Air Medevac Insurance

[LakeMeadLavey]

Sure this is possibly a Vin topic. After watching someone get in a bad accident recently and being airlifted had me thinking about insurance and what isn’t covered.

Most all of us are into recreation of some sort that could result in being badly injured. Hopefully never happens. Is it worth having that extra air med insurance? What does it cost and what are the good plans/companies.

 

[white tortilla]

@Boat 405

 

[DLC]

A friends kid needed a life flight from South Escondido to Children’s Hospital it was like 12 or 15 miles and it was $28,000.00 ish

It took a while, He got it down to $12,000.00 ….



Kid was fine and the life flight was a precaution
that was over 20 years ago

 

[Singleton]

My middle son needed lifeflight from Granby Co to Denver Children's.
68k back in 2015.
With my work insurance I paid 680.00

 

[SOCALCRICKETT]

I fly a ton of patients, I always will say it's worth it. If I launch a bird it's 10k to just fire up a bird.


There are 2 primary providers air methods and GMR. Most insurance is $300-350 a year

 

[LHC Kirby]

We bought an Annual Travel insurance form Allianz. ($485) We got a low amount ($2000) to cover the basic stuff, but the emergency evacuation part is covered up to $500,000 . . . . . . . I called them and asked, since our LHC house is a second home, would we be covered if in LHC. They said what is copy/pasted from our policy below. Yes there are some hoops to jump through but if we don't jump and just fly - they still cover at whatever they would have paid if contacted first. so my cost would be much less compared to no coverage.

"Your travel to, within, and/or from a location at least 100 miles from your primary
residence. It cannot include travel with the intent to receive health care or medical
treatment of any kind, moving, or commuting to and from work, and it cannot last
longer than 90 days"

"Emergency Evacuation (Transporting you to the nearest appropriate hospital)
If you become seriously ill or injured or develop a medical condition while on your trip (including being diagnosed
with an epidemic or pandemic disease such as COVID-19) and we determine that the local medical facilities are
unable to provide appropriate medical treatment:
1. Our medical team will consult with the local doctor;
2. We will identify the closest appropriate hospital or other appropriate facility, make arrangements to transport
you there, and pay for that transport; and
3. We will arrange and pay for a medical escort if we determine one is necessary.
The following conditions apply:
a. You or someone on your behalf must contact us, and we must make all transportation arrangements in
advance. If we did not authorize and arrange the transportation, we will only pay up to what we would have
paid if we had made the arrangements.
b. One or more emergency transportation providers must be willing and able to transport you from your current
location to the identified hospital or facility.
c. You must not have traveled against the orders or advice of any government or other public authority at any
location to, from, or through which you are traveling on your trip"

 

[rrrr]

We have coverage with CareFlite, the North Texas HEMS provider. They also provide regional fixed wing air ambulance emergency medical transport service in the package.

The sign up cost for the four year plan in 2022 was $145, and it covers both of us.

 

[prorider]

Everyone is worried about getting sued these days if something goes wrong. They life flight so many unnecessary people. It’s insane.

 

[Boat 405]

The answer is yes. I started buying it about 2014/2015. It's like $200 a year for my wife and son included with the fly you home option so you are not in some random hospital after you are stabilized.

My brother had a spinal cord injury in late 2022 and he had to be airlifted from the hills behind santa barbara, then he had to be transferred to Scripps La Jolla via Ambulance. Lets just say after all that emergency travel he now has the same life flight insurance as I do. It's like one nice meal out these days. It's a no brainer

 

[yz450mm]

Everyone is worried about getting sued these days if something goes wrong. They life flight so many unnecessary people. It’s insane.

You really think that paramedics on scene of an incident are making transport decisions based on them not wanting to get sued?

That's a ridiculously idiotic statement, and I hope nobody even considers thinking that's in any way true.

 

[TeamGreene]

The answer is yes. I started buying it about 2014/2015. It's like $200 a year for my wife and son included with the fly you home option so you are not in some random hospital after you are stabilized.

My brother had a spinal cord injury in late 2022 and he had to be airlifted from the hills behind santa barbara, then he had to be transferred to Scripps La Jolla via Ambulance. Lets just say after all that emergency travel he now has the same life flight insurance as I do. It's like one nice meal out these days. It's a no brainer

Which company?

 

[Boatymcboatface]

Daughter was life flighted a few years ago. Statement showed up right around 48k! But We’ve got blue shield HMO so land sea or air emergency at the time was only $100 out of pocket! Now I think it’s $150. Glad we had coverage.

 

[yz450mm]

Straight from the air methods website:

As of January 1, 2022, the No Surprises Act protects you from a large balance bills and surprise costs related to emergency medical care if you have insurance. You’re only responsible for your deductible, co-pay or coinsurance, just as you would be with any other healthcare service.
If you bought or are considering buying an air medical membership because you are worried you could get a 50K+ bill, times have changed. If you have health insurance, you are protected.
It doesn’t matter who your insurance provider is or if you are in or out of network, you can’t get a surprise balance bill, no matter who transports you.

Membership Facts - Air Methods

At Air Methods, we believe everyone deserves access to our lifesaving care. Learn about air medical memberships and the No Surprises Act.

www.airmethods.com

 

[RVR2SNO]

This is who we use. Cheap insurance if you ask me.

Home

An air medical transport can dramatically reduce travel time to an emergency facility for members and non-members...

www.airmedcarenetwork.com

 

[TimeBandit]

Straight from the air methods website:

As of January 1, 2022, the No Surprises Act protects you from a large balance bills and surprise costs related to emergency medical care if you have insurance. You’re only responsible for your deductible, co-pay or coinsurance, just as you would be with any other healthcare service.
If you bought or are considering buying an air medical membership because you are worried you could get a 50K+ bill, times have changed. If you have health insurance, you are protected.
It doesn’t matter who your insurance provider is or if you are in or out of network, you can’t get a surprise balance bill, no matter who transports you.

Membership Facts - Air Methods

At Air Methods, we believe everyone deserves access to our lifesaving care. Learn about air medical memberships and the No Surprises Act.

www.airmethods.com

So in plain English does this mean we no longer need to worry about air ambulance through a separate policy?

 

[Dalton]

When I was working in Afghanistan my work purchased me International SOS Insurance, I've also purchased it for my Africa travels. I believe it's mainly for traveling though, not domestic.

 

[prorider]

You really think that paramedics on scene of an incident are making transport decisions based on them not wanting to get sued?

That's a ridiculously idiotic statement, and I hope nobody even considers thinking that's in any way true.

 

[prorider]

You really think that paramedics on scene of an incident are making transport decisions based on them not wanting to get sued?

That's a ridiculously idiotic statement, and I hope nobody even considers thinking that's in any way true.

It’s absolutely true. See it everywhere with ER doctors also. I just refused a life flight that would have been 50,000. Took an extra hour to drive. God damn lawyers are mostly to blame.

 

[yz450mm]

It’s absolutely true. See it everywhere with ER doctors also. I just refused a life flight that would have been 50,000. Took an extra hour to drive. God damn lawyers are mostly to blame.

LOL ok bud, everybody's out to get you.

 

[2Driver]

LOL ok bud, everybody's out to get you.

Revenue is an overlay of what decisions are made for the sake of “an abundance caution”.

I had lunch with a town counsel member and the regional director of our Fire/emt provider who is a multi-state provider.

It was all about the numbers, # of calls, maximizing the rides to the hospital. He talked about response time briefly but the discussion was overwhelmingly how to maximize numbers. He spoke like a CFO, of how to increase recenue with transport to the ER etc..No different than drug companies maximizing revenue from insurance and mdicare

 

[530RL]

We use MedJet Horizon.

You can read the different plans and their respective coverages both domestic and International here.

MedjetAssist Medical Transport Membership | Medjet

MedjetAssist provides air medical transport to the hospital of your choice regardless of medical necessity. Learn about our membership benefits today.

medjetassist.com

 

[SOCALCRICKETT]

It’s absolutely true. See it everywhere with ER doctors also. I just refused a life flight that would have been 50,000. Took an extra hour to drive. God damn lawyers are mostly to blame.

Yep, as providers our first concern is patient care and how to get ppl to where they need to be for treatment. As a provider we have huge liability if we aren't doing our best to expedite patient care and transport, if it can be proven that there was a faster way to get the patient treated the CES and county EMS agencies will have a field day with us.



With that being said, if a patient meets title 22 requirements meaning that they are mentally capable adults that have retained their power of attorney, they can not be forced to do anything they do not want. If a patient is forced to fly or even be treated against their will it falls under the kidnapping cause.

There is merit to having a close family member involved in the transport decision though. In the 911 system, if we have a patient needing transport to specialty care facility, the first I do as a paramedic is get on the radio and talk to a base station MICN to find out who has bed availability and who can accept my patient. From there we will determine what the fasted mode of transport is, sometimes weather keeps me from getting an airship and ground is my best option. Case in point, with new onset stroke symptoms I have a 3 hour window to get the "clot buster" medication on board, if I have to wait 45 minutes for a bird and it's 45 minute flight time I will send the patient by ground being that it's an hour and 20 minute drive time. If I can get a bird in a timely manner air will be my best choice

 

[jetboatperformance]

My Copter ride 5 Years ago from Paso Robles to Stanford was $72000

 

[whiteworks]

Yep, as providers our first concern is patient care and how to get ppl to where they need to be for treatment. As a provider we have huge liability if we aren't doing our best to expedite patient care and transport, if it can be proven that there was a faster way to get the patient treated the CES and county EMS agencies will have a field day with us.



With that being said, if a patient meets title 22 requirements meaning that they are mentally capable adults that have retained their power of attorney, they can not be forced to do anything they do not want. If a patient is forced to fly or even be treated against their will it falls under the kidnapping cause.

There is merit to having a close family member involved in the transport decision though. In the 911 system, if we have a patient needing transport to specialty care facility, the first I do as a paramedic is get on the radio and talk to a base station MICN to find out who has bed availability and who can accept my patient. From there we will determine what the fasted mode of transport is, sometimes weather keeps me from getting an airship and ground is my best option. Case in point, with new onset stroke symptoms I have a 3 hour window to get the "clot buster" medication on board, if I have to wait 45 minutes for a bird and it's 45 minute flight time I will send the patient by ground being that it's an hour and 20 minute drive time. If I can get a bird in a timely manner air will be my best choice

On the inverse side of this topic, what are the key words that I can use in communication on initial call for help from remote area that will prompt an air response?

I carry a decent first aide kit when we are off-roading and also have a defibrillator on board because my pals are not the best examples of health and fitness.

Scenario is we’re out off-roading 40 miles from nearest highway, one of them falls over in full cardiac arrest and I zap them back, how can I get airship dispatched without a medic on scene yet?

It my understanding that a fire captain is the one who makes the call, is there a specific chain of information I can relay to 911 dispatcher to prompt airship response or at least get things tee’d up?

 

[rivergames]

I got life flighted back in 2014 from Havasu to Vegas when the Crackerbox disintegrated on me. It was around a $100K for the flight.

Overall hospital bill for 2 weeks in Vegas and 2 weeks in Long beach was over $1Mill. Luckily I had Aflac at the time (and still do) as a secondary insurance and I ended up coming out of the whole deal with +$10K in my pocket.

 

[yard dog]

Straight from the air methods website:

As of January 1, 2022, the No Surprises Act protects you from a large balance bills and surprise costs related to emergency medical care if you have insurance. You’re only responsible for your deductible, co-pay or coinsurance, just as you would be with any other healthcare service.
If you bought or are considering buying an air medical membership because you are worried you could get a 50K+ bill, times have changed. If you have health insurance, you are protected.
It doesn’t matter who your insurance provider is or if you are in or out of network, you can’t get a surprise balance bill, no matter who transports you.

Membership Facts - Air Methods

At Air Methods, we believe everyone deserves access to our lifesaving care. Learn about air medical memberships and the No Surprises Act.

www.airmethods.com

This is true , I was transferred via helicopter from Fort Mojave to Banner Phoenix . When i follow up on the bill for the flight this what I was told by the air medical company. They informed us on this information when we called in to see what the insurance company would pay and what we were responsible for It was a 80,000 flight last year . My wife was on the air medical team for Airvac for 15 years in Phoenix and Havasu .

 

[stephenkatsea]

A few years ago, after attending a local LHC Air Medi Vac insurance seminar, I contacted the local Air Medi Vac operations. For those of us on Medicare, they do business all the time with Medicare recipients at a pre-negoatiated rate. IOW, Medicare and many health insurance plans cover it, within the US. What separate Air private insurance does provide, beyond Medicare & other health insurance plans, are things like RV/Motorhome relocation & return home, care of pets, Evan from some foreign areas etc etc.

 

[Chevy5150]

My son was air lifted from Upland to OC children's back in July. Bill was $75,000 and I was responsible for $1000.

 

[SOCALCRICKETT]

On the inverse side of this topic, what are the key words that I can use in communication on initial call for help from remote area that will prompt an air response?

I carry a decent first aide kit when we are off-roading and also have a defibrillator on board because my pals are not the best examples of health and fitness.

Scenario is we’re out off-roading 40 miles from nearest highway, one of them falls over in full cardiac arrest and I zap them back, how can I get airship dispatched without a medic on scene yet?

It my understanding that a fire captain is the one who makes the call, is there a specific chain of information I can relay to 911 dispatcher to prompt airship response or at least get things tee’d up?

It all depends on the remoteness of the area the call was generated. Remote areas usually get a "remote rescue response." With that being said a remote rescue helicopter is different from a medical transport but sometimes a rescue with transport as well


Confusing I know he is an example, 2 years ago I had 2 hikers go down on the pacific crest hiking trail, one was a confirmed DOA prior to my arrival and one was viable. Initial response sent 2 engines, 1 ambulance and riverside sheriff's helicopter. I was the first medic on scene and assumed incident command nd orderd the additional resources until someone with more brass it on scene.

The sheriff's helicopter was used to short haul hoist the patients to a rendezvous point where we had mercy air on stand by for transport. The sheriff's helicopter was used for extraction and mercy was used for treatment.

In the state of California, the 911 calls that are generated from a cell phone are immediately sent to CHP where they use the ANL to locate the point of call origin and transfer the call to the closest responding agency dispatch center. What ANL is "automatic number locating" that allows the phone to be pinpointed even if the location tracker is turned off on phone. Now when a call I'd generated from an land line, the call does not even make it to CHP and automatically goes to the closest dispatch.

 

[92562]

Some medical insurance plans include it. When my wife was flown from Wildomar to Loma Linda it was $22,000 (2008) and my portion was $1,500.

 

[Boat 405]

Which company?

I use Air Med Care Network with the Fly U home option

 

[Boat 405]

I got life flighted back in 2014 from Havasu to Vegas when the Crackerbox disintegrated on me. It was around a $100K for the flight.

Overall hospital bill for 2 weeks in Vegas and 2 weeks in Long beach was over $1Mill. Luckily I had Aflac at the time (and still do) as a secondary insurance and I ended up coming out of the whole deal with +$10K in my pocket.

Yup sounds about right. My brothers was Helo, Ambulance, Surgery, ICU, in patient OT about 4 weeks total. 1.2 million. Adds up really quickly

 

[Boat 405]

This is true , I was transferred via helicopter from Fort Mojave to Banner Phoenix . When i follow up on the bill for the flight this what I was told by the air medical company. They informed us on this information when we called in to see what the insurance company would pay and what we were responsible for It was a 80,000 flight last year . My wife was on the air medical team for Airvac for 15 years in Phoenix and Havasu . View attachment 1349541

Tell her THANK YOU!!!! for what she has done. I talked the Helo team that got my brother, and they said they never hear what happens to the patients that they life flight. When my brother was able to get around, he made a trip up to the guys and took them to lunch and thanked them personally. Pretty sure had it not been for their super fast efforts my brother would have died or ended up a quadraplegic.

 

[yz450mm]

On the inverse side of this topic, what are the key words that I can use in communication on initial call for help from remote area that will prompt an air response?

I carry a decent first aide kit when we are off-roading and also have a defibrillator on board because my pals are not the best examples of health and fitness.

Scenario is we’re out off-roading 40 miles from nearest highway, one of them falls over in full cardiac arrest and I zap them back, how can I get airship dispatched without a medic on scene yet?

It my understanding that a fire captain is the one who makes the call, is there a specific chain of information I can relay to 911 dispatcher to prompt airship response or at least get things tee’d up?

Fire captain is in charge of the scene, but the highest medical authority, AKA paramedic, is in charge of all medical decisions.

If you have somebody there that can provide a scene size up and quick patient assessment, that might get things going (depending on the details of the situation).
Off-duty Fire or EMS can usually make the call early, before the official first responders get on scene.

 

[prorider]

LOL ok bud, everybody's out to get you.

Look dumbass I never said everyone is out to get me. But you obviously don’t know shit. My wife was director of a ER for 20 years and had to testify in Denver court on several lawsuits. All these medical people are practicing defensive medicine and ordering every test in the book to try and not get sued if something crazy happens. Same with air flights.

 

[yz450mm]

Look dumbass I never said everyone is out to get me. But you obviously don’t know shit. My wife was director of a ER for 20 years and had to testify in Denver court on several lawsuits. All these medical people are practicing defensive medicine and ordering every test in the book to try and not get sued if something crazy happens. Same with air flights.

So how many air ambulances did you wife order over her 20 year career directing a hospital ER? I know a hell of a lot more about this topic than I have to justify to you, that's for sure. Since you said, "They life flight so many unnecessary people. It’s insane.", what are your qualifications for making that transport determination?

Let's see if my Spidey sense is accurate. You're a "pro" level MX rider, and have seen many people crash at MX tracks where air transport to a trauma center was advised. You've even crashed a bunch yourself, but always knew better than the EMS responders and told them to pound sand. For all the years I spent at MX tracks as the on-site EMS provider (and responding to MX tracks for crashes), it was always the "pros" that acted like know it all's and tried to refuse help. The average Joe beginner/novice/intermediate riders usually accepted the help and were grateful for it.

Each department and provider follow a set of protocols that determine whether air transport is necessary and warranted for that specific patient. John the paramedic from XYZ County Fire Dept is following the protocol and trying to provide the best care for the patient with the best (usually fastest) transport option.

 

[Flying_Lavey]

About 15 years ago I entered my one and only District 37 race on thr 500. I got a bad start and went ass over tea kettle before the bomb. Was out cold when sweep found me. They figured I was out for at least 10 minutes. They transported me back to rescue 3 in the front seat of a ranger pick-up then strapped me to a backboard inside rescue 3 and life-flighted me and another kid to Loma Linda because Rodgecrest didn't have a CT machine at the time. Ended up being just a concusion and nothing more. The bill was about $18k. Kaiser said just pay the ER co-pay of $100.

 

[Hardly Satisfied]

my son was almost 3 years old and we were in Havasu it was in 2006 and he had to go to the Hospital in havasu and than they had to fly him and my wife to a children’s Hospital in Las Vegas and the total bill was right a Hundred thousand dollars. Just the helicopter ride there was just under $25,000. I have Kaiser for my insurance and they covered everything I didn’t pay a dime.

 

[TeamGreene]

I use Air Med Care Network with the Fly U home option

 

[pronstar]

We have coverage with CareFlite, the North Texas HEMS provider. They also provide regional fixed wing air ambulance emergency medical transport service in the package.

The sign up cost for the four year plan in 2022 was $145, and it covers both of us.

Thanks for this, I’m gonna check them out.

 

[BoatCop]

I encourage everyone to consult with your current insurer on how they, and any secondary plans, handle and/or cover air-evacs, either fixed-wing or rotary. Especially check the "Maximum Out of Pocket" expenses provision.

My wife had to be life-flighted out (Parker-Phoenix) with heart issues Dec-2022. With MEDICARE and TRICARE our portion was exactly ZERO. (would have been zero, even without MEDICARE & TRICARE, due to her being Native, but that wouldn't matter to the vast majority of us, here). When I had to be flown from Parker to Havasu with a full blown heart attack, 2015, I banged the Max Out of Pocket (County Employee Insurance at the time), and spent only $3,000 total for everything: Ambulance from home to Parker, Parker ER, Care-flight to Havasu, Cath-lab, cath procedure, Cardiologist, and 4 days in-patient. In cases like that, any separate Flight Insurance/Subscription wouldn't be necessary. Total for each of the above instances was into the 6 figures.

The only thing that pisses me off, is that it seems like Ambulance (ground AND air) companies don't bother getting insurance info or card copies from either the patient, NOK, or hospital, at the time of service. Whenever I've had to use them for me or family, I'll get a bill about 2 months later, wanting my insurance information. In one case, I never got a bill, except from a collection agency. They didn't bother billing me or asking for insurance, they just submitted it straight to collections.

 

[OCMerrill]

We had a buddy wad up on the cross over trail in Ocotillo. He was in pretty bad shape so we loaded him in my Jeep Station wagon and took him to the road where his wife ran him to Brawley. They saw on the Xray that a rib was into his lung.

Onto a Helicopter to Palm Springs. He was released the next day and there was 6 broken ribs and a broken collar bone but nothing was even close to puncturing a lung.

That was a $76k ride for erroring on the basis of caution. His insurance picked up some but he made payments for a several years on that one.

 

[SOCALCRICKETT]

I encourage everyone to consult with your current insurer on how they, and any secondary plans, handle and/or cover air-evacs, either fixed-wing or rotary. Especially check the "Maximum Out of Pocket" expenses provision.

My wife had to be life-flighted out (Parker-Phoenix) with heart issues Dec-2022. With MEDICARE and TRICARE our portion was exactly ZERO. (would have been zero, even without MEDICARE & TRICARE, due to her being Native, but that wouldn't matter to the vast majority of us, here). When I had to be flown from Parker to Havasu with a full blown heart attack, 2015, I banged the Max Out of Pocket (County Employee Insurance at the time), and spent only $3,000 total for everything: Ambulance from home to Parker, Parker ER, Care-flight to Havasu, Cath-lab, cath procedure, Cardiologist, and 4 days in-patient. In cases like that, any separate Flight Insurance/Subscription wouldn't be necessary. Total for each of the above instances was into the 6 figures.

The only thing that pisses me off, is that it seems like Ambulance (ground AND air) companies don't bother getting insurance info or card copies from either the patient, NOK, or hospital, at the time of service. Whenever I've had to use them for me or family, I'll get a bill about 2 months later, wanting my insurance information. In one case, I never got a bill, except from a collection agency. They didn't bother billing me or asking for insurance, they just submitted it straight to collections.

That actually comes down to the crew members, almost all transport agencies use the same report system called image trends. Even in some counties its required that all fire/ems/air agencies use it. There is a section on image trends that requires name, ss, phone and insurance info. In fact when the report gets posted if those drop down boxes aren't filled out it will red flag in the system, and you can't even post the report if the box is empty you will have to click the "unkown" option

 

[Let It Ride]

If your in LA Co, it’s Free!

 

[TPC]

Air Ambulance in California

Air Ambulance in California provides services both domestically Internationally, for a free quote please call 1 800 424 9000.

www.airambulance1.com

Wife gets it for everyone.
If the kids bring friends on trips wife put the friends on coverage too. Not just off roading accidents. Accident on the road, sudden appendix burst, all kinda reasons to have it.

Neighbor girl was hemorrhaging and wife had put her on on a previous trip we took months earlier, was still covered and was able to fly her to children's hospital for speciality care.

 

[ArizonaKevin]

about 20 years ago my aunt had to get a helicopter ride out of ocotillo wells for a compound tib/fib, think it cost them about $35k, about 5 years after that my cousin (same immediate family) got a helicopter ride for what they thought was a broken femur, turned out to be a ruptured profunda femoris artery and was a good thing they did helo transport as he probably would have bled out internally in an ambulance. They never got a bill for the second ride, so the running joke has always been that they were running a BOGO deal. Same cousin got another helicopter ride about 5 years ago, think his insurance covered at that point

 

[j21black]

They flew my daughter from one Hospital to another 4 or 5 years ago. Never got a bill for it...I guess my insurance paid.