Almost done with cellular preparation for Super Bowl 58 (work pics)

[wash11]

I absolutely love posts like this- thanks for taking the time to share. That timeframe from a project management standpoint is super impressive!

 

[4Waters]

@81Sprint have a question.

A couple years ago we went to SOFI and my wife's phone started going crazy and turned off and we were unable to get it to turn back on. A year later we went again and all 4 of our phones started acting up so we shut them off our selves, once outside we turned them back on and all seemed OK except my wife's as it still screen locks a few times a week now. Why would this be happening?

What was happening was it seemed someone was controlling our phones. Opening apps, opening FB, my phone opened RDP and logged me out. Opened our contacts.......

 

[TonyFanelli]

Had my crew of guys working on a cellular technology upgrade to Allegiant Stadium for 9 long months to prepare for SB, and finally in the home stretch! We worked through all the holidays, Thanksgiving, Xmas and New Years to get this done, approximately 29k man hours! Verizon, AT&T and TMobile all upgraded their 4G and 5G presence in the stadium and on the site with Verizon doing the most out of the 3. So much work and money spent behind the scenes that people don't realize. I did the initial installation of this system when Allegiant was built, and very proud of the continued work my guys are capable of. Few pics that really don't scratch the surface, but something to think about when watching the game between the Ravens and Niners

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4G antennas suspended from the roof structure, 29 on initial construction, added 16 more inside, and 17 more outside on the exterior of the building. For size reference, the one in the middle is about 7' in diameter and weighs approximately 600 lbs, and has 48 individual antennas inside the fiberglass housing

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These are all the radios that transmit and receive for just this one section of the large suspended antennas, I custom made these brackets to hang them at a 45 degree angle to save space, each radio is a little under $10K. So this one section is almost $700K in equipment! This is why your cell phone bill is so expensive!
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Everything installed to the roof structure has to be done with rigging and rope techs

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Every single antenna has a specific elevation, tilt, roll, and azimuth and must be documented
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The whole system is on Digital Electricity, with a separate building UPS with generator backup.

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Generator backup, and another antenna to serve the field area outside the building

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4 sections on the north end of the building where we removed the metal panels, and are adding antennas in to the structure which will be covered by custom fiberglass panels
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A much needed vacation is in your near future...GREAT JOB!!!

 

[TonyFanelli]

Crazy amount of setup involved. The NFL basically took the stadium over on the 8th of January. Even brought in their own security team. We all have to be finished by next Friday, then it locks down pretty much until the game.

NFL Libtard commies

 

[81Sprint]

@81Sprint have a question.

A couple years ago we went to SOFI and my wife's phone started going crazy and turned off and we were unable to get it to turn back on. A year later we went again and all 4 of our phones started acting up so we shut them off our selves, once outside we turned them back on and all seemed OK except my wife's as it still screen locks a few times a week now. Why would this be happening?

What was happening was it seemed someone was controlling our phones. Opening apps, opening FB, my phone opened RDP and logged me out. Opened our contacts.......

That's interesting. I will ask one of the RF engineers that we are working with, they also did SoFI. The only time I have seen something like that happen was when I finished the SLS (Sahara) and the DAS system integrator did not adjust the power levels on the radios correctly. It was basically blasting at full power, and it was shutting our phones down. When you walk into a venue that has a DAS system, your phone basically does a "hand off" of service from the Macro Cell tower to the internal neutral host DAS, and should be a seamless transition. A Neutral host is the infrastructure in a building that the carriers share and can get quite complicated if not maintained, but I will ask.

 

[4Waters]

That's interesting. I will ask one of the RF engineers that we are working with, they also did SoFI. The only time I have seen something like that happen was when I finished the SLS (Sahara) and the DAS system integrator did not adjust the power levels on the radios correctly. It was basically blasting at full power, and it was shutting our phones down. When you walk into a venue that has a DAS system, your phone basically does a "hand off" of service from the Macro Cell tower to the internal neutral host DAS, and should be a seamless transition. A Neutral host is the infrastructure in a building that the carriers share and can get quite complicated if not maintained, but I will ask.

Thank you, I ended up turning my phone back on and put it in airplane mode so I could get pics of my son playing at SOFI, it didn't seem to be going crazy but I don't know of there was still an issue going on.

 

[Jonas Grumby]

You are probably referring to the small cells being installed on the street poles, they are not WIFI but Cell 4G and 5G mainly. They are ALL over Vegas, tons of them down the center of the strip, they supplement the big Macro towers to provide more coverage. 5G is everywhere now.

View attachment 1327329

For TMO, they are all CRAN,(dark fiber to the C/O), the providers have a hard time keeping the fiber up, mainly cox.

 

[DaveH]

@81Sprint have a question.

A couple years ago we went to SOFI and my wife's phone started going crazy and turned off and we were unable to get it to turn back on. A year later we went again and all 4 of our phones started acting up so we shut them off our selves, once outside we turned them back on and all seemed OK except my wife's as it still screen locks a few times a week now. Why would this be happening?

What was happening was it seemed someone was controlling our phones. Opening apps, opening FB, my phone opened RDP and logged me out. Opened our contacts.......

large crowded venues (tens of thousand of phones or more) create a VERY high noise floor.

what is noise floor? in simplest terms, its RF energy that is not meant for your specific phone. in essence, every other phone is interference to your phone and the connection to the tower.

every been somewhere like that and your phone is getting hot in your pocket and the battery drains quickly? it because the transmitter on your phone has a variable power output transmitter and in the high noise environment your phone has to transmit on "maximum overdrive" to be able to be "heard" by the cell tower.

as for you phone shutting down apps and so forth, this is more of a question for the phone maker and how their background code handles both battery life and thermal management. to preserve your battery and keep transmission to a minimum, its likely the phone recognized the RF environment it was in and was shutting down apps that were running in the background. this would keep RF transmissions to a minimum, reducing the noise floor and preserving your battery life.

this is really no different for a DAS system as opposed to a traditional outdoor cell tower. it all boils down to how many subscribers are trying to access the network.

 

[4Waters]

large crowded venues (tens of thousand of phones or more) create a VERY high noise floor.

what is noise floor? in simplest terms, its RF energy that is not meant for your specific phone. in essence, every other phone is interference to your phone and the connection to the tower.

every been somewhere like that and your phone is getting hot in your pocket and the battery drains quickly? it because the transmitter on your phone has a variable power output transmitter and in the high noise environment your phone has to transmit on "maximum overdrive" to be able to be "heard" by the cell tower.

as for you phone shutting down apps and so forth, this is more of a question for the phone maker and how their background code handles both battery life and thermal management. to preserve your battery and keep transmission to a minimum, its likely the phone recognized the RF environment it was in and was shutting down apps that were running in the background. this would keep RF transmissions to a minimum, reducing the noise floor and preserving your battery life.

this is really no different for a DAS system as opposed to a traditional outdoor cell tower. it all boils down to how many subscribers are trying to access the network.

Ok, we went in Oct 22 for a Rams Falcons game, sold out crowd and had zero issues. We went for our youth superbowl a month later with about 500 people and we had issues, so much so we had to get my wife a new phone. Went again for our youth superbowl last November and had same issues with only about 500 people.

Our phones weren't shutting down apps, it was opening apps, contacts, emails....

 

[DaveH]

Ok, we went in Oct 22 for a Rams Falcons game, sold out crowd and had zero issues. We went for our youth superbowl a month later with about 500 people and we had issues, so much so we had to get my wife a new phone. Went again for our youth superbowl last November and had same issues with only about 500 people.

Our phones weren't shutting down apps, it was opening apps, contacts, emails....

the network does not control what apps do. its just the pipeline to carry your data, whatever that me be. this is an issue with the phone itself and the OS it is working on.

 

[Nordie]

I noticed King was outside running all kinds of communication stuff all around Allegiant for about a month. They don't seem to be there now, so maybe they wrapped up their end.

 

[DaveH]

I noticed King was outside running all kinds of communication stuff all around Allegiant for about a month. They don't seem to be there now, so maybe they wrapped up their end.

Travis and I worked together at Cingular, probably 20+ years ago.

 

[Nordie]

Travis and I worked together at Cingular, probably 20+ years ago.

Small world, I've known Travis since I was a little kid. He always had cool toys. Him and my Step-dad were buddies growing up.

 

[DaveH]

Small world, I've known Travis since I was a little kid. He always had cool toys. Him and my Step-dad were buddies growing up.

yeah crazy small world and you are right about the toys, his lux prerunner is in my shop right now getting full Motec systems.

 

[v6toy4x]

Wow, its amazing the people who are on this site and what they do for work.

 

[v6toy4x]

something to think about when watching the game between the Ravens and Niners

I will be doing more than thinking about it, you just became my new "buddy" the conversation during the game will go like this.

"You see all those screens and all the video and audio, yeah my buddy did all that"

 

[Cooter01]

Thank you for the back ground info!

 

[81Sprint]

I noticed King was outside running all kinds of communication stuff all around Allegiant for about a month. They don't seem to be there now, so maybe they wrapped up their end.

We helped King install a huge fiber ring for MGM over the last year or so, all of this aimed at being done by SB 58 and F1. We took over on the properties as we are a union shop. Connected all the properties, 1728 strand ribbon fibers all the way up to 3456. I had several guys splicing fiber non stop for months and months.

 

[81Sprint]

Travis and I worked together at Cingular, probably 20+ years ago.

Small world, with my last company i did the builds for new Cingular call centers in Little Rock, Lafayette, Baton Rouge and Ocala. Long time ago! I was in Lafayette on the job on Sept 11th.

 

[toto]

Same question from me. I was with Ericsson running the TMO. Mods project in Vegas the last 6 years, until they decided to stop spending money. Maybe I know you.
( very clean looking install)

What project did they move you to and are you still in the Vegas Market

 

[81Sprint]

Set records once again, SB 58 was most watched in history other than the moon landing. I had guys working 12 hour days right up until the end with last minute changes, and then got to sit at home with a beer and watch the game with some friends and relax. Used an incredible amount of data! Some of the Verizon folks recorded these numbers

Verizon customers used 52.34 TB of data in and around Allegiant Stadium for Super Bowl LVIII

Verizon customers shared the championship game’s biggest moments, consuming a record amount of data on Verizon’s network in and around Allegiant Stadium in Las Vegas, Nevada.

www.verizon.com

 

[Taboma]

Set records once again, SB 58 was most watched in history other than the moon landing. I had guys working 12 hour days right up until the end with last minute changes, and then got to sit at home with a beer and watch the game with some friends and relax. Used an incredible amount of data! Some of the Verizon folks recorded these numbers

View attachment 1334570
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Verizon customers used 52.34 TB of data in and around Allegiant Stadium for Super Bowl LVIII

Verizon customers shared the championship game’s biggest moments, consuming a record amount of data on Verizon’s network in and around Allegiant Stadium in Las Vegas, Nevada.

www.verizon.com

Being on the opposite side of the Cell phone craze, as in rarely if ever using my own that only occasionally leaves my desk --- what is the financial carrot for these cellular companies to spend so many dollars constructing these mega-dollar temporary ( I'm guessing) mega-networks ?

 

[FreeBird236]

Set records once again, SB 58 was most watched in history other than the moon landing. I had guys working 12 hour days right up until the end with last minute changes, and then got to sit at home with a beer and watch the game with some friends and relax. Used an incredible amount of data! Some of the Verizon folks recorded these numbers

View attachment 1334570
View attachment 1334579

Verizon customers used 52.34 TB of data in and around Allegiant Stadium for Super Bowl LVIII

Verizon customers shared the championship game’s biggest moments, consuming a record amount of data on Verizon’s network in and around Allegiant Stadium in Las Vegas, Nevada.

www.verizon.com

So, do you work for Cox? I saw something on the pregame lead-up giving Cox kudos for making all the cell phones work.

 

[DILLIGAF]

Nice work

 

[Hardly Satisfied]

Wow that amazing what goes into all this. Thanks for sharing and posting pictures

 

[DaveH]

Being on the opposite side of the Cell phone craze, as in rarely if ever using my own that only occasionally leaves my desk --- what is the financial carrot for these cellular companies to spend so many dollars constructing these mega-dollar temporary ( I'm guessing) mega-networks ?

actually the installation like what has been posted saves the carriers money. back to that in a second.

the incentive is to have coverage in a high profile venue and not be outdone by their competitors. Imagine being Verizon and having no coverage there, but the their competitors do. it would be a loss of customers in a dramatic fashion.

while the infrastructure you see being implemented likely costed several million dollars to implement, this is cheap compared to what it would have cost using older technologies. a single cell tower can cost over a million dollars and it would take 20+ of them surrounding the property to get the capacity. also consider the esthetics of 20+ towers. you could implement older DAS technologies that would require spreading hundreds, if not thousands of antennas throughout the property, and this would cost 10x as much as that massive ball antenna.

then factor in the system was designed to be utilized by all the carriers and they will share the cost of the system.

yeah that giant ball saved the cell carriers millions.

 

[81Sprint]

Being on the opposite side of the Cell phone craze, as in rarely if ever using my own that only occasionally leaves my desk --- what is the financial carrot for these cellular companies to spend so many dollars constructing these mega-dollar temporary ( I'm guessing) mega-networks ?

Each 5G antenna is carrier specific, whereas 4G antennas are shared between the carriers through a DAS infrastructure called a Neutral Host. 5G antennas average about 50k each depending on power levels. Between all carriers on this site we have installed about 225 and then you have to add in the fiber and power infrastructure for them. Initial build for the system (4G) was about 90 mil, including UPS and Generator backup. This upgrade overall was about half of the initial install, with my portion of construction (not supplying active and passive electronics) being a little under 10 million. Verizon was the only one who did a major upgrade as you can see in the picture above with the other carriers download speeds not even close. AT&T and TMO have a total of 28 5G antennas in the building, but none in the suites or concourses.

 

[81Sprint]

So, do you work for Cox? I saw something on the pregame lead-up giving Cox kudos for making all the cell phones work.

Cox has a hand in powering the WIFI system, but the speed is no where near the 5G. I do not work for them, I am a PM for a large electrical contractor here in Vegas but specialize in DAS systems.

 

[Taboma]

Each 5G antenna is carrier specific, whereas 4G antennas are shared between the carriers through a DAS infrastructure called a Neutral Host. 5G antennas average about 50k each depending on power levels. Between all carriers on this site we have installed about 225 and then you have to add in the fiber and power infrastructure for them. Initial build for the system (4G) was about 90 mil, including UPS and Generator backup. This upgrade overall was about half of the initial install, with my portion of construction (not supplying active and passive electronics) being a little under 10 million. Verizon was the only one who did a major upgrade as you can see in the picture above with the other carriers download speeds not even close. AT&T and TMO have a total of 28 5G antennas in the building, but none in the suites or concourses.

Thanks, this thread has been very interesting and certainly appreciated.
If I'm understand both @DaveH and your posts correctly, the financial carrot was providing the best service to it's customer's which in this case Verizon seems to have won with it's massive 5G stadium wide upgrade.
I'm also going to venture a guess that this expenditure wasn't a temporary Super Bowl upgrade, but a permanent 5G addition to this stadium for Verizon.

 

[jesco]

Thats awesome. I sent some guys out to AZ in '15 to run a bunch of 4" for cellular for the Super Bowl. Had 6 guys there working 12hr days for 12 days straight. Everything was covered, they just needed manpower. The crew that was there was running out of gas and needed fresh blood to get the project to the finish line.

 

[81Sprint]

Thanks, this thread has been very interesting and certainly appreciated.
If I'm understand both @DaveH and your posts correctly, the financial carrot was providing the best service to it's customer's which in this case Verizon seems to have won with it's massive 5G stadium wide upgrade.
I'm also going to venture a guess that this expenditure wasn't a temporary Super Bowl upgrade, but a permanent 5G addition to this stadium for Verizon.

LTE- Long Term Employment

Nothing in the the cell world is permanent, the technology is evolving very quickly but this system should do for a few years and I'm sure the other carriers will bolster their presence seeing what was accomplished. VZW has the contract with the NFL to provide a certain level of performance which is why they advertise like crazy. The infrastructure is now there and can easily swap the antennas for the next latest and greatest.

 

[boatpi]

I can tell you were around the whole area in our condo this weekend. The speed was better than ever ever before with one exception.. Verizon needs to work on their 5G box speed in the strip area especially for some of the units up off the ground a little higher. It still fluctuates a lot we’re on the 16th floor.

 

[81Sprint]

I just spoke to one of the engineers I work with closely, and he recorded a download peak at almost 5000 mbps at the game. Which is insane! In my office, I have clear line of sight to a tower about 1/4 mile away and I get a little over 1000 mbps.

 

[81Sprint]

I can tell you were around the whole area in our condo this weekend. The speed was better than ever ever before with one exception.. Verizon needs to work on their 5G box speed in the strip area especially for some of the units up off the ground a little higher. It still fluctuates a lot we’re on the 16th floor.

Hotel towers can be tricky, if they do not have an internal DAS you are relying on the outdoor Macro tower and small cells. This decreases the performance, now take into account exterior glass and steel of the building on top of that as well as elevation.