 

[EmpirE231]

My 06 fleetwood with a 330 cat would out pull my buddies revolution with a 400 Cummins with identical trailers. His was like 10-12k heavier. I’ve always heard the cats pull better than the Cummins

My last coach was a 2007 discovery with the C7 / 330. Once I started towing heavy... it was a DOG up any grades. Did fine on the flats... but I was hating it. For the record it did fine with a loaded down flat bed (sand car, quads etc). Also did well with a large enclosed.... but as soon as I went stacker... it felt like a damn boat anchor back there.

Current coach is a 2011 American coach revolution tag axle with the 450 Cummins. Power is very noticeable. On the flats I can’t even tell the trailer is there, on grades I’m pulling at non embarrassing speeds LOL. Also the motor is so much quieter... I wasn’t expecting that. Not sure if it’s the tag or the extra weight... but talk about super stable and easy to drive. Needless to say with the change in power and handling I was smiling the whole time on our first Glamis trip driving the thing.

I thought the discovery was a game changer when I got it (had a 34’ gasser previous) and didn’t think it could get that much better? But man it totally did.

Also my buddy with an older revolution cat c9 walked by me up grades when we were coming back from dumont. All depends on how you carry momentum into the grade and drop to the right gear etc. maybe your buddy just had it set and cruising because I’d be surprised that with similar weight, it wouldn’t pull you on grades.

 

[Sleek-Jet]

We own a 2018 Newmar Dutch star. FullTimed for almost 5 yrs. Newmar has backed their product and fixed things way out of warranty period for free. I would consider Entegra too. Tiffin I don’t feel are what they once were now that Bob Tiffin is gone. He was their best asset.

Newmar would be on my list...