Canada tariffs? What about can ams!

[Sportin' Wood]

That is exactly my point.

Individuals are simply doing what individuals do, trying to improve their individual lives regardless of whether they are a consumer or a producer.

This isn’t anyone taking advantage of us that needs government intervention, it is natural free market behavior by each individual participant.

I disagree.
IMHO publicly traded corporations take every advantage they can get if allowed.

There are layers of complexity that move under the surface in regards to manufacturing. We are not talking about a family trip to Dollar General to buy cheap ass crap. There are lots of offshoring projects that close American factories in favor of additional margin outside our borders. Often the human element is disregarded, in favor of squeezing an extra couple EBIT points for shareholders. There are plenty of examples of unfavorable working and living conditions in the third world factories.

The box anchor is a great example. Crazy that it is cheaper to import that. Just in Time manufacturing vs tying up cash flow and working capital for international bulk shipments, and warehousing. Seems more like a path of least resistance as opposed to finding a stateside partner to manufacture it. Plus, I bet the overseas manufacture knocks it off if asked by an Amazon seller.

My position on tariffs run counter to my generally libertarian viewpoints, because I see them in this case as a potential shift from an income tax, to a consumption tax if Trump holds his current course to lower income taxes and replace them with tariffs. I'm pretty selfish when it comes to giving a shit about people being able to buy low cost goods, I would like to keep some more of my income without having to play the tax loop hole game.

Individuals have been given tools to purchase low costs consumer goods, my suspicion is the market will solve that issue, however the publicly traded corps that offshore in favor of greed, need to be shown a stick as the carrot will not work. It would not hurt my feelings if Amazon importers had to pay more for the crap they sling.

Every post in these threads is from a personal viewpoint and in favor of a personal agenda. I like the idea of some barriers to imports, I don't give a shit about exports. I like the idea of a consumption tax.

 

[530RL]

I disagree.
IMHO publicly traded corporations take every advantage they can get if allowed.

There are layers of complexity that move under the surface in regards to manufacturing. We are not talking about a family trip to Dollar General to buy cheap ass crap. There are lots of offshoring projects that close American factories in favor of additional margin outside our borders. Often the human element is disregarded, in favor of squeezing an extra couple EBIT points for shareholders. There are plenty of examples of unfavorable working and living conditions in the third world factories.

The box anchor is a great example. Crazy that it is cheaper to import that. Just in Time manufacturing vs tying up cash flow and working capital for international bulk shipments, and warehousing. Seems more like a path of least resistance as opposed to finding a stateside partner to manufacture it. Plus, I bet the overseas manufacture knocks it off if asked by an Amazon seller.

My position on tariffs run counter to my generally libertarian viewpoints, because I see them in this case as a potential shift from an income tax, to a consumption tax if Trump holds his current course to lower income taxes and replace them with tariffs. I'm pretty selfish when it comes to giving a shit about people being able to buy low cost goods, I would like to keep some more of my income without having to play the tax loop hole game.

Individuals have been given tools to purchase low costs consumer goods, my suspicion is the market will solve that issue, however the publicly traded corps that offshore in favor of greed, need to be shown a stick as the carrot will not work. It would not hurt my feelings if Amazon importers had to pay more for the crap they sling.

Every post in these threads is from a personal viewpoint and in favor of a personal agenda. I like the idea of some barriers to imports, I don't give a shit about exports. I like the idea of a consumption tax.

Yes corporations take every advantage they can get, as they are run by individuals.

Just as every individual behaves in the same rational manner. Searching from dealer to dealer to save the last few dollars on a new car, searching website after website to find the cheapest solution to what they need, even looking for ways to not pay at all such as the big thread in here about a magic box to pay zero for American workers work product. How would you like to be that worker?

Corporations are not autonomous, they are run by individuals. And those individuals behave in the corporation no different than they behave with their own personal dollars.

With respect to replacing the income tax with a consumption tax, nothing could be better for high earners and worse for the working middle class. But if that's what they want to do, throw me in the briar patch.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

Yes corporations take every advantage they can get, as they are run by individuals.
Corporations are not autonomous, they are run by individuals. And those individuals behave in the corporation no different than they behave with their own personal dollars.

In my experience (opinion) decisions made in a corporation are decoupled from a person decision, because the anticipated outcomes are not aligned. Individuals don't make decisions in a Public corporation, decisions are made by a group, not an individual. Morality does not play a role, personality does not play a role, status does not play a role, patriotism does not play a role, loyalty does not play a role, etc etc etc. Margin opportunity plays the primary role. MONEY

In many cases the founder of these corporations are long dead and the leadership is not driven by the same desire that developed the original vision. IMHO There is a huge difference between a person who starts a company to serve a market and publicly traded corporation. They are simply just not the same and I can see how if we generalize it would be easy to confuse the desired outcome of a "company"

Corporations don't make impulse buys. Individuals normally don't think about how saving a penny impacts at scale.

I wish I could give specific examples, but I'm afraid that might trigger some compliance issues and I like my job working as a greedy bastard.

 

[was thatguy]

Yes corporations take every advantage they can get, as they are run by individuals.

Just as every individual behaves in the same rational manner. Searching from dealer to dealer to save the last few dollars on a new car, searching website after website to find the cheapest solution to what they need, even looking for ways to not pay at all such as the big thread in here about a magic box to pay zero for American workers work product. How would you like to be that worker?

Corporations are not autonomous, they are run by individuals. And those individuals behave in the corporation no different than they behave with their own personal dollars.

With respect to replacing the income tax with a consumption tax, nothing could be better for high earners and worse for the working middle class. But if that's what they want to do, throw me in the briar patch.

Lol!
TPG owns DTV since ATT saw the writing on the wall (the bottom line in your vernacular) and dumped it.
TPG is the perfect example of the Publicly traded corporate overlord that Woods speaks of, and which you comically defend as simple American workers…try again with a better example.

But for the sake of example, let’s explore your thinly veiled jab.
TV content creators are not the same thing as TV service providers. Content creators and service providers fight all the time about money. Who pays who for what. But what is overlooked in this continuous wrestling match is technology progress and the fact that the end users…us, the viewers…are the only reason any of it exists at all.
So…the content creators and service providers are already paid by advertisers. For the viewers to then pay for the privilege of being targeted consumers is a ridiculous notion in today’s world of streaming tv.
“The way of the buggy whip” comes to mind.
I originally was opposed to the box, and stated so on here a few times.
Then I realized that as the consumer and target, it’s not my responsibility to fund the workings and agreements of and between creators and providers. I still have to watch all the commercials just like any “free” content, but at least now I have about $2500 a year extra to actually spend on those products.
Basically, it’s up to them, not me, to figure out modern monetization of their content.

 

[was thatguy]

In my experience (opinion) decisions made in a corporation are decoupled from a person decision, because the anticipated outcomes are not aligned. Individuals don't make decisions in a Public corporation, decisions are made by a group, not an individual. Morality does not play a role, personality does not play a role, status does not play a role, patriotism does not play a role, loyalty does not play a role, etc etc etc. Margin opportunity plays the primary role. MONEY

In many cases the founder of these corporations are long dead and the leadership is not driven by the same desire that developed the original vision. IMHO There is a huge difference between a person who starts a company to serve a market and publicly traded corporation. They are simply just not the same and I can see how if we generalize it would be easy to confuse the desired outcome of a "company"

Corporations don't make impulse buys. Individuals normally don't think about how saving a penny impacts at scale.

I wish I could give specific examples, but I'm afraid that might trigger some compliance issues and I like my job working as a greedy bastard.

He has stated outright on this very site that being guided by personal feelings about right and wrong is the fast lane to unemployment in his position, and the ONLY concern to board members is the bottom line.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

He has stated outright on this very site that being guided by personal feelings about right and wrong is the fast lane to unemployment in his position, and the ONLY concern to board members is the bottom line.

Well then we agree on something it seems.

 

[530RL]

In my experience (opinion) decisions made in a corporation are decoupled from a person decision, because the anticipated outcomes are not aligned. Individuals don't make decisions in a Public corporation, decisions are made by a group, not an individual. Morality does not play a role, personality does not play a role, status does not play a role, patriotism does not play a role, loyalty does not play a role, etc etc etc. Margin opportunity plays the primary role. MONEY

In many cases the founder of these corporations are long dead and the leadership is not driven by the same desire that developed the original vision. IMHO There is a huge difference between a person who starts a company to serve a market and publicly traded corporation. They are simply just not the same and I can see how if we generalize it would be easy to confuse the desired outcome of a "company"

Corporations don't make impulse buys. Individuals normally don't think about how saving a penny impacts at scale.

I wish I could give specific examples, but I'm afraid that might trigger some compliance issues and I like my job working as a greedy bastard.

Fair enough,

The question then becomes what is the best way to regulate this "problem". The individual voting with their dollars, or the government with their taxes and regulations?

My choice is the individual for if one thinks decisions in corporations are decoupled from a personal decision, wait until the government shows up to help............

 

[was thatguy]

Well then we agree on something it seems.

It seems.

 

[Sportin' Wood]

Fair enough,

The question then becomes what is the best way to regulate this "problem". The individual voting with their dollars, or the government with their taxes and regulations?

My choice is the individual for if one thinks decisions in corporations are decoupled from a personal decision, wait until the government shows up to help............

The government is already regulating and taxing. I like the idea of turning Sauron's Eye toward other countries products.

We are still disconnected between consumers and corporations. Even individuals that are strong patriotic Buy American are forced into imported components that make an assembly or finished good.

I'll be honest, I'm not passionate about Tariffs, I just want to see Trump break things. The more radical reforms the better. bring on Pleasentville, let's go backwards a few decades.

I rarely buy anything new, so I can't really think of an issue I would face except maybe tires. sure replacement parts might cost more like Brake Pads, I can live with that. Maybe my shoes go up in price, I'll get my boots resoled at the old timers shop in town.

I doubt we are going to see the same level of tariffs that are threatened anyway. it's all a game.