Cops, Fire Fighters, Teachers, etc. - Social Security - WEP/GPO Repeal.

[BoatCop]

It looks like those two rip-off laws, WEP (Windfall Elimination Provision) and GPO (Government Pension Offset) will be repealed. Passed House and Senate and just waiting on Pedo Joe's scribble. For those than don't know, WEP was put in effect in 1974. What it does is reduce the Social Security payment for people who worked in public agency jobs (Police, Firefighters, Teachers, etc) and have a pension from those positions, but didn't pay into SS for THAT job. A lot of us had other jobs, before, during, or after the Public Service job, where we, and our employers, DID pay into SS. The GPO, also enacted in 1974, affects surviving spouses, and their ability to collect their deceased spouses SS. Whatever SS we would have received from our spouse would be reduced, dollar for dollar, by whatever Public Pension we receive.

In my case, I worked in SS paying jobs, 1971 through 1988. Part time (Coast Guard Reserve) 1988 through 2002. If those were the ONLY jobs I had, I would have received around $875 a month in SS, based on my earnings from those jobs. BUT, since I also worked for the County and participated in the State Public Safety Retirement system, 1989-2015 (not paying into SS), my SS payment was reduced by nearly 2/3 to $350 bucks a month. But now that it looks like the WEP will be repealed, my current SS payment will go from (now) $438 to around $1,050. Not a whole lot, but the increase will cover a car payment.

As far as the GPO, the wife is pulling down around $2k in her SS, which if she (God forbid) gets planted first, that amount can be transferred to me, in place of my SS. She wouldn't get mine of I go first, as hers is so much more. Before this repeal, I wouldn't receive anything from her SS.

If the law gets signed, it will make the increase retroactive to "after December 2023", and apply to all SS payments from January 2024. I'm pretty sure there are a bunch on here that this will affect. If not now, then maybe later when they DO retire.

 

[angiebaby]

I had a colleague when I was teaching, she was in her late 30s and her husband passed away suddenly. Because she was teaching, she could not get his SS because of what her pension will be at a future date. Perhaps it was just a reduced amount, but I'm pretty sure she said she couldn't get any of it. She had two teenage kids who got some of his SS, which helped. That was my first couple of years teaching. So I went and got a good chunk of life insurance, but that still doesn't make it right. She was entitled to her survivor benefits that he had paid in to.

I worked for 18 years in the grocery store before I taught for 15. I'm happy to hear this passed overwhelmingly. Not sure how they are going to fix SS by the time we draw, but I'm still glad this passed. The year we are expected to draw is the year it is supposed to break. About 10 years from now.

 

[havasujeeper]

You can calculate what is owed back to you on the Social Security site. The max taken and the max to be refunded i believe is $587 a month. I've spoken to 40 retired Cal cops and half say this is retro to Jan. 2024
The other half says there is no retro at all due to an earlier change to the bill.
I know I'm due $587 a month, and so is my other half. I'll take it. Now if Trump follows through with his promise to exempt SS from taxes, this would be golden.

 

[Sherpa]

this is coming just in time for my family....... although I will only have 6 years in a pension plan, 99% of my bennies are in SSI........

--Sherpa

 

[C-2]

i worked private sector between 1984 -2017, but I'm still on the edge of falling under the WEP exemption due to me having several non-qualifying income years.

Interesting. I am being pressured to move into management, and the only reason I would do so is to chalk up a couple more years of qualifying income to secure my exemption before I retire (in another 10-12 years lol) Management is a regular position with SS taken out of the pay...so sans that issue, I'll pass on the promotion.

Thanks for the heads-up.

 

[Orange Juice]

They’ll use this excuse to push the S.S. Retirement age to 70-75.

 

[Dunerking]

So those careers didn’t pay into SS? If they didn’t pay into SSI why would people receive SS payments?
I’m just asking as I’m in the private sector and get taxed heavily,but also been told to not expect to receive SS because the mismanagement will have exhausted the funds by the time I’m able to receive any funds..this is why I started a Roth IRA at 24 and add that to my pension maybe I’ll be to enjoy life after 44 years of working. Hopefully my physical health will allow me to still enjoy life.

 

[jesco]

They’ll use this excuse to push the S.S. Retirement age to 70-75.

THIS!! I don't think S.S. will ever go away, but my guess is they just kick the "age of retirement" can further and further down the road.

 

[BabyRay]

They’ll use this excuse to push the S.S. Retirement age to 70-75.

It wont be pushed out that far, but changes have to be made, as the current trend is unsustainable. My guess is it’ll be a combination of raising the age and lowering the benefits. Hopefully they’ll do something soon, as the longer it’s kicked down the road, the worse the changes will be. Problem is, no politician wants to be seen touching it.

 

[CLCookie]

SS will be defunct in future years, when are they going to fund SS with the proper money? On top of them raising the retirement age to stop the bleeding, I don't expect much in SS in the next 10 years.

 

[C-2]

So those careers didn’t pay into SS? If they didn’t pay into SSI why would people receive SS payments?
I’m just asking as I’m in the private sector and get taxed heavily,but also been told to not expect to receive SS because the mismanagement will have exhausted the funds by the time I’m able to receive any funds..this is why I started a Roth IRA at 24 and add that to my pension maybe I’ll be to enjoy life after 44 years of working. Hopefully my physical health will allow me to still enjoy life.

A high level overview is:

Some people worked in the private sector and paid into SS.

Then they went to work in public education, or in public safety, and in most of those positions, SS is not withheld since the worker contributes to a defined pension plan or something similar.

Even though the worker contributed to SSA in the private sector, WEP reduced the amount of SS benefits a worker received upon retirement.

It appears the repeal of WEP will restore the entire SS benefit the worker was entitled to.

 

[BoatCop]

So those careers didn’t pay into SS? If they didn’t pay into SSI why would people receive SS payments?
I’m just asking as I’m in the private sector and get taxed heavily,but also been told to not expect to receive SS because the mismanagement will have exhausted the funds by the time I’m able to receive any funds..this is why I started a Roth IRA at 24 and add that to my pension maybe I’ll be to enjoy life after 44 years of working. Hopefully my physical health will allow me to still enjoy life.

This isn't for people who didn't pay anything into SS. It's for those, like me, who paid into SS for 1/2 my adult life, but the SS I paid for and am entitled to, has been cut by almost 2/3. If I never worked at the Public Retirement job, and got SS based only on the jobs I paid into SS, I would have received around $850 a month. But ONLY because I worked at a career that DIDN'T pay into SS, my EARNED SS payment was cut to $350.

We don't want want anything more than we earned, paid into and deserve.

 

[BoatCop]

THIS!! I don't think S.S. will ever go away, but my guess is they just kick the "age of retirement" can further and further down the road.

The retirement age wouldn't go up for those currently working. The age of retirement is based on year of birth. The full retirement age for Social Security benefits in the U.S. is 67 for those born in 1960 or later, while it is 66 for individuals born between 1943 and 1954, with a gradual increase for those born between 1955 and 1959. It hasn't increased in 64 years. While the life expectancy in 1960 was 69.6 years, it's now (2024) 79.2 years. The SS age of retirement should have been increasing right along with the life expectancy.

No matter what, it's a Ponzi Scheme that would make Bernie Madoff blush. As an example of how ludicrous it is, the first person to collect SS benefits was a woman who paid a total of $24.75 into SS, but collected $22,888.92. The system is not sustainable. If it had been established like a 401K, Mutual Fund, or otherwise based on stock market returns, career workers would be retiring as millionaires.

 

[C_J_J_C]

So those careers didn’t pay into SS? If they didn’t pay into SSI why would people receive SS payments?
I’m just asking as I’m in the private sector and get taxed heavily,but also been told to not expect to receive SS because the mismanagement will have exhausted the funds by the time I’m able to receive any funds..this is why I started a Roth IRA at 24 and add that to my pension maybe I’ll be to enjoy life after 44 years of working. Hopefully my physical health will allow me to still enjoy life.

Some jobs, mainly public sector jobs AKA government jobs, do not pay into SS but to not pay into social security they must have mandatory private pensions. They do not pay into social security nor to they receive social security benifits... Side note: They are still forced to still pay into Medicare even though many have retirement healthcare.

This change has to do only with people who paid into Social Security for 10+ years (40 credits) either before, after, or possibly even at the same time as they earned a private pention.

THEY DID PAY SOCIAL SECURITY TAXES just like everyone else but because they had a private pention they were either not given or given only a small percentage of what they earned.

I never understood forcing someone pay into social security until they earned it and then telling them because they also earned something else they couldn't have it. I welcome the CORRECTION / Change.

 

[PRIMO]

It is the Talk of the Town Right Now !
Looking Back from my youth / if I took the same funds and Established a money Market account / 50 years later I am living in Malibu
with a great income from PERS after 30 years of service with the FD......

Social Security is a Ponzi Scheme !

 

[Dunerking]

I’d personally rather not have to pay into SS and have the ability to invest that money in a better payout

 

[Bobby V]

I’d personally rather not have to pay into SS and have the ability to invest that money in a better payout

I worked from 1977-2023. According to SSA.GOV I paid $205,907 into SS and $49,902 into Medicare. My employers paid $209,494 into SS and $49,991 into Medicare Next year with the 2.5% raise my monthly will be about $2,820. Should be about 6 years until I'm even with SS.

 

[BajaT]

I’d personally rather not have to pay into SS and have the ability to invest that money in a better payout

This. Problem is, people take the money not paid into social security and spend it on toys!

 

[boatpi]

Long overdue. Everyone that paid a lot of Social Security has been getting the screw job for many years. I’m still working in paying thousands a year and yet my benefit although it’s not gonna change my life at all is a measly $675. They basically depreciated my benefits by 70%.

 

[dribble]

I had 27 years of SS earnings and about 10 in safety. This will get me about 100-150 bucks. I'll take it.

 

[BabyRay]

The retirement age wouldn't go up for those currently working. The age of retirement is based on year of birth. The full retirement age for Social Security benefits in the U.S. is 67 for those born in 1960 or later, while it is 66 for individuals born between 1943 and 1954, with a gradual increase for those born between 1955 and 1959. It hasn't increased in 64 years. While the life expectancy in 1960 was 69.6 years, it's now (2024) 79.2 years. The SS age of retirement should have been increasing right along with the life expectancy.

No matter what, it's a Ponzi Scheme that would make Bernie Madoff blush. As an example of how ludicrous it is, the first person to collect SS benefits was a woman who paid a total of $24.75 into SS, but collected $22,888.92. The system is not sustainable. If it had been established like a 401K, Mutual Fund, or otherwise based on stock market returns, career workers would be retiring as millionaires.

Some people are drawing SS amounts equal to being a millionaire. If a person starts drawing at age 70, and has earned the maximum, they’re getting $58k+ annually. Applying the 4% rule, they’d need savings/investments of $1.46M+ to earn the same.

But, yes, it’s definitely a Ponzi scheme.

 

[shockwave714]

Senate passes Social Security Fairness Act, a major victory for public service workers

The repeal of GPO-WEP provisions from Social Security is at long last becoming a reality.

www.afscme.org

 

[Sharky]

This is exactly what those of us that have worked both public & private sector jobs need!!

If you have been a teacher, firefighter, cop, gov employee all your life. . . nothing special for you. You got your pension. You don't get anything more from SS.

9 days to retirement. Paid into SS for 20+ years private. 26 years public sector with a generous pension. This is going to be very nice for me. Almost another $1000 a month.

Of corse, that means I'm going to have to pay more taxes. . . .

 

[shockwave714]

Once it is signed, do we know when it will go into effect also, I believe I read it will be retroactive to Dec 2023

 

[C_J_J_C]

Ha....since I have a pension and I am still a few years from 62 I never looked.
I just checked and I have 38 of the 40 Social Security credits needed. I guess I need to go back to work for what.... maybe 2 weeks in 2 different quarters.

 

[DarkHorseRacing]

This is exactly what those of us that have worked both public & private sector jobs need!!

If you have been a teacher, firefighter, cop, gov employee all your life. . . nothing special for you. You got your pension. You don't get anything more from SS.

9 days to retirement. Paid into SS for 20+ years private. 26 years public sector with a generous pension. This is going to be very nice for me. Almost another $1000 a month.

Of corse, that means I'm going to have to pay more taxes. . . .

You could move to a state that doesn't tax retirement.

 

[Jay Dub]

This is an long overdue change. My wife is in the same boat. Was a teacher, now a pricipal. Credits before and will have credits post retirement. She is also entitled to spousal SS benefits but prior to this change she was only allowed "greater of". Public pension or spousal benefits.

 

[Paradox]

Soo.. both my wife and I have maxed out payments into the SS system for at least two decades and have paid in for 40 years plus each. This is on top of our respective enployer’s matching pay ins on our behalf.

She’ll be 63 next month and I’ll be 65 in two months. If we both take it in March, the combined payment (even though it’s early) is about $6,000 a month.

I had planned on waiting until 70 for mine (since the surviving spouse gets the higher payout) however, based on the dicey-ness of its future funding and the likelihood it will be changing in some fashion, I think we’re just going to go ahead and take both.

We’re fortunate that it will not represent our sole income however, I’m sure there are folks out there that really need to rely on it and are currently in the same decision making process.

 

[Bobby V]

Soo.. both my wife and I have maxed out payments into the SS system for at least two decades and have paid in for 40 years plus each. This is on top of our respective enployer’s matching pay ins on our behalf.

She’ll be 63 next month and I’ll be 65 in two months. If we both take it in March, the combined payment (even though it’s early) is about $6,000 a month.

I had planned on waiting until 70 for mine (since the surviving spouse gets the higher payout) however, based on the dicey-ness of its future funding and the likelihood it will be changing in some fashion, I think we’re just going to go ahead and take both.

We’re fortunate that it will not represent our sole income however, I’m sure there are folks out there that really need to rely on it and are currently in the same decision making process.

You do know if you are still working you can only make a certain amount without being penalized unless you have meet FRA. For me at 64 it’s about 22k a year.

 

[Sharky]

You could move to a state that doesn't tax retirement.

Oh, trust me. . . . I have been looking. Real hard!!!

Wyoming, South Dakota, Nevada, Tennessee.. . . few others.

And some of those don't have state income tax. Or tax retirement/ pensions/etc. I would take my state of Colorado pension (PERA), move to Wyoming and say FUCK YOU to Colorado. 5th generation CO native who is ready to leave. Fucking lefties ruined my state.

I'm taxed and "fee" to the hilt out here. Just renewing my trailer plates for the trailer I haul my RZR on. The "fees" are more than the registration.

Let all the fucking lefties that moved to this state and ruined it pay me and, not get a fucking dime in return.

Trailer registration in CO- Single axle. 12 foot trailer.

base- $9.89 Fees- $35.69

 

[Bobby V]

Oh, trust me. . . . I have been looking. Real hard!!!

Wyoming, South Dakota, Nevada, Tennessee.. . . few others.

And some of those don't have state income tax. Or tax retirement/ pensions/etc. I would take my state of Colorado pension (PERA), move to Wyoming and say FUCK YOU to Colorado. 5th generation CO native who is ready to leave. Fucking lefties ruined my state.

I'm taxed and "fee" to the hilt out here. Just renewing my trailer plates for the trailer I haul my RZR on. The "fees" are more than the registration.

Let all the fucking lefties that moved to this state and ruined it pay me and, not get a fucking dime in return.

Trailer registration in CO- Single axle. 12 foot trailer.

base- $9.89 Fees- $35.69

Does the new tax code apply to you.? https://states.aarp.org/colorado/social-security-income-tax-exemption

 

[Paradox]

You do know if you are still working you can only make a certain amount without being penalized unless you have meet FRA. For me at 64 it’s about 22k a year.

I’m likely retiring in March or April. My wife has already been retired for over a year.

 

[Paradox]

Oh, trust me. . . . I have been looking. Real hard!!!

Wyoming, South Dakota, Nevada, Tennessee.. . . few others.

And some of those don't have state income tax. Or tax retirement/ pensions/etc. I would take my state of Colorado pension (PERA), move to Wyoming and say FUCK YOU to Colorado. 5th generation CO native who is ready to leave. Fucking lefties ruined my state.

I'm taxed and "fee" to the hilt out here. Just renewing my trailer plates for the trailer I haul my RZR on. The "fees" are more than the registration.

Let all the fucking lefties that moved to this state and ruined it pay me and, not get a fucking dime in return.

Trailer registration in CO- Single axle. 12 foot trailer.

base- $9.89 Fees- $35.69

Good for you. I’m a 4th generation Angeleno and am a 4th generation Contractor license holder. My Great Grand Father was a plumber in Alhambra in the 1920s. I actually have his 3 digit licenses.

I can’t wait to get the fuck out of California.

 

[havasujeeper]

Kennedy explains the WEP pretty well.

 

[Mr. C]

It wont be pushed out that far, but changes have to be made, as the current trend is unsustainable. My guess is it’ll be a combination of raising the age and lowering the benefits. Hopefully they’ll do something soon, as the longer it’s kicked down the road, the worse the changes will be. Problem is, no politician wants to be seen touching it.

Haha. Touching it?
They’ve been stealing from it for decades like it’s some sort tax for them to use as they see fit.
It’s been fucking theft plain and simple.
If even invested in a safe mild type investment. It would’ve been very lucrative. Jmho.

 

[BabyRay]

Haha. Touching it?
They’ve been stealing from it for decades like it’s some sort tax for them to use as they see fit.
It’s been fucking theft plain and simple.
If even invested in a safe mild type investment. It would’ve been very lucrative. Jmho.

True!

People only pay attention if their benefits are openly threatened with being cut or delayed. The public is mostly ignorant of government borrowing from the trust fund. Not being fully funded must be because they’re not taxing workers enough, right?

 

[Mr. C]

True!

People only pay attention if their benefits are openly threatened with being cut or delayed. The public is mostly ignorant of government borrowing from the trust fund. Not being fully funded must be because they’re not taxing workers enough, right?

Borrowing ???
Stealing is more the word.

Better yet the current fucked up administration calls this an entitlement. Fucking scumbags.

 

[C-2]

I just pulled my SS benefit calculation and it says I am full vested with the 40 required credits. Because of WEP, my monthly benefit would have been reduced by $587/mo. (33 years private/self-employed, and 7 years State safety, and still working).

But I also believe I would have been exempt and received 90% of my SS for having 30 years of "substantial earnings." https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10045.pdf

Because of the repeal, I will receive my full SS of $1,941 at 67 or $2400 at 70.

But I am a post-pension reform employee, so my pension will never be that great.

 

[C-2]

BTW, download that WEP chart since it may go bye bye pretty soon.

 

[Sharky]

Does the new tax code apply to you.? https://states.aarp.org/colorado/social-security-income-tax-exemption

No. Wife & I are not 65 yet. Couple more years.

And in the future, it won't either. Especially if the WEP is repealed.

Wife does pretty well on her savings & investments. She has not worked the last 5 years and also will have a pension from a former employer. She will also reap the rewards of the repeal of the WEP.

Colorado will get its 4.4% Sales tax where I live is almost 8%. Last year, our property taxes went up 47%.

And then add on the "fees" Vehicle registration, utilities, delivery fees, etc, etc.

I'm ready to leave.

 

[BHC Vic]

I’m not a fan of this… my plan is to retire from my union and then go get a calpers job to cover medical. SS isn’t even a part of my plan.

 

[havasujeeper]

So I just received the notification that my social security monthly payment increased 2 1/2% due to my Cost of Living Adjustment. Due to my Medicare cost climbing 10%, my net gain this year is $11 a month. Boy, I need that WEP to be signed by Biden soon!

 

[BoatCop]

So I just received the notification that my social security monthly payment increased 2 1/2% due to my Cost of Living Adjustment. Due to my Medicare cost climbing 10%, my net gain this year is $11 a month. Boy, I need that WEP to be signed by Biden soon!

I think it'll take a while to program the changes, after Pedo Joe signs it. I would guess that we won't see anything until Feb or March. You would think that it would only take a simple key entry "Delete all WEP reduction!", but since it's the Govt, they'll probably need to reconfigure the whole damn payment system. Plus, the fact that over 80% of Social Security Administration employees are "teleworking" from home, while Biden just agreed with their union to continue the work from home scam until 2029. Trump will correct that, so expect to hear about SSA being "short handed", due to those quitting over having to actually go to work.

The good part is, that it will be retroactive to January 2024. Not life-changing money, but who's gonna complain when they throw $6 - $7k at you.

 

[Cooter01]

This will be great!

I know many teachers who worked during summers and had SS taken out, yet when the retired they got the shaft. I hope this comes through sooner than later.

 

[phuggit]

Now if this would pass.

H.R.6030 - Expanding Health Care Options for First Responders Act​

 

[spectra3279]

SS will be defunct in future years, when are they going to fund SS with the proper money? On top of them raising the retirement age to stop the bleeding, I don't expect much in SS in the next 10 years.

When are they gonna pay back the money they borrowed, think it's over 5 trillion. Not including the interest

 

[boatpi]

This would greatly effect two income SS contributors in a huge way, no spousal offset. I should be receiving about $2,200, but I receive $640 now and still paying into the system as I am an employee.

 

[havasujeeper]

Day 3, but yet Biden has yet to sign the bill.